Real amps vs modelling and plugin amps

[CapnLockheed]

Cat's and racoons can mate and have ratcat babies.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!! Talk about getting OT!! I bet biology wasn't your strongest subject in HS. Raccoons are more closely related to walruses than they are to cats, there is no way they could interbreed they are too genetically different.

[Uncle E]

Hopefully we can all agree that amp modelers sound a lot better than cats and raccoons mating.

[Naillerz78]

When I was young I tried hard to figure out how Talk Talk played the guitar solos on some of their tracks. Of course, they didn't use a guitar, they used a synth

That’s cool. I think that’s the way to get better as a guitarist tbh. To bust out of the usual guitar scales , positions and chords etc i must get back to trying to that more. I used to play along to EDM and dance music at one point the bands Daft Punk & Air etc to try figure out the chords and melodies on guitar. It’s good practice. And gave me good a funk feel for playing rhythms too.

It's in C sharp minor. An arrangement for guitar would probably have some alterative tuning. I don't think you can play it on the guitar exactly as it is, even on the simple parts the left hand plays octaves, and there are some parts I think would be impossible to play on a guitar as they are written. I have only played it myself on piano though, not on a guitar

That’s the one. C# minor, yeah can’t play it in that key on guitar. Snap I was just gonna say an Alt tuning maybe. For guitar performance it’s transposed to Am I think, but doesn’t sound as good to me. Love that piece it’s like just when you think it can’t get any more depressing and tragic sounding,, it does and then again..! Amazing stuff

I have tried to learn a few classical guitar or harder solo guitar pieces but got stuck halfway usually,
Cavatina by John Williams is one I would love to finish off and really nail it. It gets very hard to memorise in the 2nd half or so,

And Mr Sandman by Chet Atkins is another. So hard!
Tried dabbling with flamenco and Spanish styles in early years but again so much technique in there and massive stretches etc

[YnJ]

The "guitar solos" on the Talk Talk tracks were very simple, basically notes in intervals of 4ths and 5ths played on distorted synths, using the pitch bender with a lot of delay. They sounded great though, and created a really cool atmosphere. It was kind of hard to get the same effect on a guitar. In the end I came close using a bottleneck, so I did learn something useful even if I never managed to replicate the solos completely though

The Cavatina was composed for classical guitar, Stanley Myers composed it btw, the Moonlight Sonata was written for piano. I don't play classical guitar anymore, I kind of lost interest, I tended to stay away from arranged pieces not origininally written for guitar when I did though, as they, in my opinion, never sound as good as played on the instrument they were originally written for. You can probably get sheet music for classical guitar online for free now, almost all of it is probably public domain anyway

[stoopicus]

The "guitar solos" on the Talk Talk tracks were very simple, basically notes in intervals of 4ths and 5ths played on distorted synths, using the pitch bender with a lot of delay. They sounded great though, and created a really cool atmosphere. It was kind of hard to get the same effect on a guitar. In the end I came close using a bottleneck, so I did learn something useful even if I never managed to replicate the solos completely though

Which tracks are we talking about here? Stuff like "Talk Talk" and "Such a Shame"? Or something else?

Their sound varied considerably across their catalog.

[YnJ]

Such a Shame is a good example. I can't recall any other tracks right now, I think they did something similar on a couple more tracks though

[Magic Russ]

Or then there are the ones more like "I Don't Believe In You" which is a basic overdriven guitar with a fair amount of delay and reverb, with a couple of staccato notes and slow bends. Add a warbly chorus and you get "Life's What You Make It"

[Uncle E]

When I was young I tried hard to figure out how Talk Talk played the guitar solos on some of their tracks. Of course, they didn't use a guitar, they used a synth

Including the solo on Life's What You Make It? I don't know much about them but that sounds like a real guitar to me.

[Naillerz78]

The Cavatina was composed for classical guitar, Stanley Myers composed it btw, the Moonlight Sonata was written for piano. I don't play classical guitar anymore, I kind of lost interest, I tended to stay away from arranged pieces not origininally written for guitar when I did though, as they, in my opinion, never sound as good as played on the instrument they were originally written for. You can probably get sheet music for classical guitar online for free now, almost all of it is probably public domain anyway

My bad. Yep it was Myers but played by John Williams afaik. The famous guitar OST version anyway. Beautiful tune.

I have it printed out somewhere, an ‘offical’ tab version in a collection of guitar lesson stuff someplace. The problem I had was with memorisation of sections . The shapes were so strange and I have no reference to them re chords.
There’s a climbing piece in the middle and it’s fantastic but complex moves, dunno how I’d memorise it tbh. I don’t read music btw if you meant that. Never learned unfortunately much to my dismay now with my old man memory fades.

Interestingly tho, re memory I watched a great doco on Glen Campbell a few years ago. He had dementia and quite advanced , he couldn’t know from pictures and home videos who his kids were or ex wife etc.. but he could perform and shred guitar and remember the music perfectly (!)
Fantastic doco

Maybe when I’m an old man I’ll still be ripping out Led Zeppelin on guitar haha. Hopefully!

[YnJ]

Including the solo on Life's What You Make It? I don't know much about them but that sounds like a real guitar to me

That's because it is. They used both acoustic and electric guitars in addition to synths. On a few tracks they would use a guitar sounding synth instead though, which at least I personally mistook for a guitar at first. They do this on the solos on Such a Shame and I Don't Believe In You

Or then there are the ones more like "I Don't Believe In You" which is a basic overdriven guitar with a fair amount of delay and reverb, with a couple of staccato notes and slow bends

The solo starts at 3:42

[YnJ]

My bad. Yep it was Myers but played by John Williams afaik. The famous guitar OST version anyway

As far as I know Myers wrote it for another earlier movie, which I can't even remember the name of. It was indeed played by Williams on the version from Deer Hunter, which made it famous

I have it printed out somewhere, an ‘offical’ tab version in a collection of guitar lesson stuff someplace. The problem I had was with memorisation of sections. The shapes were so strange and I have no reference to them re chords
There’s a climbing piece in the middle and it’s fantastic but complex moves, dunno how I’d memorise it tbh. I don’t read music btw if you meant that. Never learned unfortunately much to my dismay now with my old man memory fades

I learned to read music as a kid, so I can't say that it is easy to learn when you're older. In my experience it's a lot easier to see chords and other references when using notes instead of tabs, so I would say it's worth the effort. You don't need to read so well that you can play straight off the sheet to make use of it to learn pieces

[YnJ]

xx

[YnJ]

double post again!?

[Naillerz78]

My bad. Yep it was Myers but played by John Williams afaik. The famous guitar OST version anyway

As far as I know Myers wrote it for another earlier movie, which I can't even remember the name of. It was indeed played by Williams on the version from Deer Hunter, which made it famous

I have it printed out somewhere, an ‘offical’ tab version in a collection of guitar lesson stuff someplace. The problem I had was with memorisation of sections. The shapes were so strange and I have no reference to them re chords
There’s a climbing piece in the middle and it’s fantastic but complex moves, dunno how I’d memorise it tbh. I don’t read music btw if you meant that. Never learned unfortunately much to my dismay now with my old man memory fades

I learned to read music as a kid, so I can't say that it is easy to learn when you're older. In my experience it's a lot easier to see chords and other references when using notes instead of tabs, so I would say it's worth the effort. You don't need to read so well that you can play straight off the sheet to make use of it to learn pieces

I did a jam with a drummer friend and a bassist tonight. With a Semi Hollow guitar I borrowed (an Eastman, very nice ) a cheap Dano fuzz pedal and Thu a BlackStar 40w club tube amp . Was getting some great full tones.

Last week I sat in on drummers other band playing some bass. Guitarist was good but playing a Boss digi unit , RC-300with Fx ..plus some kind of Big Muff pedal also in the chain with it.
He had a big grunge Fuzzed tone and a flanged /delayed clean tone.
Man the sound was so mushy for both, no definition, sounded like an old zoom 505 or something. Yuk! singer said the same thing, he couldn’t hardly hear the chord changes .

I’m sticking to my batt op pedals and tube or S/S amps.

[Magic Russ]

Including the solo on Life's What You Make It? I don't know much about them but that sounds like a real guitar to me

That's because it is. They used both acoustic and electric guitars in addition to synths. On a few tracks they would use a guitar sounding synth instead though, which at least I personally mistook for a guitar at first. They do this on the solos on Such a Shame and I Don't Believe In You

Or then there are the ones more like "I Don't Believe In You" which is a basic overdriven guitar with a fair amount of delay and reverb, with a couple of staccato notes and slow bends

The solo starts at 3:42

I thought I remembered that was David Rhodes on the album playing that track in the studio, but it looks like Ian Curnow played that part on a synth. That's a good use of voicing and pitch wheel control. He manages to do a good job of nailing the sound of the whammy bar abuse that was rife in the 80s.