The long DIVA thread

[atraf11]

The latest beta is really different to my ears. The moog components dont seem to sound as instantly moogy as they did before. The filter seems to have this fizz to it that I can't remove.
Also the resonance on the Jupiter filter seems even more polite than it was in beta 360 and has lost all of its balls (for want of a better term).
I wish I could quantify this more. I keep swapping between the two betas and I find the sound of beta 360 much more satisfying (mind you I haven't played much with the new fm changes).

I know you have worked so hard on this Urs but somehow it seems like the whole thing has been over-tweaked and has lost a lot of life.

Does anyone feel the same?

(btw this feeling isn't coming from comparing presets, its about just building sounds from scratch)

Edit: I did some comparisons between 360 and 467 and there is definitely a substantial difference between the way the moog oscillators behave. The 360 oscillators seem to be free-er, while the 467 almost sound like their start time is synced. I definitely prefer the moog oscillator sound of 360

see this is what i was afraid of,, too much "cleaning". i agree the newst beta sounds a bit sterile to my ear as well.. urs, i know germans like perfection but imperfection is what makes analogue what is it!

[jlight]

Is the OscFM range shorter in the beta 467?
I got nice sound by automating OscFM in beta 360 but I'm not able to get the same sound anymore in 467.

[Funkasizer]

The latest beta is really different to my ears. The moog components dont seem to sound as instantly moogy as they did before. The filter seems to have this fizz to it that I can't remove.
Also the resonance on the Jupiter filter seems even more polite than it was in beta 360 and has lost all of its balls (for want of a better term).
I wish I could quantify this more. I keep swapping between the two betas and I find the sound of beta 360 much more satisfying (mind you I haven't played much with the new fm changes).

I know you have worked so hard on this Urs but somehow it seems like the whole thing has been over-tweaked and has lost a lot of life.

Does anyone feel the same?

(btw this feeling isn't coming from comparing presets, its about just building sounds from scratch)

Edit: I did some comparisons between 360 and 467 and there is definitely a substantial difference between the way the moog oscillators behave. The 360 oscillators seem to be free-er, while the 467 almost sound like their start time is synced. I definitely prefer the moog oscillator sound of 360

Weird how opinions can differ! I have the opposite feeling, finding the moog filter more growling and having more balls in the 467 release. I find this particularly obvious in old school synth bass sounds.

[pdxindy]

If you think 360 is more satisfying, let's hear some audio examples from both versions... I don't have any old betas...

[Ingonator]

The latest beta is really different to my ears. The moog components dont seem to sound as instantly moogy as they did before. The filter seems to have this fizz to it that I can't remove.
Also the resonance on the Jupiter filter seems even more polite than it was in beta 360 and has lost all of its balls (for want of a better term).
I wish I could quantify this more. I keep swapping between the two betas and I find the sound of beta 360 much more satisfying (mind you I haven't played much with the new fm changes).

I know you have worked so hard on this Urs but somehow it seems like the whole thing has been over-tweaked and has lost a lot of life.

Does anyone feel the same?

(btw this feeling isn't coming from comparing presets, its about just building sounds from scratch)

Edit: I did some comparisons between 360 and 467 and there is definitely a substantial difference between the way the moog oscillators behave. The 360 oscillators seem to be free-er, while the 467 almost sound like their start time is synced. I definitely prefer the moog oscillator sound of 360

While correcting my Moog presets (e.g. "Abacab Fifths") i first thought it sound crappy in the new Beta but after turning down the Feedback (around -30.00 in the "Abacab Fifths" preset) it sounded the same again.
I agree that the resonance behavior in the Multimode filter is different now but in a good way as i could see so far (sound more "squelchy" with very high Resonance IMO).
I'll investigate this further while correcting my presets.

PS:
I still got Beta 360 (Windows version). Using both at the moment until i corrected my presets. Those who need the Beta 360 (for Windows) could send me a PM.


Ingo

[Fritze]

one trick for people that would like to get lot of sounds variations over time out of diva without runing x instances killing cpu, try Usine Free.
http://www.sensomusic.com

it's a modular daw that work as standalone or as vsti inside any daw and can load vsts/vstis.

once diva is loaded in usine, you got access to all pins where you can put extra Lfos, steps sequencers, curves ect on ANY parameter. it extend diva modular to crasy limits!!.
then there is a 'preset manager' that allows instant store and recall of all
the external lfos, sequences and internal parameters + what ya set on diva. just tweak knobs, once it's cool store it to a slot. it's much more fun and easy to organize than dealing with pgm changes. and with one instance you can make
tons of crasy sounds, and even morph between presets:o

they make a killer combo. im really happy

Thanx a lot for that in depth tip! That's up my alley, will check that out.

[PAK]

The filter seems to have this fizz to it that I can't remove.

Not sure what you're noticing if you think it's just appeared, but I've said a similar thing since the first beta. I assume it's maybe down to the way the drive is being modelled in the filter or something. I would really like a way to somehow "smooth it out" more, whatever the reason. I assume you've also already tried adjusting mixer/VCA volume levels etc? In fairness to Urs, this is the sort of area where some Minimoogs might differ, but a slightly more solid/smoother quality might be desirable, where Diva wants to be "fuzzy" at times

Also the resonance on the Jupiter filter seems even more polite than it was in beta 360 and has lost all of its balls (for want of a better term).

Haven't used it enough to comment properly but, from what I can tell, I think I prefer how it behaves in the current version..

Edit: I did some comparisons between 360 and 467 and there is definitely a substantial difference between the way the moog oscillators behave. The 360 oscillators seem to be free-er, while the 467 almost sound like their start time is synced. I definitely prefer the moog oscillator sound of 360

Even after adjusting for "Drift and Slops have finer resolution now (push up a fair bit)" ?

Anyway, I still think it sounds as "Moogy" - if anything I think there's improvements in that regard. I do still notice some differences in the envelopes from "what I was used to" as well though. For an example try copying the bass sound from the 80's record Nu Shooz "I can't wait". There's a certain "knock" in the attack portion, and when I say knock I literally mean like someone is knocking on a door. Keeping in mind tape/compression hugely exaggerates the effect on the record, the little nudge you get at certain envelope settings seems to be a struggle for Diva without closing things down more and getting into percussive, rather than bass, sounds. That's one thing I personally miss (edit - I mean in comparison to hardware Moogs - just to clarify )

[PAK]

If you think 360 is more satisfying, let's hear some audio examples from both versions... I don't have any old betas...

Personally I don't find 360 more satisfying - I prefer the current version. But I already outlined at the bottom of p140 how the feedback can act a bit strange, and that can be a bit more noticeable in the current version depending on what you're doing with it. The Moog envelope changes I find welcome too, but they do also mean that, for certain sounds, there's less ambiguity about whether or not the release switch is appropriate - the old behaviour was a bit more forgiving.

However overall a sound should be pretty much the same, or so close that there's really not a lot in it (from the few things I've bothered to adjust at least). The trickiest part is usually lining up the changes in the filter, the envelopes, and the env2 knob (assuming default routings). There does seem to be very small differences in how the resonance reacts there, but I wouldn't call it anything major. Of all the changes, the one that might not have enough weight given to it is "Drift and Slops have finer resolution now (push up a fair bit)". I'd say follow the advice - sometimes small changes are related to that where you might think it's the filter itself etc.

Thanx a lot for that in depth tip! That's up my alley, will check that out.

Mine too. Thanks for the tip euklid.fox

[Crackbaby]

The init preset has a lower Max Detune on the new beta (Trimmers page). Turn it up and you may get back the moogy sound

Personally i find the new beta to sound much more lovely, especially the eco/sallen!

[pdxindy]

If you think 360 is more satisfying, let's hear some audio examples from both versions... I don't have any old betas...

Personally I don't find 360 more satisfying - I prefer the current version. But I already outlined at the bottom of p140 how the feedback can act a bit strange, and that can be a bit more noticeable in the current version depending on what you're doing with it. The Moog envelope changes I find welcome too, but they do also mean that, for certain sounds, there's less ambiguity about whether or not the release switch is appropriate - the old behaviour was a bit more forgiving.

I prefer the latest as well... In general, I think it is helpful to post audio examples because if there is something there, others will hear it. Audio examples bring a solidity to such discussions which otherwise tend to (not always) be overly subjective and vague.

[S0lo]

....totally addict to her sound already. ....

Never heard "HER" referring to a synth before

In fact, I never heard a HE. It's always IT

Can U-he confirm that Diva's a girl?

[zvenx]

I know new features are on pause for now, but I wish 1) I could set render as best as a default for all new instances....and that there was a global quality option for either preset or pre-assigned by user.
rsp

(offline render setting does not work yet)

save a default.h2p patch - there you can have any settings you like, including those that are normally per instance. I hope.

Tried that.......it didnt' save the status of render mode (whether it works or not)

rsp

[hakey]

Can U-he confirm that Diva's a girl?

The word Diva is feminine - Divo is the masculine form.

[hakey]

Why does selecting Gate for the VCA trigger give a snappier attack than the fastest envelope setting?

Edit: Try swapping Env1 for Gate in this example.

-

[Crackbaby]

If Urs was gibson or fender he could sell "Diva Public Beta 1 Reissue" later on and charge double for it.