Where is Cubase 12.5 or 13? [Update: It's here C13 is released!]

[billcarroll]

It's curious how tastes differ. I much prefer the new look, especially seeing it in context:

Agree, love the new look.

[billcarroll]

I hope not. Automation Lanes and Piano Roll in Ableton to me is a PITA and the biggest reason why I don't use it (and I got a Live Suite license laying around collecting dust).

I think their automation lanes are fine.

I agree with you that generally speaking the Piano Roll in Ableton does suck compared to most DAWs out there, but it does do some things right. Like it has range select! Which I'm glad to see coming in Cubase 13 because honestly the way you have to copy and paste midi notes in Cubase is terrible.

But the automation lanes are way better in Ableton. If I want to get a clean automation lane in Ableton all I have to do is click on the parameter I want to automate, and wala! In Cubase if I want a clean automation lane I have to click the write button, start playback, click the parameter I want to automate, stop playback, then Ctrl+z to undo what it just wrote. It makes zero sense, and harder than basically any DAW I've ever used. It's very annoying.

RANGE TOOL: now in Key Editor

This should solve the note copy paste issue in the key editor so you can copy and paste a range, like in Ableton Live

[bysbox1]

I hope not. Automation Lanes and Piano Roll in Ableton to me is a PITA and the biggest reason why I don't use it (and I got a Live Suite license laying around collecting dust).

I think their automation lanes are fine.

I agree with you that generally speaking the Piano Roll in Ableton does suck compared to most DAWs out there, but it does do some things right. Like it has range select! Which I'm glad to see coming in Cubase 13 because honestly the way you have to copy and paste midi notes in Cubase is terrible.

But the automation lanes are way better in Ableton. If I want to get a clean automation lane in Ableton all I have to do is click on the parameter I want to automate, and wala! In Cubase if I want a clean automation lane I have to click the write button, start playback, click the parameter I want to automate, stop playback, then Ctrl+z to undo what it just wrote. It makes zero sense, and harder than basically any DAW I've ever used. It's very annoying.

As far as automation we'll have to agree to disagree. It may be a Mac thing with automation lanes, but it's so buggy and fidgety in Ableton (On MacOS). I just stopped using automation until the last minute in mixing. While not perfect, I like Cubase's implementation much better.

[Scotty]

I want to record instruments direct to audio inputs without sending or routing through groups,

[chk071]

I want to record instruments direct to audio inputs without sending or routing through groups,

In Artist and Elements, it's not possible at all, IIRC...

[Sahul]

Jan. 19, 2022 - official statement:

https://helpcenter.steinberg.de/hc/en-u ... scontinued

:....Moreover, within the next 24 months, Steinberg's host applications and plug-ins across macOS and Windows will offer VST 3 compatibility only...."

I've got three vst2 left. everything else is vst3. The one I'm most nervous about is impOSCar2 which is due to be updated. I hope they hurry up.

Leave all anxieties aside...
1. Cubase 12 will keep working the same if you update (it doesn't get uninstalled/replaced)
2. try to hold off updating straight away, see what others are saying - difficult one I know...!

What surprises me is that, at this point, and knowing in advance that Steinberg would remove VST2 support in two years, still a transparent VST2>VST3 wrapper hasn't been released by any third-party developer.

There is one. Blue Cat Audio Patchwork. It has a bunch of functionality and does chains as well. Pretty good product.

I've been testing Patchwork a lot. It' a great plugin chainer and can be a good solution to use VST2 plugins as VST3 (also Kushview Element is), but they are not exactly wrappers in the sense that jBridge was.

[dellboy]

I want to record instruments direct to audio inputs without sending or routing through groups,

By "instruments",do you mean internal VST instruments? Or external hardware synth instruments?

[kritikon]

I hope not. Automation Lanes and Piano Roll in Ableton to me is a PITA and the biggest reason why I don't use it (and I got a Live Suite license laying around collecting dust).

I think their automation lanes are fine.

I agree with you that generally speaking the Piano Roll in Ableton does suck compared to most DAWs out there, but it does do some things right. Like it has range select! Which I'm glad to see coming in Cubase 13 because honestly the way you have to copy and paste midi notes in Cubase is terrible.

But the automation lanes are way better in Ableton. If I want to get a clean automation lane in Ableton all I have to do is click on the parameter I want to automate, and wala! In Cubase if I want a clean automation lane I have to click the write button, start playback, click the parameter I want to automate, stop playback, then Ctrl+z to undo what it just wrote. It makes zero sense, and harder than basically any DAW I've ever used. It's very annoying.

Agreed. Automation in Cubase could be improved in so many ways. It's so convoluted from new, though OK for existing automation. I generally try to find ways of controlling softsynths via cc/wheels etc rather than automation just because of the PITAness of setting it up. Too many steps involved. Any hints of then bettering automation in 13?

[jancivil]

Cubase automation suits me, although it was a little bit more hassle with instruments plugged directly into it; see, I've hosted >99% of instruments in VE Pro for... most of my time doing this stuff. I had to do it the old way because my first full composition/production this year relied on Absynth in its first stage, which in VE Pro at the time was impossible at least with my patches, one note brought the system to its knees. In for a penny in for a pound, I just didn't bother with VE Pro. And Absynth 5 performed great on my M1 Mac. Now for the first time the project is all Silicon with VE Pro and it's a relief (I actually find it relaxing or meditative to set it up) to have that back (obv if I go with Absynth it's Rosetta time).
That project had 24 instruments plugged in, which for me is not terribly massive but the project looks ridiculous. IE: with VE Pro I have 1-4 instruments with 1-4 stereo channels each as far as Cubase is concerned (Submixes, I like that mixer's visual far better).

To me *automation* = Host Automation and it's all points drawn in lanes; whatever I have VE Pro learn shows up immediately in Cubase with the actual plugin & parameter names. I call CC or the other MIDI control "CC" [or Pitch Bend, et al] and it's in Key Editor because I want to see the curves of instruments' control specifically in there.
I bought a controller once which I figured should have been assignable to these (Generic or Mackie Universal paradigm), but it didn't work. NanoControl 2 or something by Korg. Shopping for these things is too boring, and I'm not sure 'tactility' would amount to real improvement, all things considered. I did like a controller for MIDI.

[jancivil]

I want to record instruments direct to audio inputs without sending or routing through groups,

There's one or two things that occur to me immediately that this really has needed to be the case since the beginning (besides that it's basically wacky to require a group like that, and was never not outdated). I mean the 'generators' in Reaktor like Space Drone or Metaphysical Function, which otherwise has no function in a project. Weird how we get used to an absurdity like this.

[Trensharo]

They also modernized some parts that still remained from the Cubase SX era, such as the upper Inspector area.

Mmmmhhh, well, I think the left side looks better. The content is easier
to grasp and is easier on the eye.

Am I the only one who feels this way?

I agree.

I totally disagree.

1. Tab Header Text is cut off
2. The font is clearly not as good
3. Button sizing is more optimized in the new version (most are smaller in the current version)
4. There is a better set of functions exposed in the new version.
5. Fields for Adjusting Volume, Panning and Offset are clearly superior in the new version: Wider Sizing (easier to make smaller adjustments), Better Font, Better Contrast, Better Adjustment Handles, etc.

I am sure there are people who will like the old version better, as is usually the case. There always exists some contrarians that have to disagree with any change made in an application.

Objectively, the new version is clearly superior from both a usability and ergonomics standpoint.

In Cubase 12, there are too many clashing design languages just in the Inspector alone. It's actually amazing that they allowed this to persist so long, considering how obvious it is.

And while some people bemoan the "trend" of flatness, overuse of high contrasting elements all over an application UI tends to put people off, as they find it very distracting. There are more effective ways to introduce contrast than faux bevels, faux shine, etc. If all that stuff were better, I doubt we'd see so many developers moving into that direction. Why give up a perfectly legitimate selling point (and I mean selling point for a factorable number of people, not a dozen KVR Forum posters ).

[enroe]

Objectively, the new version is clearly superior from both a usability and ergonomics standpoint.

No, no - you may argue about fashions and visuall integrity. But all that is NOT the point.

The important point is another: If you step back and then take a quick look at the track
inspector, you will notice: The individual elements can be perceived much more quickly
by the eye - and are more clearly distinguishable from each other. When working quickly,
the brain is less concerned with registering individual buttons - and can concentrate
more and better on the song itself.

This is exactly a question of visual ergonomics. And that's where Cubase is now taking a
step back. OK - they also take a step back with VST2. I think the motto now is: “One step
back”! "We're getting EVEN worse now!"

[bysbox1]

I've been testing Patchwork a lot. It' a great plugin chainer and can be a good solution to use VST2 plugins as VST3 (also Kushview Element is), but they are not exactly wrappers in the sense that jBridge was.

I won't have a weird feeling we may not see a vst2 wrapper like jbridge. The defacto answer seems to be to run Cubase (or any other DAW) in rosetta mode. But we'll see.

2 other sleepers are DDMF Metaplugin and Superplugin. The great thing about both of those it they let you run any plugin in with oversampling.

[Sahul]

2 other sleepers are DDMF Metaplugin and Superplugin. The great thing about both of those it they let you run any plugin in with oversampling.

Never had much success while testing both DDMF plugins. For some reason, they refused to work correctly in my Windows 11 computer with Cubase 12. However, Kushview Element is the one I'd recommend at this point. It's currently being actively developed again after some months of pause, and it also features oversampling.

[chk071]

I really wonder how these accidents like the one on Steinberg's Cubase websites happen. One of the web designers tests something, and then accidentally puts the page online, and accidentally leaves it there?

Isn't that how leaks usually work? You just "accidentally" leak infos on your site, or an employee "accidentally" gives the infos to an influencer?

Crazy times we live in. Where a rudimentary piece of info is deliberately leaked, and everyone can guess when the release date is, and what will be in the package. I rather preferred hard info on the day of release, but, I guess that's how people roll these days. Mystery and guesswork.