KVR Audio

adamtrance · Post by **adamtrance** » Thu Jun 08, 2023 11:59 am

tripleflows wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 11:42 am Can someone show an audio / video sample how the famous Overture CK dreamy Virus B / C pad program sounds from Viper?

Already been done long time ago, check at 4:06

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYAKP0FLvmA

tripleflows · Post by **tripleflows** » Fri Jun 09, 2023 12:03 am

Great indeed!
What else left from TI to emulate, besides the Complex oscillator modes?

elronat · Post by **elronat** » Fri Jun 09, 2023 1:25 am

In direct comparison, it should be almost feature complete by now, apart from the complex modes and some minor FX features like some missing Reverb and character modes which are implemented in the Virus.

Hopefully Adam is implementing the complex modes soon.

adamtrance · Post by **adamtrance** » Fri Jun 09, 2023 1:29 am

Yes a couple effects are still missing, but I didnt find them that urgent as you can use a gazillion of 3rd party vsts to replace them with. The complex grain/formant oscillators could be simulated btw, it is explained in Ollie Musics tutorial video

elronat · Post by **elronat** » Fri Jun 09, 2023 1:37 am

adamtrance wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 1:29 am The complex grain/formant oscillators could be simulated btw, it is explained in Ollie Musics tutorial video

Absolutely, but you have to use the two oscillators at the same time to archive the sound, which the Virus archives with just one.

Caine123 · Post by **Caine123** » Fri Jun 09, 2023 1:38 am

this is an awesome vst, so far also rock solid! thx adam, i also bought it full price

tripleflows · Post by **tripleflows** » Fri Jun 09, 2023 1:40 am

adamtrance wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 1:29 am The complex grain/formant oscillators could be simulated btw, it is explained in Ollie Musics tutorial video

But it seems that method uses an additional osc and modulation matrix slots.
Would be great to have those complex modes as well.

dionenoid · Post by **dionenoid** » Fri Jun 09, 2023 12:55 pm

Anyone else having issues with pitchwheel, modulation and midi learn not working ?

Apart from the usual huge list of bugs so far with this version (a lot of bugs that were also in previous versions btw) i want to know if this can be resolved some way.

HcDoom · Post by **HcDoom** » Fri Jun 09, 2023 3:27 pm

Which bugs did you encounter?

adamtrance · Post by **adamtrance** » Sat Jun 10, 2023 2:12 am

dionenoid wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 12:55 pm Anyone else having issues with pitchwheel, modulation and midi learn not working ?

Apart from the usual huge list of bugs so far with this version (a lot of bugs that were also in previous versions btw) i want to know if this can be resolved some way.

Midi CC does not work with the VST3 version yet, because Steinberg removed it from their VST3 specification, so I have to wait until a hack is found to bring it back. It works perfectly fine in VST2 however.

Which huge list of bugs are you referring to?

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Sat Jun 10, 2023 2:32 am

adamtrance wrote: ↑Sat Jun 10, 2023 2:12 am
dionenoid wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 12:55 pm Anyone else having issues with pitchwheel, modulation and midi learn not working ?

Apart from the usual huge list of bugs so far with this version (a lot of bugs that were also in previous versions btw) i want to know if this can be resolved some way.
Midi CC does not work with the VST3 version yet, because Steinberg removed it from their VST3 specification, so I have to wait until a hack is found to bring it back.

There are definitely workarounds though, as shown by the many, many synths which do have pitchwheel, modulation and MIDI learn support in the VST3's. Actually, the only synth I own which does not have MIDI learn in the VST3 version is Spire, and, they work on it at the moment.

Also, it looks like there actually is a class for that in the VST3 SDK. Not sure if there are any downsides with it: https://steinbergmedia.github.io/vst3_d ... Learn.html And, of course, I have no idea how Flowstone handles all that.

Ex Machina · Post by **Ex Machina** » Sat Jun 10, 2023 6:02 am

adamtrance wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 11:59 am
tripleflows wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 11:42 am Can someone show an audio / video sample how the famous Overture CK dreamy Virus B / C pad program sounds from Viper?
Already been done long time ago, check at 4:06

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYAKP0FLvmA

It's remarkable how close Viper sounds to a Virus. It also shows how the Virus is a great sounding synth that is still relevant today.

Even if there was an Apple Silicon version of Viper, I would probably keep my Virus TI2 keyboard. The synth keybed is one of the best I have ever played making the Virus an excellent keyboard controller. Plus, it just looks so damn cool. It really is a beauty. I also love the fact that I can set a couple of hardware synth programmers on the right side of the Virus.

dionenoid · Post by **dionenoid** » Sat Jun 10, 2023 6:12 am

adamtrance wrote: ↑Sat Jun 10, 2023 2:12 am
dionenoid wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 12:55 pm Anyone else having issues with pitchwheel, modulation and midi learn not working ?

Apart from the usual huge list of bugs so far with this version (a lot of bugs that were also in previous versions btw) i want to know if this can be resolved some way.
Midi CC does not work with the VST3 version yet, because Steinberg removed it from their VST3 specification, so I have to wait until a hack is found to bring it back. It works perfectly fine in VST2 however.

Which huge list of bugs are you referring to?

I'm sorry, but that is simply not true. In fact, midi support in vst3 is far superior to vst2, there's lots of documentation and knowledge about this by now.

I work with vst3 for many years, and there is no synth that doesn't have these basic things. Most synths that migrated to vst3 actually got much better midi implementation for the user, solving a lot of things that are still issues with Viper. Like for example zipper noises when automating/midi controlling, parameter values not corresponding with daw, arps not playing first notes correctly, midi timing issues in some cases, and so on.

I understand that Viper is made with Flowstone, so i guess that the limitations of vst3 are more a case of their poor implementation than vst3 itself. But i'm no dev, maybe you could ask devs who did succesfully migrate to vst3 (and included a lot of improvements on the way) about their experiences.

About the other issues : I have to test more, but some of these issues have already been posted i see. I only installed the vst3 of the latest update, will install vst2 also for comparison. And i can live with many of these quirks, but midi not working is just ridiculous.

adamtrance · Post by **adamtrance** » Sun Jun 11, 2023 2:02 am

You just mentioned that you are no developer, so you probably didnt read this yet: https://forums.steinberg.net/t/vst3-and ... all/201879

Lots of devs had issued with VST3 and Midi as you can read through that thread. If you use a VST3 plugin which has midi they used some hacks or something to get it working, but I dont know, I dont understand the VST SDK, I can only use codes that are available in FlowStone. I will ofcourse try to help the dev as much as I can so they can add it. I obviously had two choice: hold back the VST3 version until midi is implemented properly (and when will that happen?) or release the VST3 now and let people play with it already. Which is better?

You also mention issues with zipper noise, Viper has parameter smoothing inside so I dont know what you did to get zipper noises

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Sun Jun 11, 2023 2:10 am

adamtrance wrote: ↑Sun Jun 11, 2023 2:02 am Lots of devs had issued with VST3 and Midi as you can read through that thread. If you use a VST3 plugin which has midi they used some hacks or something to get it working

Or... they use the class from the VST3 SDK I linked to above, which provides MIDI learn functionality for VST3's.

Again, I don't know how Flowstone handles all this.

I have no horse in this race, as I don't even own Viper, just saying that it's possible in VST3, out of the box.

Viper｜1.2.0 update with VST3 and Grain & Formant oscillators