noise and buzzing on Freeze and Render

[leeturne]

My setup is:

p4 2.4
1gb RAM
M-Audio 2496
80GB system drive
200GB ATA 133 working drive

I have a song with 20 tracks which are mostly VST instruments and Tracktion sampler. On one track I used the freeze function and at the start of the track when no instruments are playing there is a horrible buzz similar to a ground loop.
I unfroze (defrosted?) the track and there was no noise using the VSTi. I then rendered the track and whilst there is no noise at the beginning, at the end of the song after the last sustained note there is a hissing sound.
I then tried to render a different track with a different instrument. Again there is noise at the end and distortion on the fading delay.

I'll try and record something in Sound Forge to compare it to. The card is set to 44.1.

[djsubject]

i have simeler problems with some vsti's & vst fx have you try'ed freezing just the Tracktion sampler trak with no fx after it

if this works then its a proses of ilimination on finding witch vst is to blaim

good luck

[leeturne]

I've tried 2 different VSTi but i'll now try the sampler.

[valley]

did you try the "render at 1x" option?

[djsubject]

there is also a button that helps P4 users its in the settings page, then the plugin tab, in the middle of the page (well the bottom button) is a button called add low leval noise to avoid denormalition

Try that aswell

[leeturne]

Tried the low level noise option. I'm now not getting noise at the beginning (also restarted Tracktion) but the noise at the end is still there. It's only when the track goes quieter. e.g. I have a piano chord at the end which sustains until natural fade. As it goes quieter a hissing sound appears. On the other track it's an octave arpeggio with a delay on it. As the delay starts to fade the hiss appears and the very quiet notes start to distort and break up. It doesn't happen on the VSTi. I'm now going to try it on my powerbook.

[leeturne]

Nothing on the Mac, no distortion or hiss.

[D-Fusion]

I had simmilar problem too + after the render i got a message window saying fatal error in wusikstation, The fix was to make sure that none of the connectors on the left is connected while rendering (Make sure that midi in/out, wave in/out is not conected to a track)

Hope this will help

[IIRs]

It's only when the track goes quieter. e.g. I have a piano chord at the end which sustains until natural fade. As it goes quieter a hissing sound appears. On the other track it's an octave arpeggio with a delay on it. As the delay starts to fade the hiss appears and the very quiet notes start to distort and break up.

What bit-depth is the rendered file? Your description makes me think of 8-bit audio, or low-level 16-bit without dither..?

[leeturne]

Stupid question time!

In the settings tab the only bit rate than can be set is in the Audio input. It's currently set to 16 bit. The audio output device is now enabled for dithering but I'm still getting the same result. The m-audio control panel does not allow setting of bit rate.

Is there something I should be setting for the rendered bit depth?

[IIRs]

Rendering uses the soundcard settimg afaik, so your file should be 24-bit. You can check by clicking the "View Source Info" button for the rendered clip.

If it isn't 24 bit then there's something wrong and it might be the problem..

I don't really know what the dither this ouptut button does (whether the dither is included with exports & renders, and how it chooses its depth setting).. I asked on the Mackie forum about a week ago, but have had no response so far..

Until I get an answer I've been leaving it off and using the mda dither plug. Strictly speaking, when you render to 24 bit, you should stick a dither plug on the track (after the Vol / Pan) set to 24 bit.. but I can't imagine truncating to 24 bit would be as audible as you describe.. maybe if Tracktion is rendering 16 bit files for some reason, the lack of dither might be that obvious..?

[leeturne]

I tried a few more options and searched around the web. I set the card input to 24 bit and froze the track. It sounds a lot better but there is still slight distortion on the very quiet (just audible) sounds. One thing I did try is to raise the levels of the clip as reading on different forums suggests that 16 bit is a bit fussier with low levels.
I will now try the render at 1x speed but I can only find that option on the export function not on the freeze. It was midnight so maybe I'm being dumb.

Also where do I find the MDA dither plug in the filters menu. I can't see it.

[djsubject]

Also where do I find the MDA dither plug in the filters menu. I can't see it.

thay should be in a folder called 3rd party plugins in your filter list

[leeturne]

On the powerbook there is an MDA folder of plugins but no dither filter. I know I need glasses but my eyes are not that bad! There is also no 3rd party plug in section.

[IIRs]

Grab the mda plugs here if you're missing some.