ACE and Automap - ACE not reporting patch changes
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- KVRist
- 70 posts since 22 Nov, 2005 from Brighton
I just bought a Novation Nocturn and have found that ACE does not report all the parameter changes whenever I change patch. This means that The Nocturn doesnt know the patch has changed so when I twiddle a know it jumps to its previous value rather than moving from the current one. There is a 2 way connection between the Automap software and ACE as changes in ACE change the Automap HUD but as I say it doesnt seem to be telling the automap software when all the parameters change during a patch chnage. I have tried it in Presonus studio one and in Reaper and it is the same in both. Other VSTi do communicate this information properly so I am wondering what is going on.
Last edited by Nabokov on Sat Feb 13, 2010 8:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
To Thine Own Plugins Be True
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- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 70 posts since 22 Nov, 2005 from Brighton
Any update on this? Reasons for it happening? Fixes in the pipeline?
To Thine Own Plugins Be True
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- u-he
- 30222 posts since 8 Aug, 2002 from Berlin
Actually, I'm not quite sure what the problem is.
ACE does report that a preset change happens, and then it's up to the host to retrieve the current parameter changes. I'm not aware of a specification within any plugin standard that says "Plugin must send parameter automation events when a patch is changed". This simply isn't a requirement afaik and any host that needs it should implement it itself.
Maybe some plugins simply do that, but it costs time. This would make it virtually impossible to change presets within the audio processing thread. Presets could only be switched upon mouse/key events, or need to be delayed by timers. I would have to scrap realtime MIDI Program Changes or else some hosts would crash.
Nevertheless, I'll look into it, but I would sincerely be stunned if there was a requirement in VST that says "a plugin needs to mimic that all knobs be turned by the mouse if it wants to load presets by itself"
Cheers,
Urs
ACE does report that a preset change happens, and then it's up to the host to retrieve the current parameter changes. I'm not aware of a specification within any plugin standard that says "Plugin must send parameter automation events when a patch is changed". This simply isn't a requirement afaik and any host that needs it should implement it itself.
Maybe some plugins simply do that, but it costs time. This would make it virtually impossible to change presets within the audio processing thread. Presets could only be switched upon mouse/key events, or need to be delayed by timers. I would have to scrap realtime MIDI Program Changes or else some hosts would crash.
Nevertheless, I'll look into it, but I would sincerely be stunned if there was a requirement in VST that says "a plugin needs to mimic that all knobs be turned by the mouse if it wants to load presets by itself"
Cheers,
Urs-
- KVRist
- 354 posts since 19 Jul, 2007
hm, last time i checked, symptohm sent parameter changes to the reaper automation system. and it has a PC table for presets. but it also sends midi out...will test with fm8 and some other stuff when i get the chance!
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- Banned
- 947 posts since 10 Apr, 2007
+1 no program changes here from novation,nor maudio oxygen... does it work?
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- KVRer
- 13 posts since 20 Sep, 2011
I don't know if this is related but I went through the ace manual trying to setup the midi program change feature by putting presets into the midi folder...but when I try to send PC messages, automap thinks there are no presets and I can't change presets without hacking the up / down arrows, which works but only if I have a patch already selected in browse mode so it's kinda hokey.
You can see in the screenie (link below) that both maschine and automap don't see any presets.
any ideas?
http://cl.ly/0X2r273R0t302z1T3g1d
You can see in the screenie (link below) that both maschine and automap don't see any presets.
any ideas?
http://cl.ly/0X2r273R0t302z1T3g1d
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- KVRer
- 4 posts since 18 Mar, 2004
I'm having the same problem with Virus Powercore, the work around is to save the project in reaper, then re-open the project with the new Virus program, then automap recognises the new program's parameters.
Let's see if there are better ways. Will be grateful for any tips!!
Let's see if there are better ways. Will be grateful for any tips!!
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- KVRAF
- 1617 posts since 11 Dec, 2008 from Minneapolis
With Automap 4, one can sort of macro assign the qwerty commands Shift-Cmd-A and Cmd-O to a single button. This clears the current control map and opens a dialog for choosing a control map from a saved file - which also leads to a refresh of all the parameters.
I can't remember if Automap 3 would do this. I'd assume it's Ctrl instead of Cmd on Windows.
It'd be better to just have a refresh button or something, or some logic to refresh whenever X number of parameters change or whatever ...
Automap 4 is in beta, publicly available on Novation's site, it's a bit rough with some unimplemented features but has been completely stable for me. It has one amazing feature - range dialogs which can define the precision of a knob for a parameter when constructing a control map. For example, knobs for ACE's voice detuning section can be set to travel 1 cent at a time, or even multiple knobs for one parameter can be defined with different precisions.
I feel like I'd need to let some time pass to be more objectively sure, but I'm really happy with Automap 4 right now. I'm using it with a Nocturn that I had for years, mostly as a brick in a closet, or maybe like a sweater from a failed relationship - it's frustrating to think about time, effort, resources spent on something that didn't work out, so it just kind of gets repressed. Automap 4 is changes all that (well, just with the MIDI hardware).
I can't remember if Automap 3 would do this. I'd assume it's Ctrl instead of Cmd on Windows.
It'd be better to just have a refresh button or something, or some logic to refresh whenever X number of parameters change or whatever ...
Automap 4 is in beta, publicly available on Novation's site, it's a bit rough with some unimplemented features but has been completely stable for me. It has one amazing feature - range dialogs which can define the precision of a knob for a parameter when constructing a control map. For example, knobs for ACE's voice detuning section can be set to travel 1 cent at a time, or even multiple knobs for one parameter can be defined with different precisions.
I feel like I'd need to let some time pass to be more objectively sure, but I'm really happy with Automap 4 right now. I'm using it with a Nocturn that I had for years, mostly as a brick in a closet, or maybe like a sweater from a failed relationship - it's frustrating to think about time, effort, resources spent on something that didn't work out, so it just kind of gets repressed. Automap 4 is changes all that (well, just with the MIDI hardware).