Zebra 3 Public Beta Revision 20399

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Urs wrote: Mon Dec 29, 2025 10:08 am
Borbolactic wrote: Mon Dec 29, 2025 6:36 amusing dubious licenses and/or license cards
"I didn't quite get the gist of your post, but let me chime in on some of the subjects...

In my world, loyalty discounts are a tool to turn a disadvantage into money." ~ Urs
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To clarify:

It's someone else who may have expressed an interest in 'loyalty discounts' (and/or that kind of thing), not I.

I am uninterested in loyalty discounts and the like since I have no loyalty with your company. So the part of your response that elaborates on that is of little relevance, at least to me, although it may be to others of course.

If I have any 'loyalty', it is of a general gift-economics position, including such concepts in our little context here as peer-to-peer, file-sharing, and FLOSS (Free/Libre/OpenSouce Software). That's real 'long-game ROI', since you mention it.
You do have freeware, but the code is ostensibly still proprietary.

BTW, did you name your 'Civilization' hardware as inspiration from my quasi-joking with you roughly a couple of years ago about getting into acoustic guitars for after civ's decline/collapse? Europe doesn't seem to be doing very well these days, but then, neither does most anywhere else.
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"I don't think that we're the only company to do public betas." ~ Urs
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Yes, I seem to recall Madrona Labs going that route with Sumu for example.
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"For instance, had we not done a free to use beta, many people would have bought Zebra 3 already based on certain expectations, e.g. that it would load wavetables, that it did resynthesis, all of which it doesn't, and this thread and the feedback hopefully helps to clarify these things during the initial hype. I think we help people understand what Zebra 3 *is*, and what it *is not*. Which is more valuable for us in the long run than selling more licenses now, to more people who then turn out to be unhappy." ~ Urs
____

Sure I get that in its own context.
WRT the import/resynthesis, however, are you saying that all sounds/waveforms are to be made from scratch? Did Z2 not have some kind of import app called Blueberry and/or whatever?

Madrona Labs, for its Sumu additive synth, has, if understood correctly, a modified version of an open source program they call Vutu (maybe renamed to that) that resynthesizes and then outputs to the native Sumu file format that it can then read in. Can Z3 not manage that or something similar? Where are you getting your code for the physical modeling part? Is it open source? Apparently, SurgeXT incorporates Mutable Instruments.

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Borbolactic wrote: Mon Dec 29, 2025 8:27 pm
Urs wrote: Mon Dec 29, 2025 10:08 am
Borbolactic wrote: Mon Dec 29, 2025 6:36 amusing dubious licenses and/or license cards
"I didn't quite get the gist of your post, but let me chime in on some of the subjects...

In my world, loyalty discounts are a tool to turn a disadvantage into money." ~ Urs
____

To clarify:

It's someone else who may have expressed an interest in 'loyalty discounts' (and/or that kind of thing), not I.

I am uninterested in loyalty discounts and the like since I have no loyalty with your company. So the part of your response that elaborates on that is of little relevance, at least to me, although it may be to others of course.

If I have any 'loyalty', it is of a general gift-economics position, including such concepts in our little context here as peer-to-peer, file-sharing, and FLOSS (Free/Libre/OpenSouce Software). That's real 'long-game ROI', since you mention it.
You do have freeware, but the code is ostensibly still proprietary.

BTW, did you name your 'Civilization' hardware as inspiration from my quasi-joking with you roughly a couple of years ago about getting into acoustic guitars for after civ's decline/collapse? Europe doesn't seem to be doing very well these days, but then, neither does most anywhere else.
____
"I don't think that we're the only company to do public betas." ~ Urs
____
Yes, I seem to recall Madrona Labs going that route with Sumu for example.
____
"For instance, had we not done a free to use beta, many people would have bought Zebra 3 already based on certain expectations, e.g. that it would load wavetables, that it did resynthesis, all of which it doesn't, and this thread and the feedback hopefully helps to clarify these things during the initial hype. I think we help people understand what Zebra 3 *is*, and what it *is not*. Which is more valuable for us in the long run than selling more licenses now, to more people who then turn out to be unhappy." ~ Urs
____

Sure I get that in its own context.
WRT the import/resynthesis, however, are you saying that all sounds/waveforms are to be made from scratch? Did Z2 not have some kind of import app called Blueberry and/or whatever?

Madrona Labs, for its Sumu additive synth, has, if understood correctly, a modified version of an open source program they call Vutu (maybe renamed to that) that resynthesizes and then outputs to the native Sumu file format that it can then read in. Can Z3 not manage that or something similar? Where are you getting your code for the physical modeling part? Is it open source? Apparently, SurgeXT incorporates Mutable Instruments.
CVilization is named after CV = Control Voltage and for the large array of applications it has there, using sets of rules to tame CV.

No, Zebra 3 is not similar to Sunu.

Where I got the code for physical modelling? Man... certainly not from open source repositories...

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Borbolactic wrote: Mon Dec 29, 2025 8:27 pm Apparently, SurgeXT incorporates Mutable Instruments.
Mutable Instruments what? Can't see any documentation to support that.
How original

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Urs wrote: Mon Dec 29, 2025 8:55 pm Where I got the code for physical modelling? Man... certainly not from open source repositories...
Not from open source repositories? Wtf?! Next you’ll tell me you didn’t train Zebra 3 on GitHub Copilot either..

But seriously, it’s always fascinating how I don’t use your products naturally evolves into here’s how you should design them.
Its over for Bitwig--CUBASE WON !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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enCiphered wrote: Mon Dec 29, 2025 9:23 pm
Urs wrote: Mon Dec 29, 2025 8:55 pm Where I got the code for physical modelling? Man... certainly not from open source repositories...
Not from open source repositories? Wtf?! Next you’ll tell me you didn’t train Zebra 3 on GitHub Copilot either..

But seriously, it’s always fascinating how I don’t use your products naturally evolves into here’s how you should design them.
That person probably makes the worst music too.

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The guy has posted 9 times in this thread and his agenda from the get-go was to inject negativity, even calling commenters cult members.

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stippenstoh wrote: Mon Dec 29, 2025 10:23 pm The guy has posted 9 times in this thread and his agenda from the get-go was to inject negativity, even calling commenters cult members.
Yes, what a thoroughly odd conversation

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rmbles wrote: Mon Dec 29, 2025 10:29 pm
stippenstoh wrote: Mon Dec 29, 2025 10:23 pm The guy has posted 9 times in this thread and his agenda from the get-go was to inject negativity, even calling commenters cult members.
Yes, what a thoroughly odd conversation
agreed...

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seafire wrote: Mon Dec 29, 2025 9:14 pm Mutable Instruments what? Can't see any documentation to support that.
Twist oscillator is Mutable Plaits, the Nimbus FX is Clouds.

https://surge-synthesizer.github.io/manual-xt/#twist
https://surge-synthesizer.github.io/manual-xt/#nimbus
https://github.com/surge-synthesizer/eu ... c7bca9a69d

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I've never added so many f###wits to my 'ignore' list as I have since this thread started.

Utmost respect to Urs for maintaining his dignified and professional attitude throughout :clap:
Hear my music |
myLatestAlbum
so do I neither

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ThoughtExperiment wrote: Mon Dec 29, 2025 10:45 pm I've never added so many f###wits to my 'ignore' list as I have since this thread started.

Utmost respect to Urs for maintaining his dignified and professional attitude throughout :clap:
:lol: :lol: +1

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I love this thing in many ways. Can complement it more in another post, but I want to bring up the UI while there’s hopefully still some time to work on it.

Colors are used inconsistently, with varying brightnesses, which makes the UI feel unsettling.

I imagine the primary active color should be light grey (it’s called Zebra), and then use colors to help with navigation. Some issues:

- The comb and exciter are in different categories when choosing them in the signal flow, but they are the same color modules.
- No matter what color a module is, it’s green in the signal flow. (For example, despite distortion modules being red)
- I think color should have meaning. Why not color those modules in the picker and in the signal flow so it all makes sense? Just use subtle colors. Otherwise, there’s no reason for any of them to be green, and they should be light grey.
- The bright preset background color is out of control overly bright. Other u-he products have a darker background there, which is less distracting
- There are too many shades of green. Some are nice ones, and some are not. The color in the matrix is okay, but the other greens are a bit harsh.

The other thing that’s weird for me is the tabs. The presets tab feels funny where it is. It’s disconnected from the presets bar, unlike the other products, and the pitches tab is weirdly prominent for something that seems like more of an advanced feature.

Another thing, I love the big editors for oscillators and MSEGs, etc, but they take over the screen in a way that makes me forget how to get out. I wish it looked more connected to the button that enables it. And I get confused about my edits in the big window vs the little window vs the oscillator at the top left.

It’s a complicated synth so the UI is going to be complex, still, I think some UX improvements are possible with the things I’m talking about.

BTW, I have protanopia, and the current colors aren’t great for that either. :-)

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exmatproton wrote: Mon Dec 29, 2025 11:08 pm
ThoughtExperiment wrote: Mon Dec 29, 2025 10:45 pm I've never added so many f###wits to my 'ignore' list as I have since this thread started.

Utmost respect to Urs for maintaining his dignified and professional attitude throughout :clap:
:lol: :lol: +1
It helps a lot to write down full blown tantrums, then copy them, close KVR and paste them into my Notes folder called "Neverposts". Once I get to, say, 1000 I might put write an album about them.

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I bet that album would be more polite than what we are witnessing here anyway....
MacMini M2 Pro MacOS Tahoe ……… Reason 14

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Andreya_Autumn wrote: Mon Dec 29, 2025 10:38 pm
seafire wrote: Mon Dec 29, 2025 9:14 pm Mutable Instruments what? Can't see any documentation to support that.
Twist oscillator is Mutable Plaits, the Nimbus FX is Clouds.

https://surge-synthesizer.github.io/manual-xt/#twist
https://surge-synthesizer.github.io/manual-xt/#nimbus
https://github.com/surge-synthesizer/eu ... c7bca9a69d
Thanks
How original

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