Waves...smh

[jamcat]

And the UAD versions of both the Studer A800 and the Ampex ATR-102 (not native yet!) are still considered to be the best ports out there (that just ate too much DSP power). AMS/Neve also preferred to collaborate with Universal Audio (also not available in "native" yet).

IK Tape Machine 80 is very close to the UAD Studer A800. If one has the edge, soundwise, it’s IK. However, it takes 3x the CPU per instance.

UAD’s Neve 1073 Preamp-EQ is native. Lindell Audio 80 Series has the edge, I think. Once again, though, very similar in sound.

[masterhiggins]

I personally hope this blows up in their face and they beg users to come back. Subscriptions only make sense for things like music or films or books where you get constant value coming in with new products. I know they add stuff to bundles regularly, but with Spotify I can listen to literally any song or album and there are hundreds of new ones every day. That is an actual value. This doesn't work with audio plugins. I can't believe these are professionals making these decisions.

[serge]

My most used Waves plug is the Cosmos. It’s the only thing that makes sense of my 300k of samples. Any replacements out there? XLN XO sort of, but only for drums. Also, the new StudioVerse looks great for FX chains. They should have released that for free. I would have even paid $29 for it. Maybe even more. StudioVerse becomes more and more valuable with the Waves plug-ins you own. But I wouldn’t pay $15 or $25 per month. I already own every Waves plug-in I need (except for StudioVerse).

[donkey tugger]

Unlike many US states and European countries, the Israeli registrar of companies doesn't allow free downloads of financial accounts and other documents, so can't check their reserves/assets ratios/turnover/profit and loss figures; always illuminating in these cirumstances.

Poor show!

[VitaminD]

Maybe they are just trying to show guaranteed income, through subscriptions, in order to be bought by another interest/company? Prove the company is worth X because we're getting Y income every month.

Probably not but it would at least make sense to why they'd take such a drastic action and not offer single license purchases or WUP alongside the Sub, even for grandfathered accounts/plugins.

[sin night]

So, I started reorganizing my vst plugins (I already did it in Cubase, tomorrow it's the turn of Wavelab) and I moved all the Waves plugins out of their category folders (for example "compressors" or "reverbs") into a brand new "legacy" folder. Most of them actually went into another subfolder of that legacy folder, I kept in the root folder only those that I'm more likely to still use from time to time.

And, let me tell you, it really hurts to see that long list of plugins and knowing they are EOL in my setup because I strongly refuse to buy into any subscription.
I have Platinum (because last time I needed to buy WUP, upgrading to Platinum was slightly cheaper... but I never needed all those plugins, I actually had too many already!) and a few other singles. Now I feel lucky I didn't buy WUP (or upgraded to an even bigger bundle than Platinum) in the last few months when there were some discounts.

Keeping those plugins out of sight in a dedicated subcategory means that I'm less likely to use them (that's part of my phasing out process) and it will remember me to freeze/print them in case I absolutely need to use them (so I don't risk to end up with a broken unfinished session). From now on, none of them will be my first choice for any task, that's for sure.

I'm not happy of Waves decision to force users into subscription... anyway, they made their business choices, so I'm doing mine too. I don't agree with their new business conditions, so I will spend my money elsewhere, simple as that.

[seangm]

I think of all the companies that have devalued their IP, GForce is perhaps the saddest. They could have chosen to improve their flagship product, but instead they gave a huge middle finger to their existing customer base and released a largely overlapping product with no consideration for the users who put them on the map. Meanwhile, the flagship product languishes with a GUI that looks like a 1990s website.

But GForce stuff does sound damn good even if it looks like an early myspace page

[mothra]

Get the Brainworx SSL 4000 E channel. It’s just as good. It just doesn’t have quite as much preamp gain.

Pay once and be done. Get the Townhouse compressor and the Lindell Audio 50 series, and be done with Waves forever.

Have all of those, used them for a year or two but went back to the Waves ones in the end.
I'll definitely have to give them a revisit now. Lately for some reason I decided to start using the actual SSL channel strip and bus compressor on things, so I may just end up swapping those out with the 'real' ones. Not the same as the old E emulation, and the input gain is my favorite part about it, but they work at least. I got those for cheap awhile back and for some reason just let them sit there. I do use the Townhouse here and there in place of the SSL though. For some tracks it just hits the right way.

[MogwaiBoy]

So, I started reorganizing my vst plugins (I already did it in Cubase, tomorrow it's the turn of Wavelab) and I moved all the Waves plugins out of their category folders (for example "compressors" or "reverbs") into a brand new "legacy" folder. Most of them actually went into another subfolder of that legacy folder, I kept in the root folder only those that I'm more likely to still use from time to time.

And, let me tell you, it really hurts to see that long list of plugins and knowing they are EOL in my setup because I strongly refuse to buy into any subscription.
I have Platinum (because last time I needed to buy WUP, upgrading to Platinum was slightly cheaper... but I never needed all those plugins, I actually had too many already!) and a few other singles. Now I feel lucky I didn't buy WUP (or upgraded to an even bigger bundle than Platinum) in the last few months when there were some discounts.

Keeping those plugins out of sight in a dedicated subcategory means that I'm less likely to use them (that's part of my phasing out process) and it will remember me to freeze/print them in case I absolutely need to use them (so I don't risk to end up with a broken unfinished session). From now on, none of them will be my first choice for any task, that's for sure.

I'm not happy of Waves decision to force users into subscription... anyway, they made their business choices, so I'm doing mine too. I don't agree with their new business conditions, so I will spend my money elsewhere, simple as that.

I'm bypassing a legacy folder and sent them straight to the Windows Recycle Bin - get some drive space back.

I quiet quit Waves a few years ago over the WUP nonsense (and after having a hard drive crash, with Waves being the only ones I couldn't recover easily, I was put off) anyway so have already stopped using their stuff.

There's a bunch of music I want to go back and remix/remaster at some point, and I'm sure they will have sprinkles of Waves plugins that won't be found - I'll just find alternatives as I need to - it's a good opportunity to rethink some of those Waves-centric plugin choices anyway.

Waves were no friend to me the last few years - now they are eff'ing DEAD to me

[Compyfox]

And the UAD versions of both the Studer A800 and the Ampex ATR-102 (not native yet!) are still considered to be the best ports out there (that just ate too much DSP power). AMS/Neve also preferred to collaborate with Universal Audio (also not available in "native" yet).

IK Tape Machine 80 is very close to the UAD Studer A800. If one has the edge, soundwise, it’s IK. However, it takes 3x the CPU per instance.

UAD’s Neve 1073 Preamp-EQ is native. Lindell Audio 80 Series has the edge, I think. Once again, though, very similar in sound.

I own and use plenty of Neve plugins at this point.

To me it's not "what is the best" or "what has the edge" (what does that even mean in this case?!). You can't compared analog devices with each other anyway, since no analog device with up to 15% tolerances in terms of certain spare parts (condensers/resistors) do result in a "unique sound". This is why there were endless debates in the mid/late 2000s as to "who had the best emulation". To me, it's the usability in general (does it work like the hardware? e.g. stepped filters), and plugins being up-to-date. Something that IK Multimedia has proven to be able to maintain - free of charge (unless you wanted new features in a new T-Racks version). Lindell Audio was a bit lacking behind, but lo and behold... everything Lindell was updated on 21-MAR-2023 (finally, if I may add!).


You can't compare the Studer A80 with the A800 either. Not only are they different revisions, therefore different recording/playback heads, different tape speed, "headbump" and calibration modules were different. The A80 can be considered the "older yet smaller" brother (with 15ips/30ips), while the A800 was the "mere weeks younger, but tape colossus" (with 7,5ips/15ips/30ips). It's even more different for the Ampex tape machines.

The thing that annoys me, is that the Studer J37 (Waves) is a bit of a special machine, including tape formulas that are not the go-to with other plugins. Granted, there are other Studer-like VST plugins on the market. But the "character" is, funny enough, not the same. Then again... since I've never really had full access to "UAD Oxide" until now, and I somewhat forgot that Black Rooster Magnetite is a thing... time for more testing/comparisons. And before anybody mentions Kiive Audio -- completely different tape machine yet again.



The KVR Developer Challege 2023 will be interesting. Chances are, we might see... er... "spiritual successors" or some stuff that is not basically "abandoned" unless you invest in a subscription.

[bermudagold]

that's why its interesting companies like GForce have decided to ignore the market manipulation and refuse to devalue their IP...it will be interesting to see how that works out

I think of all the companies that have devalued their IP, GForce is perhaps the saddest. They could have chosen to improve their flagship product, but instead they gave a huge middle finger to their existing customer base and released a largely overlapping product with no consideration for the users who put them on the map. Meanwhile, the flagship product languishes with a GUI that looks like a 1990s website.

Now, Spectrasonics on the other hand, has continued to maintain the value of their software by exceeding customer and industry expectations virtually every time.

I'm not a customer of gforce or spectra, so I can't speak on the reality once you begin to peel the onion,...but you make a good point...it will be interesting to see what differentiators real or imagined will be required to maintain what will be considered premium pricing in the race to the bottom...and who will survive such a race...and what percentage will be able to avoid the seduction of stable cash flows and business planning that subscription brings...

that threat is real...just check you circle of influence to see how many people have actually bought records in the last few years...total U.S. album sales for the year fell by 8.2%...digital track sales declined for the 10th consecutive year, falling 25% in 2022. And for the first time since 2004, no song sold more than 500,000 downloads in a calendar year...imagine not a single song even went gold!...the vast majority of consumption is subscription...

43% of all albums sold in 2022 were vinyl LPs, more than CDs, with a 28% increase in cassette sales...another example that consumer psychology is different in fundamental ways...similarly, the current plugin market appears to be driven by the hivemind and hypemachine of collecting plugins like baseball cards, and playing with dsp like video games...both perfectly fine hobbies, but fundamentally different impetuses for purchases and therefore create fundamentally different market forces; than being serious about music...which the previous environment's barriers to entry unfortunately demanded the dominant market demographic be...lots of change afoot

[Loudness_Contour]

Bad move from Waves… but the good news is they’ll stop spamming us with their annoying $29.99 per plugin sales!

I just unsubscribed from their newsletter so I never hear back from them again. Done!

[dayjob]

I just unsubscribed from their newsletter so I never hear back from them again. Done!

this was my first move after getting their email about subscription only.

[Loudness_Contour]

The more I think about it, this could be a big marketing move to make everyone rant about Waves, and then they’ll "change their mind" to make it look like they truly listen to their customers, and generate more sales.

[ghettosynth]

The more I think about it, this could be a big marketing move to make everyone rant about Waves, and then they’ll "change their mind" to make it look like they truly listen to their customers, and generate more sales.

That won't work. Rolling back their WUP decision will generate short term revenue, but any trust that was there is now gone.