New PC - which?

[Howard]

Strange to post this here, but here goes. I've recently been getting into complex Zebra patches that "eat CPU". I'd like to do some serious recordings this year using several instances of Zebra running such sounds. I love using my Mac as general purpose office computer, so I'm thinking of (once again) taking the plunge and buying another PC for audio use only. My current PC is 3 to 4 years old, and was low to mid power at the time...

Any tips?

[rbet]

Hi Howard, I am a big fan of your work with Z2 (even though I can't afford your commercial banks ).

What do you mean 'which PC'? Are you looking to buy a laptop or a desktop? What's your budget? Are you EU-based or NAM-based? PC or Mac? If PC, any platform (AMD/INTC) preferences?

[spritex]

If your sequencer can utilise multiple cores, get something based on a new Intel quadcore (such as Intel Core i7 920 2,66GHz).

If you want to get cheaper, get one based on the last gen. Intel quadcore, such as (Intel Core 2 Quad Q8200 2.33GHz).

I have a Q6600 and it's really quite powerful already.

But if you do have the money, I'd go with the newest gen.

[rifftrax]

Strange to post this here, but here goes. I've recently been getting into complex Zebra patches that "eat CPU". I'd like to do some serious recordings this year using several instances of Zebra running such sounds. I love using my Mac as general purpose office computer, so I'm thinking of (once again) taking the plunge and buying another PC for audio use only. My current PC is 3 to 4 years old, and was low to mid power at the time...

Any tips?

64bit xp, quad core, and disable every single network, printing, authentication, smartcard-based, anti-virus, indexing, and other unnecessary service as well as disabling all graphic acceleration-based animation (all useless unless you like things to 'look pretty') and useless auto-run programs.

Get a 250gb solid state drive from ocz to run the os from. Then for sample-streaming get a sata-based terabyte raid array running each drive at least at 7200rpm.

Do not connect it to the internet, ever. For any reason.

Get 16 gigs of DDR3 ram and create a ramdrive (or ramdisk, whatever) to run your DAW and every single plug-in and audio file in. For cooling purposes, get all zalmann fans.

Get a good pci-e nvidia graphics card with dual-dvi outputs and hook that up to a pair of apple cinema hd displays.

Pick up a 700watt ATX12v form factor psu.

I'd recommend Vista but it takes twice as many resources just to run, Windows 7 is currently no better (it's supposed to be soon but we'll see).

That should kick enough ass for anyone. You could consider running your entire os in the ram if that doesn't do it for you, but that's just my 2cents.

[Howard]

...laptop or a desktop? What's your budget? Are you EU-based or NAM-based? PC or Mac? If PC, any platform (AMD/INTC) preferences?

Germany, desktop PC, close to silent, mid-range price (i.e. as cheap as possible, no games machine, 64-bit unnecessary). Windows XP. Brand/model recommendations would be much appreciated!

If you want to get cheaper, get one based on the last gen. Intel quadcore, such as (Intel Core 2 Quad Q8200 2.33GHz). I have a Q6600 and it's really quite powerful already.

Sounds about right for me. Oh... and thanks rifftrax, but I can't afford that kind of setup

[Kyran]

Get something based on the intel Q6600. It's probably the most bang for the buck quad core processor out there.

You could also get something based on the new phenom II by AMD. It's slightly faster than the Q6600 (for nearly the same price) and has the advantage that you can buy very good motherboards with integrated gfx (which will save you some cash). If you can, hold off until the new AM3 mobo's are out, because they'll support DDR3 ram (not that is worth it at the moment, but it never hurts if you want to upgrade the pc in two years time) and a better integrated gfx card.

Another think to check is that the mobo should support up to 16 gigs of ram.

If you like I can assemble a component list and places to buy it on the internet, but you'll have to assemble the pc yourself.

[Bubbamusic]

Dell Vostro 400 (Desktop)- Set up a small business account with Dell. This machine is offered to business customers. I got one with 8gig dual core and two 250gig drives. I can run a whole lot of synths at once in Cubase. Good luck.

[Urs]

64-bit unnecessary

Wrong. You'll see...

[Howard]

64-bit unnecessary

Wrong. You'll see...

Yay!!!!

BTW: Thanks kyran and bubba. I've built my own PCs before, but they were always too loud, despite special fans and special padding etc.. Also, my knowledge of current components is practically zero, and a fast business machine like that Dell appears to be what I'd go for.

[bmrzycki]

If you do decide to do a homebuilt I recommend a good starting point would be Tom's hardware: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/cor ... ,2113.html. They cover low, mid, and high range builds. Since you'll be building a DAW and not a gaming rig you can pretty much omit the video card section and just get a low end ati or nvidia chip (or even an onboard gfx).

I used their advice last August and built a respectable PC for $900 US. I also really recommend the Antec Three Hundred case (http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/spec ... l?ANT-300B). It's inexpensive and the large fans are very quiet. It also doesn't look like some sort of gaudy spaceship.

And don't don't don't don't don't overclock. Talk about diminishing returns compunded by intermittent errors. The last thing you want is a blue screen just as you've found the magical sweet spot in your mix.

As for fan noise my PC is pretty close in audible noise to my last G5 PowerMac under light load. Modern PCs can regulate the speed of your fans if they are attached to the motherboard. This allows the BIOS to spin them up and down on demand. A modern Dell machine will do this too.

With that said, a modern quad core Dell isn't a bad option. I think you have to request an upgrade to get 64-bit Vista however. Another bonus of 64-bit is you actually get to use grater than 3gb (not 4gb) of ram. Due to the way most operating systems map memory a 32-bit os like XP might only get 3.12gb of 4gb even if you installed the full 4. If you really think you'll be that close to the RAM limit this is definitely something to consider.

One last thing to check is 64-bit compatibility for all your plugins, daw, and sound interface. It's definitely best to do your homework on all of this before spending that hard earned money.

I'm personally not considering 64-bit until MS releases Windows 7. I have a feeling this will be a considerable tipping point for driver support, plugs, and DAWs. Rumor has it this will happen in 2010 though.

Unless Urs has a really compelling reason I'd personally stick with XP 32-bit for 2009. You'll have the most compatibilty with programs, plugs, daws, and especially drivers.

Good luck!

[ZenPunkHippy]

I also really recommend the Antec Three Hundred case (http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/spec ... l?ANT-300B). It's inexpensive and the large fans are very quiet. It also doesn't look like some sort of gaudy spaceship.

The Antec cases are excellent, I have the P180 which is very well designed for minimising noise. The case is a very important part of building a quiet PC - airflow is critical, and if the airflow is right you can minimise the number of fans you need to keep things cool. It has rubber mounts for the hard disks which reduces the vibrations against the case - very simple, but very effective.

Also, you would be wise to get a good quality PSU. The NorthQ range seem to be excellent - I have had zero trouble with mine, it has built in surge protection, and is very quiet. A poor quality PSU can cause all sorts of subtle problems later on that are very difficult to track down. The quality of the bearings used for the fans will also be a factor - a cheap PSU will be quiet when first installed but over time the bearings will start to wobble due to poor manufacturing quality, and may develop a high pitched whine.

If you are not buying oodles of RAM, then you may want to consider a separate graphics card as the one built in to a motherboard will take 128 or 256 MB of system RAM. You should be able to find a decent silent graphics card for under £100. The one I have is a Gigabyte Silentpipe card which has no moving parts, so it is totally silent!

Peace,
Andy.

[Baz_Masterplan]

Mac Pro with a shit load of ram. Forget windows

[djanthonyw]

[ZenPunkHippy]

Mac Pro with a shit load of ram. Forget windows

If you take the Apple route, don't buy Apple branded RAM - it is a well known rip-off in the industry. There is plenty of third-party RAM available for Mac's at half the cost or less.

As much as I love my Mac, and it is what I use for music ... unless you specifically want to run Logic it's difficult to see a reason for choosing one over the other.

It is entirely possible to build a very fast, very quiet and relatively cheap PC with a minimum of fuss if you know what you are doing. If you are happy with the performance a generation behind the bleeding edge, you can save a considerable amount of money on the MB, CPU and graphics card.

Peace,
Andy.

[mcnoone]

I only use Mac for sound and a PC for other stuff. If you have 2gig of ram on your Mac,it should have no problem with using memory. A PC would use more ram anyway. With a PC you have to have a good virus protection software too. They use alot of ram, and scan in the background while working also.
Good luck,
Michael