DIVA VST3 attack response to velocity

[ANALOGYES]

Hello all,
I have just switched over to using Diva V 15105 as a VST3 plug-in in BWS V5.1. I am receiving an MP MIDI A2 controller tomorrow - the A2 does not support CLAP.
So, what is happening is this. I am running DIVA as a VST3 using the expressions module in BWS, sending velocity to DIVAs envelope attacks. I can see the faders move, but the sound
plays the attack setting of the previous note. It seems that the velocity message is lagging behind the note. After a little more checking it seems that this may be related only to the attack setting. If I send velocity to the filter or pith mod the response seems correct.
Also what I am seeing is that if I go from a hard velocity to soft the knob will move to a slower attack, but the note will play a fast attack. If I play a soft again the attack will be slow. This is only happening in DIVA VST3.

This works fine using the CLAP version of DIVA, which calls a different instance of the expression module in BWS.
I haven't had time to do checks with other synths yet, but thought I would post this to see if others are experiencing the same thing.
Thanks for reading and any thoughts would be appreciated. Sorry for the double post!
B-

[ANALOGYES]

From PDXINDY over at the Bitwig forum:

Hmmm... a mono patch should work.
Yeah, check with u-he. If it is working with the CLAP version, then it may be a bug with the VST3 version of Diva.
I'm only using the CLAP versions these days, but just tried the VST3 Diva and confirm the issue with modulating env attack.

[tasmaniandevil]

Also what I am seeing is that if I go from a hard velocity to soft the knob will move to a slower attack, but the note will play a fast attack. If I play a soft again the attack will be slow. This is only happening in DIVA VST3.

Not sure if we really can improve this for VST3.
This seems to be a chicken and egg problem, as the attack naturally has to be evaluated the moment the note is being played, so basically at the same moment the velocity data is being received that's supposed to change the attack value.
I don't know how exactly the event evaluation differs between VST3 and CLAP, but it certainly seems to work better in CLAP in this regard.

[Urs]

So in VST3 one only has Parameter Automation, the classic way to change a parameter value through the host interface. We smooth these changes across about 50 milliseconds or so in order to prevent audible zipper noise. So when the change takes hold on the track parameter, chance is that it has already reached the decay stage.

In CLAP you also get Parameter Modulation. These changes are smoothed over something like a single millisecond. Hence, any change happens within the attack time, so it might still affect it.

[ANALOGYES]

Yes, I thought it was something like that going on.
Thanks for the quick response. I'll be getting my MP MIDI A2 controller today. I got it to program DIVA. Been running DIVA exclusively. Thought I had a good thing going.
Two steps forward, One step back. Never-ending...............
B-
Sorry for the duplicate post!!!

[Urs]

I removed the duplicate post, no worries.

For problems like this, I suggest doing the modulation the other way round. Set a long Attack time, then use whatever modulation you have to shorten it.

If you use Velocity, I actually find it more intuitive to have a faster Attack on a faster Velocity and slower Attack on softer play.

[ANALOGYES]

Urs,
Yes, that is how I have been doing it, sorry if I was not clear.
Right now the workaround is going to be a knob on the MP.
Wish it had pedal inputs!
B-

[ANALOGYES]

OK, how about this?
For the VCA mod make a setting for none. Then the knob just becomes a gain adjust,
Then I can assign that to an ENV from bitwig that responds correctly to velocity. I can do that now, setting the VCA mod to gate but get some clicks. Remember this is for a monophonic preset.
Thanks for your time,
B-