What's Ableton up to?

[ohdoubleu]

and while I'm ranting, I still absolutely hate how they just erased the feature where you could just drag down/up while drawing notes to change velocity

Absolutely. It seems minor in theory, but it's definitely one of the many small reasons I'm still on Live 10, despite there being some great features in 11. It really feels like the most efficient way to edit velocity values to me - all from just the mouse and in one gesture - plus 10-15 years of muscle memory are hard to undo!

I remember it coming up on Centercode during the beta but, obviously, to no avail. I do wish that they had a checkbox for the previous behaviour, or even an Options.txt entry...

Are you both totally lost?
You can still do that in Ableton 11

That's possible, I may have missed something since I last checked the Live 11 release notes. The difference, as I recall, is that in 10, if you place a note a keep the mouse button pressed down, moving the cursor up and down changes the velocity of the note and moving the cursor left and right adds more notes on at that velocity on that row - according to the grid size (or changes the length of the note if the grid is disabled). You can still change the velocity of those notes, by moving the cursor up or down, as long as you keep the mouse pressed down. This means that in one click, you can add a row of, say, 16th notes, at any velocity.

In 11, I seem to remember that if you click to add a note and keep the mouse button held down, moving the cursor up and down moves the note up and down the keyboard, and moving it left and right adds notes - either constrained to the row or up and down the keyboard/scale according to an option in preferences. Neither lets change you the velocity in the same gesture.

If you double click with the mouse to add a note, holding the mouse and dragging horizontally will change the note length, dragging vertically adjusts the velocity.

If you are using the pencil tool, if you just click and drag, you are adding notes to different rows and columns you are dragging over. If you click and hold Alt after adding a note, the notes added will be constrained to the same horizontal row, and if you hold Alt+Ctrl after adding a note, dragging up-down will adjust velocity.

Ah, indeed, the behaviour you describe is what I remember from the Live 11 beta. I understand that most of the aspects of the 10 behaviour are still in there somewhere, but the combination of added modifier keys and the shift from vertical movement to horizontal movement to change velocity definitely feels clunky - to me - especially after years of the previous way! There is something elegant about being able to do most of your common programming from just one mouse click.

The 11 way seems adapted to the new scale features and is, understandably, geared towards melodic programming. I guess I tend to program drums more often than melodies/chords, and the previous way - which left one hand free to play keys or tweak parameters - probably leant itself more to that.

[Dalle]

I miss the old drawing behavior too. You could fill a row of notes with a velocity pattern in one click and drag, great for hihats for example. Modifier keys don’t bring that back, they will adjust the velocity of all drawn notest the same time.

Other that that, I’m very happy with Ableton’s development.

[rod_zero]

Do we really have to discuss if Ableton is one of the most popular DAWs? I don't know how there can be any doubt that it's in the top 5 of most popular DAWs out there. It's literally all over the place, wherever you look.

So is FL Studio. Look, when it comes to hip hop (probably the most popular music genre in the world), the majority of producers use FL Studio. At least if you follow hip hop you will know this. Thats not to say Logic, Ableton and others are not also almost equally used. I think the playing field is far closer than what people make it out to be. To say one is above the other based on annual revenue is stupid. You know damn well Ableton made a killing on Push devices, that helped them pump up their numbers. If FL Studio had their own device (not made by a third party) I think their numbers would blow up as well. Im talking about a legit device not the akai fire (you know revenue went to akai), or the FL Key(you know revenue went to Novation)

Thank you very much

America is not "the world"

[machinesworking]

America is not "the world"

Sure, but it's the third most populous country on the planet with the largest economy, with only China coming anywhere close to the GDP of, and even then a distant second. On top of that popular music in the USA is by far the most influential market in the world, that can't even be argued, even if you're a hater.

All of that said, it's entirely likely that only Bollywood music by a tiny margin might be more popular than Hip Hop. Especially considering how many hip hop groups are not from the USA at this point. The main pop star I know from India is Sidhu Moose Wala, hip hop artist.

[rod_zero]

America is not "the world"

Sure, but it's the third most populous country on the planet with the largest economy, with only China coming anywhere close to the GDP of, and even then a distant second. On top of that popular music in the USA is by far the most influential market in the world, that can't even be argued, even if you're a hater.

All of that said, it's entirely likely that only Bollywood music by a tiny margin might be more popular than Hip Hop. Especially considering how many hip hop groups are not from the USA at this point. The main pop star I know from India is Sidhu Moose Wala, hip hop artist.

My comment is more about the USA centric POV, I know it remains a very strong cultural force in the world, but hip hop isn't as big outside of the US, yes, it has scenes in almost every country but they are relatively very small compared to how big is in the USA.

[machinesworking]

My comment is more about the USA centric POV, I know it remains a very strong cultural force in the world, but hip hop isn't as big outside of the US, yes, it has scenes in almost every country but they are relatively very small compared to how big is in the USA.

I literally see semi trucks here in the USA with Sidhu Moose Walas face on the side. Indian immigrants are pretty big on trucking here. IMO you're just being a hater, Russia and the UK, India, all have big hip hop scenes. I don't produce that music, I just recognize it as prevalent as Bollywood music and Euro Disco.

In the bigger picture though if you ignore the genre tweaking everyone does with pop music and consider K-Pop, US pop, R&B, Euro Pop, etc. etc. etc. to be essentially the same thing, then pop music will always be the most popular music.

[vertibration]

To be fair, what is hip hop today? Its really just pop music no? Lots of hip hop today passes as pop music. So I guess if its not true Trap, Boom Bap, and West Coast Rap....its pop

[machinesworking]

To be fair, what is hip hop today? Its really just pop music no? Lots of hip hop today passes as pop music. So I guess if its not true Trap, Boom Bap, and West Coast Rap....its pop

Yeah that's a tough one, the one thing hip hop and industrial share is the fact they get added to other music as flavors and they took on all the other genres, so there's pop, metal, electronic, rock, and dance Industrial, and pretty much the same thing applies to hip hop, there's stuff that sounds like IDM, funk, pop, R&B, dance music etc. etc.

[rod_zero]

My comment is more about the USA centric POV, I know it remains a very strong cultural force in the world, but hip hop isn't as big outside of the US, yes, it has scenes in almost every country but they are relatively very small compared to how big is in the USA.

I literally see semi trucks here in the USA with Sidhu Moose Walas face on the side. Indian immigrants are pretty big on trucking here. IMO you're just being a hater, Russia and the UK, India, all have big hip hop scenes. I don't produce that music, I just recognize it as prevalent as Bollywood music and Euro Disco.

In the bigger picture though if you ignore the genre tweaking everyone does with pop music and consider K-Pop, US pop, R&B, Euro Pop, etc. etc. etc. to be essentially the same thing, then pop music will always be the most popular music.

oh no, I am being a hater for calling out a US centric POV,

[apoclypse]

To be fair, what is hip hop today? Its really just pop music no? Lots of hip hop today passes as pop music. So I guess if its not true Trap, Boom Bap, and West Coast Rap....its pop

Yeah that's a tough one, the one thing hip hop and industrial share is the fact they get added to other music as flavors and they took on all the other genres, so there's pop, metal, electronic, rock, and dance Industrial, and pretty much the same thing applies to hip hop, there's stuff that sounds like IDM, funk, pop, R&B, dance music etc. etc.

A lot of the Kpop stuff is just glossed over hip hop/trap at this point. HipHop is pop music. It made that transition long ago, even if the artist isn't rapping on the record the hip hop sound is in the music itself.

[machinesworking]

A lot of the Kpop stuff is just glossed over hip hop/trap at this point. HipHop is pop music. It made that transition long ago, even if the artist isn't rapping on the record the hip hop sound is in the music itself.

Yep, Hip Hop like Industrial became a flavor you add to other music. I still feel lucky I could witness in real time crossovers like Tackhead (the Sugar Hill Records house band), doing a song gifted to them by Ministry's Al Jourgeson (probably because at the time Ministry's stuff wasn't that hard).

[jules99]

Man oh man, some of you are so out of touch when it comes to what's popular right now, what's popular in non-western countries, and which music software is used.

Keep Vangelisin'

[machinesworking]

Man oh man, some of you are so out of touch when it comes to what's popular right now, what's popular in non-western countries, and which music software is used.

Keep Vangelisin'

It's easy, and always has been, pop music hasn't changed in essence, it's just watered down heavily produced vocal driven versions of whatever genres have struggled to the surface in the last couple years. Pop will always be the most popular music, because people like vanilla. If you think otherwise, then marketing has done it's job, and now you're the target audience.

This brings up another relevant point, why does it matter? Most of us here aren't interested in pop music, what is popular, and becoming the next Taylor Swift. Most of us are well over 30, interested in unpopular genres, and never paid any attention to pop music or cared whether we were in touch with what's popular when we were the target audience in our late teens and early 20's in the first place. Seriously I gave not a rats ass about what music was super popular when I was young, because I had this thing called taste.

That said denying that worldwide pop music to this day has elements of hip hop in it is just a stupefyingly silly take.

[elxsound]

Man oh man, some of you are so out of touch when it comes to what's popular right now, what's popular in non-western countries, and which music software is used.

Keep Vangelisin'

So what is popular then?

My 15 year old nephew has a completely different perspective on music… basically whatever comes up in instagram posts, or whatever comes up in a Spotify playlist. He listens to mostly hip hop, but has no clue who’s who and doesn’t really care. He’s on a basketball team with everyone who likes similar music and per him, no one really cares about the popular aspect of it.

It seems very decentralized and unlike much of what many of us grew up with in determining what’s popular.

And I didn’t know anything about Vangelis, until after several years of posting here.

[? ? ?]

pop music hasn't changed in essence, it's just watered down heavily produced vocal driven versions of whatever genres have struggled to the surface in the last couple years.

Oh god please tell me this isn't true. Grindcore is slowly surfacing more and more. Are you telling me we'll have boy bands singing love songs pig style? I swear I'll become president and push the red button. TWICE.

Pop will always be the most popular music

Pop is short for POPular.

people like vanilla.

I prefer Oreo. Me in between two black chicks.

If you think otherwise, then marketing has done it's job, and now you're the target audience.

Kids are the target audience. Get em while they're young. What do you think being Adult is? It's a fully mind programmed human. It's stupid, hence- A Dolt.
And the best part is we don't care. It's perfect syntax.

Most of us are well over 30

I just turned 21. Again.

Seriously I gave not a rats ass about what music was super popular when I was young, because I had this thing called taste.

Popular music is not bad. Popular music is shoved and that"s imposement which becomes "bad music". I love the Purple Rain era of Prince but holy f**k give it a rest. Way too imposed. But it's genius work nonetheless.