Hi everyone
To make a long story short, after years of using Mulab in a very basic way, I found using and configuring external controllers very difficult.
So I tried Ableton Live, which is definitely more intuitive and everything is pre-mapped.
BUT
Except for the MIDI input routing (which is unfortunately a mystery to me) and the controller configuration, I realized that I love the sound of Mulab's built-in synths.
So I went back to using Mulab.
Now, my hardware setup is as follows:
- Behringer RS-9 drum sequencer (USB)
- M-Vave SMK Mixer Controller (USB)
- Arturia Keystep (USB)
- Focusrite Scarlett MIDI Output to various outboard synth
I'd like to get this:
- Behringer RS-9 drum sequencer (USB) connected to a MuDrum 808 module and receiving usb clock
- M-Vave SMK Mixer Controller (USB) connected to MuDrum 808 to edit volumes and pitches
- Arturia Keystep (USB) driving VST or Mulab synths (from channels 2 to 10 or there is no channel limits for the plugins ? I can't understand)
- Arturia Keystep (USB) on a Focusrite Scarlett MIDI Output driving external synths from channels 11 to 16
Can you tell me the correct MIDI routing scheme, please?
Thanks!
from Mulab to Live and Back !!
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- KVRist
- 183 posts since 10 Dec, 2007 from A'pen
it depends a little on your (elaborate) setup
are you using a USB hub ? Or built in MIDI interface from your sound card? or both?
so ML will be master
don't think there's any difference ML wise when sending or receiving MIDI from plain DIN/interface or USB
so you need to define these interfaces first in ML, then you can setup the correct config
i think you can constrain / define the MIDI channels in ML that a particular interface is using/not using
(not that it really matters because the receiving side defines what happens with your MIDI anyway)
my setup is very similar than yours and looks like this:
(Mulab-MIDI setup)
remote is Novation Remote USB (keyboard/controller)
HDSPeFX MADI is internal MIDI stream on my soundcard
HDSPeFX MADI is a MIDI stream transported through the MADI ports to a external audio interface which has 2 MIDI DIN ports (which are assigned to the MADI stream)
are you using a USB hub ? Or built in MIDI interface from your sound card? or both?
so ML will be master
don't think there's any difference ML wise when sending or receiving MIDI from plain DIN/interface or USB
so you need to define these interfaces first in ML, then you can setup the correct config
i think you can constrain / define the MIDI channels in ML that a particular interface is using/not using
(not that it really matters because the receiving side defines what happens with your MIDI anyway)
my setup is very similar than yours and looks like this:
(Mulab-MIDI setup)
remote is Novation Remote USB (keyboard/controller)
HDSPeFX MADI is internal MIDI stream on my soundcard
HDSPeFX MADI is a MIDI stream transported through the MADI ports to a external audio interface which has 2 MIDI DIN ports (which are assigned to the MADI stream)
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- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 68 posts since 5 Mar, 2020
Thank you Tiger !
Well, I'm sorry, I'm a bit confuesd.
Do the terms "input port xx" and "output port xx" refer to 16 MIDI channels?
If so, without using "automatic MIDI input focus" I would only have a maximum of 16 channels to split between hardware MIDI out and virtual instruments.
This seems like a huge limitation.
Or, I just didn't understand anything.
The point is, in my humble opinion, that the MIDI setup interface is hard to understand.
It would be nice if each track, like other DAWs, had the ability to select the MIDI input source and the dedicated output.
If not, I only know how to use Mulab with automatic MIDI input focus.
Well, I'm sorry, I'm a bit confuesd.
Do the terms "input port xx" and "output port xx" refer to 16 MIDI channels?
If so, without using "automatic MIDI input focus" I would only have a maximum of 16 channels to split between hardware MIDI out and virtual instruments.
This seems like a huge limitation.
Or, I just didn't understand anything.
The point is, in my humble opinion, that the MIDI setup interface is hard to understand.
It would be nice if each track, like other DAWs, had the ability to select the MIDI input source and the dedicated output.
If not, I only know how to use Mulab with automatic MIDI input focus.
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- KVRAF
- 13851 posts since 24 Jun, 2008 from Europe
MuLab supports up to 16 MIDI inputs and 16 MIDI outputs.
Currently the MIDI inputs are merged into a single virtual MIDI input and you can choose how this input should be dispatched to the project modules using the project menu -> MIDI Input Channel Targets. For all details, see https://www.mutools.com/info/M10/docs/m ... uting.html
MIDI output can be done to up to 16 MIDI outputs giving you up to 16x16 = 256 MIDI channels.
If any further questions, just ask.
Currently the MIDI inputs are merged into a single virtual MIDI input and you can choose how this input should be dispatched to the project modules using the project menu -> MIDI Input Channel Targets. For all details, see https://www.mutools.com/info/M10/docs/m ... uting.html
MIDI output can be done to up to 16 MIDI outputs giving you up to 16x16 = 256 MIDI channels.
If any further questions, just ask.
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- KVRAF
- 13851 posts since 24 Jun, 2008 from Europe
Input = 16 channels.
Output = 16 x 16 = 256 channels.
About MIDI input:
Do you have more than 16 MIDI controllers? (Keyboards, knob/fader controllers, ...)
If not, then why would you need more than 16 MIDI input channels?
Output = 16 x 16 = 256 channels.
About MIDI input:
Do you have more than 16 MIDI controllers? (Keyboards, knob/fader controllers, ...)
If not, then why would you need more than 16 MIDI input channels?
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- KVRAF
- 7411 posts since 8 Feb, 2003 from London, UK
Many MIDI controllers can have multiple channels. My TouchOSC displays can have hundreds of buttons, each could be a separate CC number on a different channel. Just on one MIDI port.
Then I've physical hardware controllers. A MIDI keyboard could be split channel, lower octave drums on channel 10, upper three octaves organ on channel 1. So I want those separate from the CC channels.
Then I've an eDrum Kit, that's also using MIDI Channel 10 but it's on a different MIDI input.
And then another piano also on channel 1, another MIDI Input. It could be remapped... but why force the user to break out a manual when it could just be routed inside MuLab?
Etc.
It's pretty trivial to exceed MuLab's MIDI in capabilities.
(Fortunately I usually manage MIDI ports in Reaper and use MuLab for hosting and routing within effect busses, which I find much more intuitive in MuLab.)
Then I've physical hardware controllers. A MIDI keyboard could be split channel, lower octave drums on channel 10, upper three octaves organ on channel 1. So I want those separate from the CC channels.
Then I've an eDrum Kit, that's also using MIDI Channel 10 but it's on a different MIDI input.
And then another piano also on channel 1, another MIDI Input. It could be remapped... but why force the user to break out a manual when it could just be routed inside MuLab?
Etc.
It's pretty trivial to exceed MuLab's MIDI in capabilities.
(Fortunately I usually manage MIDI ports in Reaper and use MuLab for hosting and routing within effect busses, which I find much more intuitive in MuLab.)
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- KVRAF
- 13851 posts since 24 Jun, 2008 from Europe
Ok i reread this topic a bit slower. I realize i replied a bit too draftly earlier today, scusa.
@Bax9 & @pljones: Ok, point accepted that the current MIDI input system can be too limited for extended MIDI setups. Will keep it in mind for a possible future extension. (draft thought: Each MIDI input device could get its own MIDI Input Channel Targets map)
@Bax9: The fact that the current MIDI input is limited to 16 channels does not matter for how MIDI input is routed into MuLab.
In other words: Even if MuLab would fully support all channels of all MIDI input devices, the way MIDI input is dispatched would still be the same.
The first thing you have to understand is the Project -> MIDI Input Channel Targets.
Did you read this doc page: https://www.mutools.com/info/M10/docs/m ... uting.html
@Bax9 & @pljones: Ok, point accepted that the current MIDI input system can be too limited for extended MIDI setups. Will keep it in mind for a possible future extension. (draft thought: Each MIDI input device could get its own MIDI Input Channel Targets map)
@Bax9: The fact that the current MIDI input is limited to 16 channels does not matter for how MIDI input is routed into MuLab.
In other words: Even if MuLab would fully support all channels of all MIDI input devices, the way MIDI input is dispatched would still be the same.
The first thing you have to understand is the Project -> MIDI Input Channel Targets.
Did you read this doc page: https://www.mutools.com/info/M10/docs/m ... uting.html
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- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 68 posts since 5 Mar, 2020
Done!!!!
My misunderstanding was that MIDI inputs and MIDI outputs (in the MIDI configuration) are linked together.
So MIDI input 1 > MIDI output 1, and so on.
I thought it was just a list of MIDI inputs and outputs.
Thanks for the help!
My misunderstanding was that MIDI inputs and MIDI outputs (in the MIDI configuration) are linked together.
So MIDI input 1 > MIDI output 1, and so on.
I thought it was just a list of MIDI inputs and outputs.
Thanks for the help!
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- KVRAF
- 13851 posts since 24 Jun, 2008 from Europe
You're welcome.
Hope you see & like that MuLab is module based, not track based.
If any questions left, just ask.
Hope you see & like that MuLab is module based, not track based.
If any questions left, just ask.
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- KVRAF
- 13851 posts since 24 Jun, 2008 from Europe
Also this tip:
If you would want to have project wide MIDI CC mappings, use Project menu -> Project MIDI Input Controller Map. In fact that's the same MIDI CC map as if you would go into the project modular area -> options -> Edit MIDI Controller Map. It is the top most MIDI CC Map, and it is checked for every incoming MIDI CC before applying the MIDI Input Channel Targets dispatching.
If you would want to have project wide MIDI CC mappings, use Project menu -> Project MIDI Input Controller Map. In fact that's the same MIDI CC map as if you would go into the project modular area -> options -> Edit MIDI Controller Map. It is the top most MIDI CC Map, and it is checked for every incoming MIDI CC before applying the MIDI Input Channel Targets dispatching.