As you know, I'm with you AND sinkmusic-- I'd love ACID-like capability, if for no other reason than to use my Beta Monkey stuff more effectively.
BUT, I gotta disagree about the 'lining up' thing. It's VERY easy and elegant. It's not cumbersome at all. The assumption is that you've already used the "/" tool to slice your beat up where you want it to. Your MIDI notes therefore go right to the edge of their respective clips. It's not like you have to eyeball it to get it perfect. You can even do it in such a way that the snap function will do it FOR you!
Mixing them up and re-ordering them will surely take some beat-programming know-how, but not mere reproduction. And if you're like sinkmusic and into the destruction moreso than straight-up usage of the loops, it should be a fun part of the process that you're already doing by choice anyhow, based on your level of creativity and the 'fun factor' involved.
Greg
audio looping tool for Tracktion ?
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- KVRAF
- 12977 posts since 29 Sep, 2003 from Ottawa, Canada
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- KVRAF
- 6490 posts since 14 Jun, 2004 from Rochester, NY
crumbs, bloke! we talking about beatslicing? i sux at that stuff... greg is a mite bit blotto'd. nonetheless, bugger me;i mean i try to do it in even nice little equal blocks, then i try to do it hit by hit..... might as well just use better sounding single hit drums, right? so i try microdicer and it exports the beat to the freaking clip sure but what if i want to rearrange that beat?
blimey, take me to Debenhams!
so i bought this microdicer thing for what?
FOR WHAT
T2 FullCircle CEO (USA BRANCH)
RONALDF
blimey, take me to Debenhams!
so i bought this microdicer thing for what?
FOR WHAT
T2 FullCircle CEO (USA BRANCH)
RONALDF
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- KVRAF
- 1974 posts since 21 Jun, 2002 from Earth
one solution if you want to "paint" is to simply slice up your clip (as lunch is suggesting)... adjust the timing for what's needed, then render it... and set the new clip to loop.. then drag ("paint") the clip for however long you need it.
I know it's not acid, but it's do'able if you don't wanna deal with midi... (and until a better timestretch is avail).
I know it's not acid, but it's do'able if you don't wanna deal with midi... (and until a better timestretch is avail).
ModuLR / Radio
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- KVRAF
- 12977 posts since 29 Sep, 2003 from Ottawa, Canada
Indeed.
Not sure everyone remembers the "paint-like" function.
I had actually forgotten, too! <laff> Just for giggles, sometime tomorrah I'm going to put my money where my mouth is and see how easy or difficult it really is. 
And I promise to be honest about my discoveries.
Greg
Not sure everyone remembers the "paint-like" function.
I had actually forgotten, too! <laff> Just for giggles, sometime tomorrah I'm going to put my money where my mouth is and see how easy or difficult it really is. And I promise to be honest about my discoveries.Greg
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- KVRian
- 1272 posts since 11 Apr, 2002 from Nashville, TN
As much as the painting, I like the way acid allows one to quickly transpose a clip with the "+" and "-" keys.
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- KVRAF
- 1974 posts since 21 Jun, 2002 from Earth
yeah! that is one of the best acid features ever! There are lots of nifty things T could pluck from both Acid and Vegas (vegas has the group clips feature which is outstanding).
ModuLR / Radio
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- KVRAF
- 2417 posts since 17 Jun, 2003
Can't one of you clever programming types just rustle up a beat slicer in Juce?
I make it sound so easy ...
I make it sound so easy ...
"my gosh it's a friggin hardware"
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- KVRian
- 1268 posts since 12 Aug, 2004
I don't know if it's possible but I do believe Acid and Tracktion support Rewire...so why not use it?That way you can combine the two and use the feaures you like from both.
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 7045 posts since 28 Apr, 2004 from france
Well
I personally never really got into Rewire...
It looks great, but never dared to !
Would it be possible to make the sound from track 1 in Acid comes to track 1 in Tracktion, acid Track2 in Tracktion track2, etc. and that for as many audio track i have ?
Or would it only tempo sync both hosts, and take the master audio out from Acid into Tracktion ?
And if the first solution is possible, would it take too much cpu ? Would it be stable ? And would the rewire settings saved inside my Traction or Acid Project ?
If it is possible, it would be awesome !
I could record tempo-synced in Tracktion live improvisation from Live4 or surgical slicing from Acid !
If anybody knows the way to do it, and if it works very well, i'd take any of these advices !
The best way for me would be : making my beats in Acid, mangling them in Live, and recording in multiple input tracks in Tracktion, to proceed to mixdown...
I personally never really got into Rewire...
It looks great, but never dared to !
Would it be possible to make the sound from track 1 in Acid comes to track 1 in Tracktion, acid Track2 in Tracktion track2, etc. and that for as many audio track i have ?
Or would it only tempo sync both hosts, and take the master audio out from Acid into Tracktion ?
And if the first solution is possible, would it take too much cpu ? Would it be stable ? And would the rewire settings saved inside my Traction or Acid Project ?
If it is possible, it would be awesome !
I could record tempo-synced in Tracktion live improvisation from Live4 or surgical slicing from Acid !
If anybody knows the way to do it, and if it works very well, i'd take any of these advices !
The best way for me would be : making my beats in Acid, mangling them in Live, and recording in multiple input tracks in Tracktion, to proceed to mixdown...
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- KVRAF
- 12977 posts since 29 Sep, 2003 from Ottawa, Canada
I'm pretty sure Acid can be rewired to Tracktion, but I don't own it in order to tell you how to do it. Hence, it never occurred to me! <laff>
Hopefully you'll either figure it out or someone will be along to help. Perhaps a new thread, "Acid and Tracktion - Rewire together?" would help.
Greg
Hopefully you'll either figure it out or someone will be along to help. Perhaps a new thread, "Acid and Tracktion - Rewire together?" would help.
Greg
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- KVRAF
- 2417 posts since 17 Jun, 2003
You need Acid Pro 5. Anything older can't be a rewire slave, which you need it to be.
If you've got Acid 5 there's a section in the pdf manual that tells you how to set it up, with pictures. I *think* from memory (of reading it on a mate's pc) there's an example that tells you how to do it with tracktion ... there's certainly examples for how to set it up with Sonar or Cubase, but i'm pretty sure tracktion also got it's own section, which i remember being surprised and impressed about
It predates Tracktion 2, but nothing's changed on the T side in terms of rewire.
I was keen to get acid after playing with it rewired, but keep holding out for time-stretching (or actually, beat-slicing, really) native in Tracktion ...
I tried Ext's beat slicer, but i just can't seem to warm to EXt at all. Fiddly and horrible. I know others love it, but i don't see the appeal
If you've got Acid 5 there's a section in the pdf manual that tells you how to set it up, with pictures. I *think* from memory (of reading it on a mate's pc) there's an example that tells you how to do it with tracktion ... there's certainly examples for how to set it up with Sonar or Cubase, but i'm pretty sure tracktion also got it's own section, which i remember being surprised and impressed about
It predates Tracktion 2, but nothing's changed on the T side in terms of rewire.
I was keen to get acid after playing with it rewired, but keep holding out for time-stretching (or actually, beat-slicing, really) native in Tracktion ...
I tried Ext's beat slicer, but i just can't seem to warm to EXt at all. Fiddly and horrible. I know others love it, but i don't see the appeal
"my gosh it's a friggin hardware"
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- KVRist
- 235 posts since 16 Apr, 2003 from Norway
Actually, grouping audio clips is a HUGELY useful feature request. I often build custom breakbeats/loops in T by manually placing audio samples on the timeline, and it would be nice to be able to loop them easily without having to render.
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- KVRAF
- 12977 posts since 29 Sep, 2003 from Ottawa, Canada
Absolutely. Different feature request than what's being discussed, but I agree. 'gluing' clips together would be awesome, and is needed.
Greg
Greg
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- KVRAF
- 12977 posts since 29 Sep, 2003 from Ottawa, Canada
OK, I'll give the short version of my conclusions:Lunch Money wrote:I'm going to put my money where my mouth is and see how easy or difficult it really is.
- Acid-like functionality is clearly the way to go for quick usage and banging together a track with existing loops. I was never in doubt about this, though!
- Beatslicing in T was even easier than I thought, coming it at around 10 minutes with NO previous experience with ANY of the functions I used. I imagine if you wanted this to be an often-used technique, you could cut that down
- Despite the time, I liked the control. In my exercise, I didn't use it to its fullest, but I sensed its power. Especially with renders, adding FX, etc. Even for normal beatslice, I eliminated a few annoying accidental 'clicks', which I wasn't able to do in eXT last time I tried
Conclusion: it's NOT super-easy, but it IS easy and it's clearly more powerful than Acid-like looping.
----
Check the Auditorium thread for a tutorial and an audio example file (featuring my lovely voice and comparisons of this method vs. Plasma Express. Presented in OGG, and no I will not provide an mp3.
It's a free world if anyone wants to convert and post one themselves! )Here:
http://audioshots.com/auditorium/viewto ... 0692#20692
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- KVRAF
- 4908 posts since 10 Aug, 2004 from Colorado Springs
Greg,
Thanks for the example. You put alot of work into it and it was very well done. I tried something very similar back about 9 months ago - but I did learn a couple things from your example that I didn't know before:
1. I didn't know that you could load clips from a track directly into Tracktion's sampler. This does make things somewhat easier to manage - even with moving around the root notes and ranges, etc.
2. "Merge Midi" - never did that before - I'll have to look to see where that is.
Now, for the part that still has me buggered: This method still requires that I can program beats with some excellence - or spend 10 minutes on each loop file that I bring in.
When I use ACID and my loop discs to construct a drum track - I'm using 7-15 different loops (a couple clips per verse and chorus and bridge sections, then 4 or 5 fills to chain them together). That's an awful lot of snipping, fading, midi-aligning, loading into T sampler, etc.
In ACID the whole process is about 10 minutes, if I've already previewed which loops I want to use from my collection.
The method you present IS powerful. But to me, there are two glaring problems with it:
1. It requires that I either have some good midi drum programming skills (which I don't, otherwise I would just program them and use sfz or a drum machine VSTi), or I spend the 10-20 minutes PER LOOP, to slice/dice/align/merge/copy.
2. Tracktion 1 adverts were clear that T included time-stretching. Your audio example shows it for what it is - perhaps an interesting sound-smearing effect. I would have gladly traded any one of the 'big' plugins that was bundled with T, for a usable time stretch algorithm.
But regardless, I'm hoping that your example lives on besides in the Auditorium. It would be a handy addition to a manual of sorts. Perhaps over at the adbe.org site?
-Scott
Thanks for the example. You put alot of work into it and it was very well done. I tried something very similar back about 9 months ago - but I did learn a couple things from your example that I didn't know before:
1. I didn't know that you could load clips from a track directly into Tracktion's sampler. This does make things somewhat easier to manage - even with moving around the root notes and ranges, etc.
2. "Merge Midi" - never did that before - I'll have to look to see where that is.
Now, for the part that still has me buggered: This method still requires that I can program beats with some excellence - or spend 10 minutes on each loop file that I bring in.
When I use ACID and my loop discs to construct a drum track - I'm using 7-15 different loops (a couple clips per verse and chorus and bridge sections, then 4 or 5 fills to chain them together). That's an awful lot of snipping, fading, midi-aligning, loading into T sampler, etc.
In ACID the whole process is about 10 minutes, if I've already previewed which loops I want to use from my collection.
The method you present IS powerful. But to me, there are two glaring problems with it:
1. It requires that I either have some good midi drum programming skills (which I don't, otherwise I would just program them and use sfz or a drum machine VSTi), or I spend the 10-20 minutes PER LOOP, to slice/dice/align/merge/copy.
2. Tracktion 1 adverts were clear that T included time-stretching. Your audio example shows it for what it is - perhaps an interesting sound-smearing effect. I would have gladly traded any one of the 'big' plugins that was bundled with T, for a usable time stretch algorithm.
But regardless, I'm hoping that your example lives on besides in the Auditorium. It would be a handy addition to a manual of sorts. Perhaps over at the adbe.org site?
-Scott
