Softube CS-80 ? - Model 77 Dual Layer Synth

[BONES]

And you didn't answer my question. You claimed I could do everything I want without MPE, you haven't answered how that could possibly be

Give me an example, as I asked, and I'll happily tell you. You can use keyboard splits to different instances of an instrument, for example, or velocity layers or just plain, old polyphonic aftertouch.

You also seem very ignorant to the reality that in modern workflows we have unlimited MIDI channels available to use.

Really? None of my controllers do and, again, I've got a shit-tonne of 'em - Arturia, Korg, Roland, Line 6, Native Instruments, Akai and Donner, as well as my Roli and Embodme MPE controllers. I need to switch MIDI channels to change from one instrument to another on stage, unless I want to be that dork who spends the whole gig staring at a computer screen instead of entertaining the audience. Either that of have multiple controllers on stage, in which case I'd end up looking like some sad old f**k from the '70s.

[IvyBirds]

And you didn't answer my question. You claimed I could do everything I want without MPE, you haven't answered how that could possibly be

Give me an example, as I asked, and I'll happily tell you. You can use keyboard splits to different instances of an instrument, for example, or velocity layers or just plain, old polyphonic aftertouch.

You also seem very ignorant to the reality that in modern workflows we have unlimited MIDI channels available to use.

Really? None of my controllers do and, again, I've got a shit-tonne of 'em - Arturia, Korg, Roland, Line 6, Native Instruments, Akai and Donner, as well as my Roli and Embodme MPE controllers. I need to switch MIDI channels to change from one instrument to another on stage, unless I want to be that dork who spends the whole gig staring at a computer screen instead of entertaining the audience. Either that of have multiple controllers on stage, in which case I'd end up looking like some sad old f**k from the '70s.

I use two controllers on stage and don't spend the whole gig staring at a computer screen or look like some dork from the 70s

In fact I can go the entire gig without really looking at a computer screen

I have as many MIDI channels as I need or want, it's really not that hard.

[ffx]

Thats not how Softube make their products. Hell the thing doesn't even have any effects built in.

edit: ok its got the reverb. I was thinking more along the lines of what u-HE does for Repro for example (and other companies like Arturia).

Hm, I think you are wrong here, they are quite new to instruments/synths, and I would assume that their base stack for that simply is not yet very far developed. They should switch to the CLAP sdk, and then export vst3 from there, instead providing the lowest common denominator of all APIs only.

Those fine algorithms deserve a better feature set.

[PAK]

They must have had *some* access to an 80, otherwise they probably wouldn't be able to get the presets that are only in the 80 out and into the plugin (unless there is some way to get that data by other means).

Strictly speaking there is no data remember. The presets are hardwired circuits which get mechanically switched in when their button is pressed. So they need schematics for the fixed values. The user slots are the same except variable and determined by their mini controls. Kinda makes you appreciate just how big of a technological step over it the Prophet 5 was.

I don't think it's out of the bounds of possibility that Softube could get access to all three synths, even if it's only one of each

How many were made? How many are in Sweden? How many of those owners are willing to move them? (Which near guarantees some issues when moving a 200lb synth which resembles a 1950's telephone exchange inside.. ). Could it be done? Sure. Could it be done at reasonable expense? That's a different question, as even going to the synth would incur expenses.

I guess if they're being somewhat evasive about answering why they didn't include it, it might indicate something possibly

They'd be sensitive to someone saying it's not an 80 because they used a 60. Which isn't correct. It's basically an 80 ..just minus the chorus / tremolo

[DashOfLime]

Thats not how Softube make their products. Hell the thing doesn't even have any effects built in.

edit: ok its got the reverb. I was thinking more along the lines of what u-HE does for Repro for example (and other companies like Arturia).

Hm, I think you are wrong here, they are quite new to instruments/synths, and I would assume that their base stack for that simply is not yet very far developed. They should switch to the CLAP sdk, and then export vst3 from there, instead providing the lowest common denominator of all APIs only.

Those fine algorithms deserve a better feature set.

Modeling is modeling dude. They've been modeling analog circuits for awhile. On the instrument side I wouldn't say almost 10 years is "quite new". Modular came out in 2016. Model 72 came out in 2020. MPE only became part of the MIDI spec in 2018. CLAP is from 2022 and not supported by most of the major DAWs anyhow. Cubase doesn't. Logic doesn't. Live doesn't. The biggest name to actually support CLAP is FL Studio.

They're also smart enough, and nice enough, to make bits of each of these instruments as modules available in Softube Modular.

They've simply chosen not to do it. Not sure why you're not understanding that. What you want them to do really isn't relevant nor does it make any of their decisions old-fashioned, out of date, or whatever you want to call it. Maybe some day they'll add MPE. Maybe they won't. $33 USD was a great price for Model 77 regardless of any of that. It sounds great. If you refuse to use it because it lacks MPE support or whatever it's your loss, not theirs.

[zvenx]

Thank you for writing that, I saw their comment and almost lost blood vessels in how much I disagreed with them..
rsp

[revvy]

They’ve got a great stack after all

Thank goodness

[Kai Enaki]

Could it be done at reasonable expense? That's a different question, as even going to the synth would incur expenses.

If they had access to a unit in Sweden the travel expense would be next to none. Generally speaking, the travel time from the middle of Sweden to either end is 2h-20h. The cost would be something like $20-$200 one way. In the context of product research and production, it's nothing.

[xx JPRacer xx]

I prefer my recreations to be as authentic as possible. If I want more features I'll use another synth. I like to work with the same limitations people at the time were having (within the comfort of a DAW). This put me in a certain creative mindset. There's tons of other synths available if you need more features.

[ffx]

I don't exactly understand where I wrote that their synths are in any way low quality? I think I wrote the opposite. I am just saying what I personally expect from a 2025 released synth plugin, that's all. Also it sounds great, but other with MPE and also CLAP and per-voice modulation sound great, too. If there are many who like it how it is, I am fine with that, too, great for Softube. Surely a great plugin vendor.

I wrote that their underlying stack is less feature rich than the usual standard or their competitors, and that's just an objective fact, not an opinion. e.g. Synapse Audio, U-He, Arturia, TAL, G-Force, Steinberg, Yamaha. They all provide MPE on their analog emulations, too, and some go even further.

[zerocrossing]

I used to be the “would it kill you to add _____ to your emulation?” guy, but now that we have so many different emulsions of all the classics, it’s not a concern. I love all the fun modern stuff, MPE, etc, but sometimes it’s just a basic emulation that is called for.

[Kai Enaki]

I don't exactly understand where I wrote that their synths are in any way low quality? I think I wrote the opposite.

I think your statement about not wanting to pay even 10€ for their synths is a telltale sign of you thinking they're of low quality and not worth it. I'm sure you can understand peoples confusion if that's your way of saying something is of high quality and worth it.

So it might sound good, but the underlying tech stack seems to be outdated, even though it was released at 2024/25. So I wouldn't buy it even for 10€.

[ffx]

Ah indeed, will remove that, thanks.

[waxdoctor]

Has anyone experienced filter stepping on the Model 77?

[bonch]

I don't exactly understand where I wrote that their synths are in any way low quality? I think I wrote the opposite. I am just saying what I personally expect from a 2025 released synth plugin, that's all. Also it sounds great, but other with MPE and also CLAP and per-voice modulation sound great, too. If there are many who like it how it is, I am fine with that, too, great for Softube. Surely a great plugin vendor.

I wrote that their underlying stack is less feature rich than the usual standard or their competitors, and that's just an objective fact, not an opinion. e.g. Synapse Audio, U-He, Arturia, TAL, G-Force, Steinberg, Yamaha. They all provide MPE on their analog emulations, too, and some go even further.

Some people view Softube emulations very highly, but they're pretty expensive and rudimentary compared to what's offered from competitors. In my opinion, they aim for a romanticized, exaggerated vintage sound rather than what's accurate, and the UIs are unnecessarily limited.