Is talent born or created with hard work and practice

[VOODOO U]

Unbelievable. No Donnie Osmond fans.

[Michael L]

Now I wonder how the word for talent, in whatever language, was first used.

talent (n.)

late 13c., "inclination, disposition, will, desire;" c. 1300, "feeling, emotion, passion," senses now obsolete, from Old French talent (12c.), from Medieval Latin talenta, plural of talentum "inclination, leaning, will, desire" (11c.), in classical Latin "balance, weight; sum of money." This is from Greek talanton "a balance, pair of scales," hence "weight, definite weight, anything weighed," and in later times sum of money." It is reconstructed to be from PIE *tele- "to lift, support, weigh," "with derivatives referring to measured weights and thence money and payment"; In Middle English, to have talent was "have resolve, be resolved, have a will or inclination;" talent of being was "survival instinct." To drink (one's) talent was to drink one's fill (late 13c).

An ancient denomination of weight, originally Babylonian (though the name is Greek), and varying widely in value among different peoples and at different times. According to Liddell & Scott, as a monetary sum it was considered to consist of 6,000 drachmae, or, in Attica, 57.75 lbs. of silver. Also borrowed in other Germanic languages and Celtic. It is attested in Old English (talente) in the sense of "ancient unit of weight or monetary sum." The Medieval Latin and common Romanic "will, inclination, desire" sense developed from figurative use of the word in the sense of "money, wealth, riches."

The meaning "gift committed to one for use and improvement" developed by mid-15c., probably mostly from the Parable of the Talents in Matthew 25:14-30. The notion is of something God has granted to one and for which one will render account at the Last Judgment. It may be also in part from or encouraged by the figurative sense of "wealth, treasures, riches."

The general sense of "special natural ability or aptitude" is by c. 1600. The meaning "persons of ability collectively" is attested from 1856. Talent scout is attested by 1936; talent agency is by 1956.

[Dirtgrain]

Not so much the etymology, although that is also worth looking at in this thread--I was just thinking about the first time anyone used a word for the concept, in any language/region/era, in response to kmonkey implying it is somehow wrong for "untalented" (which is probably not fair, but who knows his metrics?) people to define talent and assess it in talented individuals. I think it is likely the case that talented people did not invent the concept to apply it to themselves; therefore, it makes plenty of sense for people kmonkey labels as untalented to discuss the term.

[PatchAdamz]

Every artist was first an amateur.”
― Ralph Waldo Emerson

[Michael L]

I think it is likely the case that talented people did not invent the concept to apply it to themselves

Every artist was first an amateur.”
― Ralph Waldo Emerson

This.
I considered myself "normal" until I won dozens of awards as a writer/ producer. Those awards were determined by knowledgeable members of the public and industry who had to justify their decision for public scrutiny.

I learned from those *surprising* experiences what narrowly specific abilities of mine the public considered to be 'talent.' So, just like 'talent scout' and 'talent agency,' I think talent is a concept based in external recognition, not at all on internal identity.

Which means to me, if you don't make something and get it out in the world for evaluation, you cannot possibly consider yourself to have a particular 'talent.' And thus the role of the knowledgeable 'public' and 'industry' in this thread is to justify why something is a product of a specific talent.

[VOODOO U]

Every artist was first an amateur.”
― Ralph Waldo Emerson

Every walker was first a crawler
- VOODOO U

[jancivil]

I'm never not going to an amateur which actually means 'doing for the love of a thing' before it got turned into a kind of diss for the inexperienced or that. After my teen years I had to get out of the small pond and expose myself to a world where I'm not overrated. My mother, who was probably somewhat surprised I got into conservatory, once phoned my guitar professor who told her I could do anything I want in music but was unsure this should be my focus (classical solo performer). She said she saw me more as a Lee Ritenour. Now, I knew that was overrating my 'gift' as it were.
I agreed with the second part of that soon enough. I don't know what to do with the first bit.
It is kind of encouraging, but I know not to buy into it much. If I don't work at it I atrophy lf.

Once when I was on methadone, I went into the old Merrill's Pharmacy at 7th and Market to peruse the magazine stand. I picked up the latest "Wired" (some month in 1997) to find this album I had been called to help out with (the 'big pieces' were mine, or one was mine with some 'editing' by Brazieal) as the top CD of the year for their reviewer. I thought the album was terrible except for one thing, and its mix was well ruined because Parra cheaped out having Don Falcone (not the Batman villain) rather than let Oliver DiCicco (a genuine genius) mix it, on one of those Roland jobs where you "master" right onto CD they came out with around that time.
it's best not to take one's press too seriously, good or bad. "That's, like, just your opinion, man."

[vurt]

i can't remember the magazine name, but an album i did some bits for, made their top 100 of the year alongside people like weedeater and the legendary pink dots.

[vurt]

my input was minimal, admittedly. im on the liner notes though, so it counts!!!

[VOODOO U]

my input was minimal, admittedly. im on the liner notes though, so it counts!!!

Let me guess, "Special thanks to Vurt for the pizza delivery."

[EdwardGivens]

born or created. Picasso got into art school in a single day - a task that took most people over a year. Cezanne "couldn't draw" (uh-huh) and really wasn't successful until very late in life. Picasso idolized him.

[Anteros]

I believe that it is not one or the other but a combination of both. You can start out with an aptitude for something and a natural spark. However, for that spark to grow it takes a lot of practice, nurturing and dedication. The aptitude can also potentially lead to a higher ceiling.

No matter how hard I practice, I am never going to have the ability or opportunity to become a Major League Baseball player. However, all MLB players have worked very hard to get there.

When it comes to being successful with that talent, the element of luck and outside factors come into play. For example, if a classical musician becomes burnt out of injures their hand while on the verge of success, their success can be delayed temporarily or permanently.

[harryupbabble]

but what is born with no talent and no practice?
jabba the hutt maybe

[Michael L]

but what is born with no talent and no practice?
jabba the hutt maybe

Donald the Trump

[vurt]

but what is born with no talent and no practice?
jabba the hutt maybe

you think it's easy to rise to the top of a galactic crime syndicate? bantha poodo you.