What's that one synth that you find never sounds bad?

[EnGee]

Yes, the lack of preset management is annoying but the VST2 version at least lets Studio One see the presets, so you can change them from the instrument toolbar.

Thank you for the hint. I opened in S1 and did see the presets

Well, I think I understand what you mean now. Indeed, some presets with little or no tweaks can sound and inspire full songs! Thanks for mentioning this one. It is a keeper. I might buy it in the future, but I need to read the manual and/or see what these Russian words mean (I had the chance to learn Russian when I was young, but I didn't! I like it still, but don't know if I have the time to learn another language these days. Well, if I sacrifice some computer gaming, I can learn several useful things instead ) Sorry! way off topic!

[sQeetz]

give me something that feels like play, not like work.

But music production is work. If it's not, then you are doing it wrong.

If it feels like work, then you are doing it wrong.
Let me put another way: If the task of making music feels like a job you dread doing instead of enjoying, then you should look for another job you rather like.

[Seelachsfilet]

give me something that feels like play, not like work.

But music production is work. If it's not, then you are doing it wrong.

[EnGee]

give me something that feels like play, not like work.

But music production is work. If it's not, then you are doing it wrong.

I didn't say that!

Actually, I agree with BONES in this. Music making like any craft, needs a lot of work. You of course will like the result, but that doesn't mean it's a walk in the park! It's a hard serious work, whether you like it or not.

[sQeetz]

But working at something you have fun doing does not equal working on stuff you hate doing.
If making music tends to be the latter, then you're doing something wrong.

I don't equate working on stuff to stuff I don't like to do. Of course you have to work on stuff to make your music. But that's not "work" to me

[EnGee]

Sure, but I don't think BONES hates make music! I think he loves it. This is the point, you are not required to like what you do (in any profession), but it's required you complete it the best you can. Of course, sometimes you enjoy doing it whatever it's hard, but still you need to press on yourself many times to finish what you are working on time.
Luckily, music making is a hobby to me, so I'm more than relaxed and can choose whatever I want without restrictions. Most professionals don't have such freedom and relaxing times.

[sQeetz]

Luckily, music making is a hobby to me, so I'm more than relaxed and can choose whatever I want without restrictions. Most professionals don't have such freedom and relaxing times.

It's work for them like it is work for me to fix electrical gadgets (my profession)... You still enjoy somehow doing it.
But I get your point. It feels like "work" if it's something you have to force yourself to do it because you have no joy in doing it. And that's what I get across from BONES'. He does not enjoy anything about the process. For him everything is "work".

EDIT: after re-reading your post it's actually exactly what you wrote in other words

[funky lime]

I think that is a problem with your brain more than with the synths. I find the exact opposite - after 25+ years of battling with hardware, softsynths are an absolute joy to work with. The immediacy is so much better, the ease-of use when compared to hardware is light years ahead and for the price of a basic hardware synth, I can have a folder full of softsynths. I do all the patching with my hardware using the VSTi editors/librarians, I never touch the front panel controls. If a hardware synth doesn't come with a VSTi, then I won't even consider it. It's way too much hassle for no benefit.

good for you, man. i wasn't talking about hardware synths. don't believe i ever mentioned it once. yeah my brain sucks, thanks for telling me.

But music production is work. If it's not, then you are doing it wrong.

you seem awfully insistent, both in this thread and in others, that i am (and others are) doing music "wrong" (you also called me as a talentless leech recently, so i hope you understand that i don't really hold much respect for your opinions anymore, but maybe that's beside the point). it's very predictable by now and it has gotten old very quickly.

Except it doesn't, not even close. You have to find somewhere to put it, you need multiple cables to connect it up to power and your audio set-up. If you have more than one, then you need a mixer and all these things create multiple points of failure, so you spend an inordinate amount of time and money replacing cables and chasing down hum/noise and all the rest of that shit that gets in the way of any fun you might be looking to extract. It's all so f**king annoying compared to firing up a softsynth and playing.

i'm not into hardware synths. i have one and almost never use it. i wasn't talking about hardware synths at all. it feels as though you're just being contrarian for the sake of it.

[Examigan]

I love the Sub Phatty which I happen to own, but didn't mention it till now. It sounds really good!

[BONES]

Well, I think I understand what you mean now. Indeed, some presets with little or no tweaks can sound and inspire full songs! Thanks for mentioning this one. It is a keeper. I might buy it in the future, but I need to read the manual and/or see what these Russian words mean (I had the chance to learn Russian when I was young, but I didn't! ..)

Don't worry, if you click on the little bow-tie icon on the left edge of the UI, you'll get English labels.

Let me put another way: If the task of making music feels like a job you dread doing instead of enjoying, then you should look for another job you rather like.

All well and good, except we need songs to perform and releasing albums is a great marketing tool to get people to your gigs. So, like answering inane questions for interviews or dealing with venue managers to book gigs and doing ads and keeping on top of social media and all the rest of the crap that gets us up on stage, production is a necessary evil, a means to an end. We do it because it needs to be done so that we can do the part of it that we do actually enjoy.

I always hated being in the studio. I used to think it was because it cost me so much money but I've come to realise that it's just not a part of the process I enjoy. I think that's because, like a lot of mundane jobs, it's not really hard but it takes a lot of time and you have to do it properly or you're just wasting that time.

But working at something you have fun doing does not equal working on stuff you hate doing.

Of course not but what enjoyment is there in production? It's the mundane, hard work part of the process. I'd equate it to all the paperwork you have to do if you run your own business. It's a necessary part of the overall business that you do because it needs to be done, not because there is any pleasure in it.

If making music tends to be the latter, then you're doing something wrong.

Why? Production is a means to an end. I doesn't have to be enjoyable as long as the end result is worth the effort. For us, the end result isn't an album, it's getting to perform on bigger stages to bigger audiences. That doesn't work if your album is shit, so you put as much effort in as it requires.

It's like football or any sport. I used to love playing but I always hated training. But if I didn't go to training and put in a good effort, I wouldn't get to play on Saturday, so I turned up to training diligently and trained hard, because that's what I had to do in order to get to play on the weekend, which was the part I actually enjoyed. In fact, it's likely that the sacrifice made the payoff even more enjoyable so it became doubly worth it. On top of that, I got better as a player because I went to training, which again increased my enjoyment out on the field on the weekend. You can hate the hard work but still see the benefit in it and do it anyway. If you can't then you still have some serious growing up to do.

Of course you have to work on stuff to make your music. But that's not "work" to me

That says to me that maybe you aren't working hard enough on it, that when it gets to being something you no longer enjoy, you move onto the next thing, leaving that bit less than finished.

[sQeetz]

So @BONES you don't like making music, you actually like performing. That's your goal.
You cannot in any circumstance see how someone enjoys the process of getting things ready for performance?
Nerds maybe, who enjoy mixing and making things sound good?

[jancivil]

I've come to take what a lot if not most of us would deem a PITA as a meditation. I enjoy setting up. right now I have a tragic problem that prevents me from my years-old setup and "workflow" which is the exception to my rule. Problem-solving, what's such a drag about it? That's life, you have to get with the program.

For some years I set up the soundstage or aural world - the mood, the landscape or solar system or whatnot - first and I tend to be in no hurry even if I have a strong idea musically coming in. I have other strategies to keep up with that, and not have to for instance get in the piano roll to execute note-ons immediately (ie., modi operandi in sketching quickly). And, you develop a deeper memory, retain a fuller (pre-)image of the music if it's already arriving/in mind. For me when the sound is there, the specific actions become readily apparent.

I do agree with that, people post here all the time about the terrific difficulty in finishing anything; you nailed it, it stops being playtime. what that is is deeper personal systems have yet to be cultivated. CF: the athlete that is fully equipped enjoys proper endurance which means doing regular weight training, no pain/no gain.

[EnGee]

Don't worry, if you click on the little bow-tie icon on the left edge of the UI, you'll get English labels.

Thanks

[Zode]

Honestly the old Massive still sounds great to me

[jamcat]

Pianoteq