MuLab 10 working as a VST3 inside Cubase/Nuendo, Bitwig, and Reaper? Other pre-sales questions...

[ionekvr]

Hi guys -- I just saw MuLab 10 was released, and I'm very impressed! Congrats to the dev! I don't know how I missed that it supports working as a VST plugin inside other DAWs. I think that's brilliant!

I am hoping that people have good experiences with MuLab 10 working inside Cubase/Nuendo, Bitwig, and Reaper... specifically acting as a VST3 plugin, since Cubase now only supports VST3. I saw a thread where someone had issues with Cubase sync but it looks like it is resolved? I was surprised this wasn't one of the core test scenarios of the developer and some of the beta testers.

So I wanted to ask folks what their experiences have been using MuLab in the above DAWs -- and honestly any other DAW for that matter. I love the idea of having a "DAW within a DAW" concept where you can create complex sound design workflows that would otherwise not be possible. It could also act as an incredibly elaborate chainer! And of course the idea of moving chunks of self-contained musical ideas from one DAW to another DAW (or video app!) is another workflow I'd be interested in. It's such a neat idea to have that much flexibility, but I wanted to find out how well that kind of workflow is functioning for people in the real world.

In sum, here are some of my questions:

1 - From above -- Does MuLab 10 load up as a VST3 inside Cubase/Nuendo, Bitwig, and Reaper, and how well does it work for that workflow?

2 - Does MuLab 10 now fully support loading third-party VST3 plugins? I saw conflicting points about this in different threads. I thought it supported VST3 but now I'm confused...

3 - How stable is MuLab?

4 - To confirm -- the "MuLab for Life" license means I buy once and get all upgrades for free, for life... including MuLab 10, 11, 12, 13, etc., right? (Seems like a bargain!)

5 - Does MuLab support ripple editing? (see Reaper's various ripple editing modes for example.)

6 - Is there a current promo going on right now, or is that a rare occurrence for MuTools?

Thank you for your responses! Excited to see where MuLab can fit in my projects!

[MuTools]

I am hoping that people have good experiences with MuLab 10 ... specifically acting as a VST3 plugin

MuLab Plugin 10.0 still is a VST2 plugin.
But a VST3 version is planned.

since Cubase now only supports VST3

Cubase 14 still supports VST2 but you have to explicitly enable it.

I saw a thread where someone had issues with Cubase sync but it looks like it is resolved?

Yes indeed it has been resolved, see viewtopic.php?p=9115373#p9115373

Does MuLab 10 now fully support loading third-party VST3 plugins? I saw conflicting points about this in different threads. I thought it supported VST3 but now I'm confused...

Yes MuLab supports hosting VST3 plugins.

At the moment MuLab only supports a single VST3 plugin per .vst3 file, but supporting multiple plugins per .vst3 file is planned.

How stable is MuLab?

Quite stable.
But i think it's up to others to answer this, or up to yourself to stress-test it on your system.

To confirm -- the "MuLab for Life" license means I buy once and get all upgrades for free, for life... including MuLab 10, 11, 12, 13, etc., right? (Seems like a bargain!)

Yes that's correct.
It indeed is a bargain!

5 - Does MuLab support ripple editing? (see Reaper's various ripple editing modes for example.)

No. Moving clips in sync is done by selecting all relevant clips and then move them together.

Is there a current promo going on right now, or is that a rare occurrence for MuTools?

No, MuLab already is low priced, constantly. Hope you agree.
And MuLab not only is a composer DAW, it also is a feature-rich and top-quality synth and effect plugin! So you can use it in many ways. A musical swiss knife

Thanks for your interest in MuLab!
Curious for your experiences.

[ionekvr]

MuLab Plugin 10.0 still is a VST2 plugin.
But a VST3 version is planned.

Thank you for the answers! And congrats again on the new release!

Yes, a VST3 version would be much appreciated. I've converted entirely over to VST3 now for all my plugins -- I don't even install VST2 when I have the option, just to train myself (and reinforce) to get in the habit of just using VST3, since Cubase/Nuendo are my main DAWs, and by Cubase 15 (probably coming out later this year judging by prior releases) it might be mandatory. If I like it or not, I'm all-in on VST3 now.

Do you have an approximate timeframe for the VST3 release?

Cubase 14 still supports VST2 but you have to explicitly enable it.

Yes, but I am trying to explicitly keep that door closed so I don't tempt myself with other VST2 plugins too. It is a slippery slope, and I am trying to run a tight ship.

However, IF it will be a long time before VST3 is supported, I may make an exception on this, due to the very cool workflows I can imagine. I will have to think about that. In any case, the decision would be much easier to make if MuLab was already VST3!

Yes MuLab supports hosting VST3 plugins.

At the moment MuLab only supports a single VST3 plugin per .vst3 file, but supporting multiple plugins per .vst3 file is planned.

Interesting... do you mean multiple instances of the same plugin, or something like multiple plugins per .vst3 file like how the Waves shell approach works? Can you clarify a little more?

MuLab already is low priced, constantly. Hope you agree.
And MuLab not only is a composer DAW, it also is a feature-rich and top-quality synth and effect plugin! So you can use it in many ways. A musical swiss knife

Thanks for your interest in MuLab!
Curious for your experiences.

Yes, sounds good on the other issues (including "MuLab for Life" license concept and price), and yes, it does look like a great swiss army knife! That is precisely why I was attracted to it once I saw that it can be used as a plugin inside another DAW. It's a brilliant idea, opens up so many creative possibilities. One way or another, I assume I'll become a customer, just a question of when TBH. I just have to consider the VST3 release timing as discussed above.

I also need to decide if I want to start with the plugin-only version or get the "for Life" bundle from the beginning with both. (BTW you have a fair upgrade pricing, thank you.)

I don't think I would use the standalone version, as the plugin version fits my imagination right now, BUT who knows, maybe I will want to use both once I get into it. With so many options for different workflows, modular capabilities, plugin hosting, etc., it's kind of a super powered plugin for someone like me who does sound design or for someone who uses several DAWs but wants to easily share self-contained chunks of music/sound ideas between DAWs without using file exchange approaches. I can see many new workflows that would be useful and fun.

Again, kudos for your vision on this and your creativity of developing something so innovative and useful. Glad to finally find out about it!

[MuTools]

Thank you for the answers! And congrats again on the new release!

Thank you!

Do you have an approximate timeframe for the VST3 release?

Not yet.

However, IF it will be a long time before VST3 is supported, I may make an exception on this, due to the very cool workflows I can imagine. I will have to think about that. In any case, the decision would be much easier to make if MuLab was already VST3!

I'd recommend switching VST2 support on, but restrict yourself to only use it for MuLab 10 Plugin.

Interesting... do you mean multiple instances of the same plugin, or something like multiple plugins per .vst3 file like how the Waves shell approach works?

The latter.

BTW you have a fair upgrade pricing, thank you.

I don't think I would use the standalone version, as the plugin version fits my imagination right now, BUT who knows, maybe I will want to use both once I get into it.

Maybe at first one would think MuLab App is the main version and MuLab Plugin auxiliary. But it can be seen the other way too! Imagine you use DAW X as your main DAW and MuLab Plugin as a swiss knife for sub-sequencing, sub-mixing, synths, effects, ...
Now you use MuLab App as the stand-alone version of the plugin so no need to launch your big DAW. MuLab App launches very fast and avoids all the bloat of the big DAW. So in this example MuLab Plugin is main, MuLab App is handy auxiliary.

Again, kudos for your vision on this and your creativity of developing something so innovative and useful. Glad to finally find out about it!

Thank you for your appreciation!

[ionekvr]

Thank you for your great reply, all questions answered for now.

And I will indeed consider the VST2 exception in Cubase/Nuendo 14 as a stop-gap solution... BUT I'll still encourage you to keep moving forward on the VST3 choice, sooner rather than later. Crossing fingers this is not a huge coding obstacle! Obviously you have your own timeline and roadmap, but I would hate to start using MuLab in Cubase 14 now, and then run into a situation with Cubase 15 in the coming months (or 16 next year), for example, and find Steinberg has finally removed VST2 support. That would be frustrating.

(On the other hand, I just had a thought of a potential future workaround... I do technically use DDMF Metaplugin for complex chains, which supports VST2, so I might be able to theoretically load MuLab VST2 inside Metaplugin VST3, which I would then load into Cubase 15/16/etc.... maybe...)

Anyway, let's hopefully not get to that situation... I'd really really want a native VST3 version of MuLab by then if possible!

Thanks again! Will think about this and I already know at some point in the (near) future I'll jump onboard and become a customer! Looking forward to that, and what cool new features you continue to add in the future!

[ionekvr]

Oh, I did think of another question -- how does the license work in terms of the number of computers I own that I can install on, and does the license require internet connection? Thanks!

[MuTools]

how does the license work in terms of the number of computers I own that I can install on

You can use a MuLab User Key on up to 3 computers you own.

and does the license require internet connection?

No.

[solvni_music]

Does Mulab 10 support sidechain from third party plugins ?

[MuTools]

Yes.
See this video:

[tiger001]

Yes.
See this video:

i can't find above video on your YT channel
-the link works fine though

[whyterabbyt]

i can't find above video on your YT channel

That's because its flagged as 'Unlisted' so visible via direct link and playists only.

[MuTools]

i can't find above video on your YT channel

Now you will