Playbeat 4 by Audiomodern is out -whaddaya think

[seangm]

Playbeat 3 NEVER got MIDI export right. It's a jumbled mess. And now, it's even WORSE on Playlet 4. It boggles the mind that they can't get this right.

I challenge anyone to show the world right here on KVR that this works correctly for you in either PB3 or PB4. I can create a preset in XO, export its MIDI to my DAW, and all the notes show up exactly where they are supposed to be in the exported MIDI sequence. And when I hit play in my DAW, the exported MIDI sequence sound exactly the same as it does when played within XO. Now... try to do that in PB4 or PB3.

Completely agree, midi export never worked on PB3 and I've been messing with PB4 and it's still not working. I'd like to be able to drag and drop to the DAW and have it play back the same exact sequence as in the plugin. Instead the playback sounds like garbled garbage. Almost every other drum plugin lets you do this (UJAM, XO, EZ Drummer, etc.). WTF is up with Audiomodern? Shouldn't they be able to add that functionality given how complex the rest of the plugin is? Seems like midi export should be the easy part.

[cake builder]

Literally the only reason I considered upgrading was because someone said MIDI export was fixed. If it's not, then you just saved me 30 bucks.

[oobesan]

Okay, after much back and forth with Audiomodern about this, this is what I have learned.

Playbeat 4 is not designed to export its MIDI sequences to then be fed back into Playbeat 4 for playback. It literally can’t do this and isn’t designed to do this. Which means, it’s completely different than every other generative sequencer and drum machine that I can think of. Instead, if you want your DAW’s MIDI to trigger Playbeat’s sequences, you have to record/draw in key switches that correspond to the specific sequencer tracks (kick, snare, etc.) into your DAW’s MIDI timeline.

Which is very counterintuitive. Most people who use these types of generative plugins do so in order to stumble upon something musical and unique. Once they have found something special, they want to preserve it by exporting its MIDI into the DAW. But of course, you would still want to make variations to subsequent loops of that MIDI sequence to make it natural and organic. However, you specifically cannot do with Playbeat 4. So, if this is your workflow, you will need to look elsewhere.

So, what exactly is the purpose of the MIDI Export feature in Playbeat 4? Apparently, it is solely meant for for exporting sequences to control external instruments, not Playbeat’s own sounds.

[JiggSaw]

So, what exactly is the purpose of the MIDI Export feature in Playbeat 4? Apparently, it is solely meant for for exporting sequences to control external instruments, not Playbeat’s own sounds.

Yeah... that is me. I don't really care for Playbeat's sounds and the way they organize samples is terrible. Everything is lumped together and there's no categorization among kick, snare, etc. So I would never drag out midi to the Playbeat track.

But it fits my workflow because I use it to drive TRIAZ, XO, AD2, etc. I'm only after the sequencer and pattern generation. I'll handle the actual sounds elsewhere.

[pdxindy]

Literally the only reason I considered upgrading was because someone said MIDI export was fixed. If it's not, then you just saved me 30 bucks.

If your pattern keeps lanes at the same speed and step#, then midi export works as expected.

If you change individual lane length and speed, then midi export does not work correctly.

I keep all the lanes at the same speed and length, so that's why midi export is working for me.

[cake builder]

Okay, after much back and forth with Audiomodern about this, this is what I have learned.

Playbeat 4 is not designed to export its MIDI sequences to then be fed back into Playbeat 4 for playback. It literally can’t do this and isn’t designed to do this.

I have never tried to feed a MIDI pattern generated by Playbeat back into itself. I have only used it to generate patterns for other instruments, but the clips are always bugged. The only way I can use it is to live record the MIDI coming out of Playbeat onto the track of the instrument I want to use it on.

It's a bit frustrating how obtuse Audiomodern have been whenever I have tried to communicate the issue. They just gave up and stopped responding to me.

If your pattern keeps lanes at the same speed and step#, then midi export works as expected.

If you change individual lane length and speed, then midi export does not work correctly.

I keep all the lanes at the same speed and length, so that's why midi export is working for me.

It's crazy to me that they can't get that right. I've exported patterns with mixed lane lengths and speeds from Triaz and Drumcomputer with no issue.

[pdxindy]

If your pattern keeps lanes at the same speed and step#, then midi export works as expected.

If you change individual lane length and speed, then midi export does not work correctly.

I keep all the lanes at the same speed and length, so that's why midi export is working for me.

It's crazy to me that they can't get that right. I've exported patterns with mixed lane lengths and speeds from Triaz and Drumcomputer with no issue.

Yeah, it's a relatively simple thing to correctly export a midi clip that accounts for individual lanes having different step# and speed. It's simple math. Is there a communication problem?

The part that isn't simple, is that an individual lane in Playbeat can set each triggered step to a different pitch. That cannot be exported in a way that most drum machines would work with.

[seangm]

If you select one of the PB4 factory presets and don't change anything with it (lane speed, step #, etc.) and then export the midi to the DAW, it still doesn't play back correctly. So as far as I have seen midi export just doesn't work at all if you try to use it to drive Playbeat. Like someone mentioned above pretty much every other drum plugin has this functionality, strange Audiomodern can't seem to do get that working. I'll just keep exporting the audio stems from the plugin because I like other things about it, but I would prefer being able to export the actual midi sequence for better flexibility.

[cake builder]

Is there a communication problem?

I honestly don't think so, as I provided visual and audio examples of what I was talking about.

The part that isn't simple, is that an individual lane in Playbeat can set each triggered step to a different pitch. That cannot be exported in a way that most drum machines would work with.

This part I understand and I lock the pitch parameter when creating patterns so that is not part of my issue.

[pdxindy]

Instead, if you want your DAW’s MIDI to trigger Playbeat’s sequences, you have to record/draw in key switches that correspond to the specific sequencer tracks (kick, snare, etc.) into your DAW’s MIDI timeline.

Make a midi clip in your DAW and a C3 note selects the first pattern in Playbeat, a C#3 switches to the second pattern, etc.

[kraster]

If you select one of the PB4 factory presets and don't change anything with it (lane speed, step #, etc.) and then export the midi to the DAW, it still doesn't play back correctly. So as far as I have seen midi export just doesn't work at all if you try to use it to drive Playbeat. Like someone mentioned above pretty much every other drum plugin has this functionality, strange Audiomodern can't seem to do get that working. I'll just keep exporting the audio stems from the plugin because I like other things about it, but I would prefer being able to export the actual midi sequence for better flexibility.

I just think the design philosophy of Playbeat is that you if you want to use the sequencer with the internal sounds you make a bank of individual patterns, assign them to the "remix" section and trigger them via midi note.

If you wanted to use exported midi to trigger Playbeat itself then it gets messy because of the pitch parameter.

It would probably involve using either a midi channel per track or using something like pitch bend.

I can see why they left it out, to be honest. Seems very convoluted compared to just triggering the sequences via midi note.

One thing to note is that the notes of the midi drag and drop midi export conform to what is set in the "fixed note output" in the midi output settings.

So you can kind of retrigger Playbeat with its own exported midi if you match Playbeat's oneshot range with the fixed note output settings. By default that's C1-G1.

The problem is that you will lose any pitch information.

[pdxindy]

Like someone mentioned above pretty much every other drum plugin has this functionality, strange Audiomodern can't seem to do get that working.

Playbeat has pitch per step. There is no easy way to export that as midi and have it play correctly. It could be done by exporting each lane as a separate midi channel and then ignoring incoming pitch as a way to define which lane is played and only go by midi channel.

However, this would not work in Ableton Live.

Okay, then you can do it by using MPE and pitch offsets. Except some popular DAW's don't support that.

Then what happens with 2 lanes having the same pitch on the same step? Can all DAW's handle overlapping notes? It's a pain to edit.

[pdxindy]

It would probably involve using either a midi channel per track or using something like pitch bend.

I can see why they left it out, to be honest. Seems very convoluted compared to just triggering the sequences via midi note.

Exactly, and neither of those methods will work across all major DAW due to DAW limitations.

I'd leave it out too.

[pdxindy]

Is there a communication problem?

I honestly don't think so, as I provided visual and audio examples of what I was talking about.

This seems like a simple thing to improve.

I work around it by using the Midi CAP plugin. It is always recording midi so I hit play on PB and then drag the midi from Midi CAP plugin into my DAW.

[seangm]

Is there a communication problem?

I honestly don't think so, as I provided visual and audio examples of what I was talking about.

This seems like a simple thing to improve.

I work around it by using the Midi CAP plugin. It is always recording midi so I hit play on PB and then drag the midi from Midi CAP plugin into my DAW.

I didn't know about the Midi CAP plugin, sounds like a good workaround. I'm going to look into it, thanks.