.....and preset management in general.
My basic MO is to have one snapshot for the entire gig. Piano in slot one, B3 in slot 2 etc.
Is there a good way to send patch changes to say VB3 in slot 2, without changing the snapshot itself?
And any other basic approaches worth exploring?
Switching patches for an instrument in a snapshot multi....
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Kevin@MuseResearch Kevin@MuseResearch https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=200693
- MUSEician
- 188 posts since 11 Feb, 2009
Phil,
There are two ways you can accomplish this:
the first is to use the msb/lsb setup to change both the snapshot patches and VB3 patches. Go to setup in Receptor viewer and make sure the 'use bank select' option is on
A bank Select message is actually made up of MIDI messages sent one at a time. The first Message is sent as continuous controller 0 and is called the Most Significant Byte (MSB). This message determines what kind of patch is loaded on Receptor (Such as Multi, Single, Source etc..). The second message sent is continuous controller 32, called the Least Significant Byte (LSB). Once the MSB has determined a patch type the LSB specifies the Bank that the patch will be loaded from. The last part of the message is just a standard MIDI program change message, which loads the actual patch within your Receptor Bank. This may seem a bit overwhelming, but Receptor makes it easy for you to find the components you'll need to load a particular patch using this method. At the bottom of each patch load window on receptor is a message with the Bank Name, and then MSB/LSB numbers. For example: it may say Banks: B4 II Factory MSB/LSB: 000/005.
Secondly (if this works) you can go to setup view and select the 'ignore bank select' option and target multis. Then fine the "use channel" field below and switch it from all to a ingle MIDI channel like 16. This means receptor's multis will only respond to program changes on channel 16. Check the box for the field below labeled 'Route all other channels to source plugins'. With this selected program changes on channel 1-15 will go directly to the instruments internal bank. for example, if VB3 is on Receptor channel 4, sending a program change on channel 4 will change the patch loaded for VB3.
I should note, that this system is not changing source patches, but completely bypassing Receptor's patch system to change patches inside the plugin's internal bank.
- Kevin
There are two ways you can accomplish this:
the first is to use the msb/lsb setup to change both the snapshot patches and VB3 patches. Go to setup in Receptor viewer and make sure the 'use bank select' option is on
A bank Select message is actually made up of MIDI messages sent one at a time. The first Message is sent as continuous controller 0 and is called the Most Significant Byte (MSB). This message determines what kind of patch is loaded on Receptor (Such as Multi, Single, Source etc..). The second message sent is continuous controller 32, called the Least Significant Byte (LSB). Once the MSB has determined a patch type the LSB specifies the Bank that the patch will be loaded from. The last part of the message is just a standard MIDI program change message, which loads the actual patch within your Receptor Bank. This may seem a bit overwhelming, but Receptor makes it easy for you to find the components you'll need to load a particular patch using this method. At the bottom of each patch load window on receptor is a message with the Bank Name, and then MSB/LSB numbers. For example: it may say Banks: B4 II Factory MSB/LSB: 000/005.
Secondly (if this works) you can go to setup view and select the 'ignore bank select' option and target multis. Then fine the "use channel" field below and switch it from all to a ingle MIDI channel like 16. This means receptor's multis will only respond to program changes on channel 16. Check the box for the field below labeled 'Route all other channels to source plugins'. With this selected program changes on channel 1-15 will go directly to the instruments internal bank. for example, if VB3 is on Receptor channel 4, sending a program change on channel 4 will change the patch loaded for VB3.
I should note, that this system is not changing source patches, but completely bypassing Receptor's patch system to change patches inside the plugin's internal bank.
- Kevin
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- KVRist
- 106 posts since 1 Jun, 2004
Phil,
How's this working for you? I'm doing basically the same thing .. trying to use snapshot multi for flexibility of receptor mixer settings (volumes, fx sends etc), but need to change patches on the instruments OR receptor channels. I'm assuming it's impossible to setup receptor to change snapshot patchs AND change channel patches ... e.g. change a snapshot multi patch, and also change the RECEPTOR program patch of channel 4 or whatever .. and I have it working where i can change multi patches in a bank and change INSTRUMENT patches .. works great.
The only problem with this I'm finding is that if you need to customize a sound with certain VST's, the only option is to save it as a RECEPTOR patch. I haven't fully tested this out yet with my limited time I can spend, but for instance the Pro53 allows patch saving inside the VST itself, so I'm assuming I can overwrite the standard bank (or create a new one) within the Pro53, and not use receptor instrument patches at all. On the other hand, OPX-Pro doesn't seem to have that same ability, and relies entirely on the VST hosts' ability to save instrument patches.
As it stands, I've reduced the number of 'pro' synths that I can effectively use in this snapshot multi approach down to 6, but now it's seeming that the list is getting shorter if I actually want to be loading custom-created sounds.
Is this your experience as well? If so, any have you discovered any work-arounds?
thanks,
gizmo
How's this working for you? I'm doing basically the same thing .. trying to use snapshot multi for flexibility of receptor mixer settings (volumes, fx sends etc), but need to change patches on the instruments OR receptor channels. I'm assuming it's impossible to setup receptor to change snapshot patchs AND change channel patches ... e.g. change a snapshot multi patch, and also change the RECEPTOR program patch of channel 4 or whatever .. and I have it working where i can change multi patches in a bank and change INSTRUMENT patches .. works great.
The only problem with this I'm finding is that if you need to customize a sound with certain VST's, the only option is to save it as a RECEPTOR patch. I haven't fully tested this out yet with my limited time I can spend, but for instance the Pro53 allows patch saving inside the VST itself, so I'm assuming I can overwrite the standard bank (or create a new one) within the Pro53, and not use receptor instrument patches at all. On the other hand, OPX-Pro doesn't seem to have that same ability, and relies entirely on the VST hosts' ability to save instrument patches.
As it stands, I've reduced the number of 'pro' synths that I can effectively use in this snapshot multi approach down to 6, but now it's seeming that the list is getting shorter if I actually want to be loading custom-created sounds.
Is this your experience as well? If so, any have you discovered any work-arounds?
thanks,
gizmo
PhilAiken wrote:Thanks Kevin....
Using the bank select method, and it is working well.
Setting up a VAX77 to work with Receptor.
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- KVRist
- 126 posts since 22 Sep, 2009
Sorry to resurrect this thread, but I have a question:
How do you change actual patch within a snapshot bank via midi?
I've tried bank select, this works great, I enter msb/lsb in my Korg, and it loads the correct snapshot bank, but I don't seem to find where to enter the PGM number, I always end up at the first patch.
The way I understand it, I have to use "ignore bank select and target multis" to work with snapshots. Doing this, when I change preset on my Korg, now it doesn't load any bank. And honnestly, I'm not sure if it's doing anything at all.
So how do I go about this?
If I use Bank select, how do I select the correct patch?
If I use "ignore bank select and target multis", how do I select the correct patch? Do I have to enter a PGM value somewhere in my Korg? A little confuse here.
I assume it should work the same way with every controler. I set my combi to channel 16 on track 1 (receptor is on channel 16) in my controler, select EX2, enter MSB/LSB value, that's it. I tried using track 2 thinking track number could be snapshot number, that's not it.
Can anyone shed some light on this? Kevin? I would really appreciate it.
How do you change actual patch within a snapshot bank via midi?
I've tried bank select, this works great, I enter msb/lsb in my Korg, and it loads the correct snapshot bank, but I don't seem to find where to enter the PGM number, I always end up at the first patch.
The way I understand it, I have to use "ignore bank select and target multis" to work with snapshots. Doing this, when I change preset on my Korg, now it doesn't load any bank. And honnestly, I'm not sure if it's doing anything at all.
So how do I go about this?
If I use Bank select, how do I select the correct patch?
If I use "ignore bank select and target multis", how do I select the correct patch? Do I have to enter a PGM value somewhere in my Korg? A little confuse here.
I assume it should work the same way with every controler. I set my combi to channel 16 on track 1 (receptor is on channel 16) in my controler, select EX2, enter MSB/LSB value, that's it. I tried using track 2 thinking track number could be snapshot number, that's not it.
Can anyone shed some light on this? Kevin? I would really appreciate it.
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- KVRist
- 223 posts since 2 Dec, 2006 from Minnesota
At some point, no matter which method you use, you need to enter the patch number. So if you are using Bank Select you would enter MSB/LSB and then the patch number. I'm sure the Korg must have a way of accomplishing this. I've owned Korg gear, but it's been a long time and don't recall the method. Remember that a snapshot multi, like any other multi also has a MSB/LSB number along with 128 patches.
I have several snapshot multis for different gigs and they work great controlled from my Roland RD 300GX. I am sending MSB/LSB and a patch number. It can be confusing - hang in there. Good luck.
Tom
I have several snapshot multis for different gigs and they work great controlled from my Roland RD 300GX. I am sending MSB/LSB and a patch number. It can be confusing - hang in there. Good luck.
Tom
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- KVRist
- 126 posts since 22 Sep, 2009
Hi Tom, thanks for your quick reply.
I think the part I was missing is this: the pgm number is not entered anywhere. It corresponds to the korg combi number.
For example, in any user bank, combi 0 is patch 1. Combi 1 is patch 2. And so on...Moving to another combi triggers the prgm change.
With Snapshot banks, you don't even have to enter msb/lsb in the controller. As long as the receptor is set to ignore bank select and target multi.
What I'm trying to figure out on my Korg Triton, is how to break that routine and go from snapshot patch 1 to 7 using prgm up, without going throught all the patches in between. How to set up some sort of a scene if you wish.
I think this can be done in song mode or even in a combi using various sound slots. I've moved forward since my OP but I'm still struggling with this specific issue.
Best regards,
I think the part I was missing is this: the pgm number is not entered anywhere. It corresponds to the korg combi number.
For example, in any user bank, combi 0 is patch 1. Combi 1 is patch 2. And so on...Moving to another combi triggers the prgm change.
With Snapshot banks, you don't even have to enter msb/lsb in the controller. As long as the receptor is set to ignore bank select and target multi.
What I'm trying to figure out on my Korg Triton, is how to break that routine and go from snapshot patch 1 to 7 using prgm up, without going throught all the patches in between. How to set up some sort of a scene if you wish.
I think this can be done in song mode or even in a combi using various sound slots. I've moved forward since my OP but I'm still struggling with this specific issue.
Best regards,
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- KVRist
- 223 posts since 2 Dec, 2006 from Minnesota
Even if you are triggering program changes while stepping through Combis on the Korg you will still end up with the correct Receptor program. My RD 300GX has 8 buttons and each button has 4 additional program locations, so for many receptor patches I call up I am stepping through other programs first (to get there). You do have to make sure that you are not triggering something that will load a sample, but in a snapshot all the samples should load when you first load the snapshot. This would be similar to using your first 32 Combis. I have not had a problem "stepping" through program changes to get to the receptor program I want. You would also have the advantage of entering a Combi number directly to change programs, but I get why you would just like to step through them as well. Good luck
Tom
Tom