Songwriting - do you limit yourselves?

[soulata]

[...] Arranging is more of an intellectual thing for me. I had to study other songs form, orchestration, ensemble techniques, etc, to get good at it. I think this is key if you're a newbie to arranging, or if you have a specific sound you want to achieve. Once you learn how styles are structures, you start to be able to "control" your arrangements. Everything about the sound you can achieve consciously, without running into brick walls, and thinking "this doesn't flow right," or it needs to be longer," or it's "too repetitive."

Yes. Me too, and I believe strongly that most people need to study it. Maybe there are very few naturals, but most people need to study to understand harmony and the other aspects you mentioned. Although in the end it's still trying things and listening to the results. But there's less trying when you have a bit of background.

--HansM

agreed.

I did a lot of studying and can arrange for bigbands. I think the problem is not in instrumentation as such, but in getting the most of the given 4 bars (or sometimes 8 and a crappy bridge).

What I'm doing now (and would need help at) is face-lifting the turd (but it pays).

I guess it's just so much easier doing my own stuff.

But yeah, if it's 'arranging' just the minimal framework is all that's needed, and then offer and accept ideas from there. I know it's a bitch to do, and it makes me 'feel dirty'... But if there's grubby money involved, slap my ass and call me a whore then! HiHi

exactly

k

[Steven West]

Sounds like jingle work you're doing Soulata? That's a bitch indeed. Were you supplied a melody, or you got to come up with one?

Just say to yourself.... 'zoom - zoom'.

Actually, Toyota had a catchy hook down in umpteen different ways. The melody on it's own is like nothing but two notes emphasising 'I need it, I love, I can't get enough of it' - but it was darn clever who it worked itself out for Toyota.

[soulata]

well, jingles are easy. What I'm doing now is much worse (damn vocals)

k

[Steven West]

So a jingle with a vocal track then? And are the lyrics predifined? Or do you have to come up with the hook line and all?

That's TOUGH indeed - either way. For what it's worth, I would advise to accompany the vocal but not 'punctuate' it per say. If it's 'predefined' that is. The company/agency likes to hear the motto 'stick out' vocally I find. So simple music, vocals, and at worst - harmonies to emphasise the vocals if need be. If you're the one to come up with the vocals and 'motto' for the product, I would go more for the music then. Not saying you can't write good lyrics/hook lines... I just find companies like more 'bravado' to announce and establish a new product. I think that's how it worked for Toyota? It seemed like the first run was musically motivated, and the catch line kinda worked its way up through different permutations.

But all easier said than done, I do agree!