MTurboReverb preset making action, let's make the ultimate reverb! ;)

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MeldaProduction wrote:serial taps are probably the worst things imho, these are really parts of the ancient design and the reason was probably mainly the efficient implementation, not audio quality. Though, maybe they just experimented with it.
The classic Lexicon 224 used a version of stfb for their reverb designs, as alluded to in “Effect Design Part One” by Dattorro. And, it can sound really good. Let me demonstrate with the beta of MTurboReverb I am using to develop presets. Let’s have only one active module, LR1, and let’s put this topology in it:

7b[a];stfb[#[b[v(0.1)];fl;fh;a;b[swap]]];

This is a reasonable approximation of the classic algorithms from the 224 which gave us the reverb in, among many other things, the legendary introduction to “Blade Runner.” For best results, I set “size” to 15%, “Delay Max” to 33.3%, and length is 500ms. Complexity is 32 to minimize ringing and metallic resonances (yes, David Griesinger was able to reduce ringing with fewer nodes by carefully hand tuning all of the allpass filters and delay times, but here in 2017, we’ll just brute force it)

How does it sound? Very ethereal with long decays. Let me arpeggiate a C chord through this reverb, starting off dry and fading in the reverb:

https://soundcloud.com/caulixtla/circle ... urboreverb

It’s called a “Circle 8” reverb because the first published version of this algorithm (in “Effect Design Part One”) looks like a Circle 8 in the diagram.
Sam Trenholme — Software developer, electronic musician — Listen to my music: http://caulixtla.com/music

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Wow. Cool ongoing discussions. I am really impressed by all the statements you people wrote. Very interesting to learn more about reverbs after all. :)

@plexuss:
I understand your point regarding "I am not the coding guy". I am a hobby coder (mainly python scripts to automate bureaucracy and script writing), but I also have some problems "feel" the usage of the modules in MTR. It's to me like: making a topology, recognizing somethign wrong in the reverb sound and then I am not sure with which module I could equalize it to make it sound better ... but maybe that's not the workflow of reverb design after all? :D ... I still played with some modules and mainly tweaked the other designer values, which are also great for sculpting the sound. So I assume that even with these values you can change the reverb a lot already.

@The-Reality-Discussion:
According to my experience we like to be fooled, no question. Beside music production I also do sound design. In this area I learned that it just work to use sounds, which are not seen in a scene, but are meant to represent this thing in the scene. ;)
Speaking of sound design: you all mentioned musical reverb. Since I do sound design a lot as well, I really would appreciate a real-space reverb, by the way ;)
System: Win 10 64 bit / i9 9900K (8x 3.6 GHz) / 16 GB DDR4-3200 RAM / 1TB M.2 SSD + 2x 500 GB SSD / RME Babyface / Reaper

Tagirijus.de

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As well as real-space reverbs is it possible to create any effects similar to Zynaptiq Adaptiverb?

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If MTurboReverb won't be able to create effects similar to Adaptiverb, it won't be long before Vojtech will create a plugin that can. ( remember MMorph)
Windows 7, Cubase 9.5 and some extra plug-ins | Takamine EN-10C and PRS Mira

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I finally decided to make a video showing some of the stuff I've been working on. I wanted it to be quick, but it ended up being over 13 min. Anyway, it should give people some idea of what can be done with it although it is a bit barebones because I only show presets I personally made and I didn't even go too in depth with them. Anyway check it out and let me know what you think.


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Good work! I like the lush sound at 8:00.

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Cool! Need to watch that!

Btw. while experimenting with bricasti I think this one works pretty well as one of the layers:

an[#an[a;fh;fl]]

It nicely creates the delayed buildup. I think what people may like it is that it sort of fills the empty space in between, almost like a compressor. I'd recommend Complexity 3.

Edit: Cauxiltha's algorithm 7b[a];stfb[#[b[v(0.1)];fl;fh;a;b[swap]]] works too, but it's sort of metallic. I quite believe that's how they were doing it before. The an[#an[a;fh;fl]] is 2 level nesting, which probably wasn't something people would be trying before, but it works very well.
Vojtech
MeldaProduction MSoundFactory MDrummer MCompleteBundle The best plugins in the world :D

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Chandlerhimself wrote: ...Anyway check it out and let me know what you think.

Well done Mr. Chandler! Nice video and you made some genuine presets too. I also like the lush, dreamy reverb a lot - it sounds great with the guitar. And the sping is so fine too.
I also prefer the Ozone style. :tu:

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I appreciate in particular the implementation of the Distance parameters as seen in this video and I am looking forward to testing it.
The ideal for me would be something like what can be obtained with Eareverb (its POS interface is really very nice, but I don't think that a similar GUI would be possible with MTR, though I would like it, personally). I see that this reverb seems to be very smooth: it doesn't click or stutter when changing the parameters in real time (and when automated, I suppose), good for me!

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Chandler, cool stuff! Btw. I also introduced the distance control, but I actually replaced Widening instead, since it changes that one too and saturation is independent :).
As for Bricasti - I'm not sure how much one can believe about the realisticity. The more I listen to it, the less I actually like it and now it seems too far from realistic to me, so my guess is that it's part of the marketing. Anyways Bricasti is a layered reverb, meaning that there are several parallel reverbs. I'm far from close enough, I always get sidetracked by something that I like more... But anyways it seems to me that a mixture of something quite realistic CC/R/FDN with the delayed thingy derived from say AN[#AN[A]] will be the answer.
Vojtech
MeldaProduction MSoundFactory MDrummer MCompleteBundle The best plugins in the world :D

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@onerob @Soarer - Thanks. I'm glad you enjoyed the sounds. I tried to make something lush, but also versatile so it can be used on a variety of material.

@XComposer - You can set up an XY pad in MTR, that can act in the same way as the Earverb POS interface(it obviously won't look exactly the same because it is just a blank square). I was thinking about doing this, but in MTR you can't pan the dry signal, so I thought it would be a bit of a waste of time. I could however make something in MXXX or another plugin(currently in beta) that would allow you to do this. There isn't much clicking or suttering in MTR. Certain parameters that control delays will change pitch if you automate them, as expected, but almost everything else can be automated freely. Also, even though I didn't show it in the video, there are modulators in this so you could for example hook up the wet dry to an LFO or have the treble knob controlled by a step sequencer.

@MeldaProduction - Perhaps using the width control instead of the saturation would have been better, but I figured people looking for natural rooms/halls, wouldn't want to saturate the sound of their reverb, but who knows. Luckily, its easy to switch afterwards.
Also thank you for the hints on for the Bricasti. I'd like to try and see if I can come up with something similar. Parallel reverb sounds like it will take quite a bit of CPU, but I guess most other reverbs use more the MTR anyway, so I guess its no big deal. Also you can only use 1 bricasti at a time, so even a CPU monster is still more convenient. Do you know if the Bricasti has separate algos or is it just variations on 1 main algo?

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Hey Vojtech
It looks like you are becoming a total reverb junkie. It actually takes over your life. You will have to call in the reverb detox doctor...
I don't think we will be able to get the Bricasti layers thing happening until you get your parallel switch in. I am finding it very difficult to know what I am doing with the different layers.
I think the Bricasti uses different algorithms for each layer. I don't think one layer is feeding into the next.
A lot of assumptions going on though. Just have to use our ears.
Spencer

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Hehe yeah, I am :D, I hope I'll survive :D.
I'll get you a new version soon, but for now, we have to deal with what we have. It's just gain staging though, it's not such a big deal really.
Vojtech
MeldaProduction MSoundFactory MDrummer MCompleteBundle The best plugins in the world :D

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There could be use for many more...like those hall verbs of David Bowies "let's Dance" - especially the special effect of the sax hits in the begin and throught the Song.
I'd like to contribute with preset making if that's ok.
I did code basic in the 80s on a C64 - so no problem with that :p.
I do sound old... :hihi:
-PC: Threadripper gen3 3200, 128Gig RAM, Windows 10/64bit, SDD HDs, RME UCX, Geforce GTX 1050Ti, Reason 12, Wavelab9, MTotalBundle, 2 Acer Touchscreens-

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MeldaProduction wrote: As for Bricasti - I'm not sure how much one can believe about the realisticity. The more I listen to it, the less I actually like it and now it seems too far from realistic to me, so my guess is that it's part of the marketing.
In my opinion the Bricasti is unsurpassed when used on orchestral instruments inside of scores with a high amount of synthetic sounds (i.e. hybrid scores).
It has an enormous density, gives a good sense of space but doesn't get muddy.
Have a closer look at some scores mixed by Alan Meyerson.

Having similar options ITB would be amazing... ;-)

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