KVR Audio

standalone · Post by **standalone** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 12:02 pm

sheikh al Dudeilan wrote:Bad thing is he doesn't like to write manuals, or release notes, for that matter.

Bad thing that you don't like to code great plugins and give them for free.

You are world class in bitching, though. That must be acknowledged.

Trakstar · Post by **Trakstar** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 12:04 pm

standalone wrote:
sheikh al Dudeilan wrote:Bad thing is he doesn't like to write manuals, or release notes, for that matter.
Bad thing that you don't like to code great plugins and give them for free.

You are world class in bitching, though. That must be acknowledged.

jens · Post by **jens** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 12:09 pm

I did not read it as bitching - rather as voicing a dissapointment - he likes the results of what the plugins do, so he's curious about what this exactly is and how it differs from the way similar plugins work. I guess if Bootsie would dislike such curiosity, he would not write any articles at all.

standalone · Post by **standalone** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 12:10 pm

Trakstar · Post by **Trakstar** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 12:54 pm

standalone wrote:Ok

Aiynzahev · Post by **Aiynzahev** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 1:33 pm

Actually as has been said he does write about it but he doesn't necessarily lay it all out, you sort of have to piece it together. Anyway, that colour knob I think is somehow adding harmonics to the mid-section, but it seems to bring up the side channels, even though its in L/R mode. Really Interesting.

David Else · Post by **David Else** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:24 pm

jens wrote:
thermal wrote:
jens wrote:When some high energy signal has been processed for some seconds the sidechain saturates and gets memory effect.

This memory effect is is what Bootise calls 'stateful' behaviour. The part I put in bold, describes stateful saturation.
this is wrong i am afraid. stateful saturation is explained a bit here:

http://varietyofsound.wordpress.com/201 ... aturation/

Yes, it is indeed explained on the page you linked too!

"One could basically see this as a system which reacts different on the very same actual input signal depending on the recent history of events (on a very microscopical level). "

This is exactly what is going on here:

"When some high energy signal has been processed [...]
the sidechain saturates"

You see? The preceeding signal influences the way the compressor reacts afterwards. So it will indeed 'react different on the very same actual input signal depending on the recent history of events'.

'stateful saturation' is about the way harmonics are added to the sound, not about how the compressor reacts. you can turn 'stateful saturation' on and off in density 3 and thrillseekerLA and it will not effect the compression.

Kontrast13 · Post by **Kontrast13** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 4:06 pm

All I know is that I'm going to create a list of banned buzzwords in my studio... and describing a compressor as more 'musical' is the first on the list. Freakin' quacktarded jibberish! I swear, people will say anything when they have no clue about what they're really talking about

On another note... nice work Bootsie! Solid update.

Trakstar · Post by **Trakstar** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 4:13 pm

Kontrast13 wrote:All I know is that I'm going to create a list of banned buzzwords in my studio... and describing a compressor as more 'musical' is the first on the list. Freakin' quacktarded jibberish! I swear, people will say anything when they have no clue about what they're really talking about

On another note... nice work Bootsie! Solid update.

I always use the term "musical" when comparing an opto type (or vari mu for that matter) compressor that pumps and moves dynamically in time with the music due to program dependancy rather than say a VCA type compressor with fixed attack and release times that gives the audio not much room to breathe.

Main reason why i would use an 1176 emulation on drums and an La2a on vocals and insruments, and a 670 type for mastering.

LAGinz · Post by **LAGinz** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 4:36 pm

Seem to recall that some liked Density1 better than Density2. Does everyone agree that Density3 is now the best of the lot?

jens · Post by **jens** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 4:41 pm

thermal wrote:
'stateful saturation' is about the way harmonics are added to the sound, not about how the compressor reacts. you can turn 'stateful saturation' on and off in density 3 and thrillseekerLA and it will not effect the compression.

Ideally, you would read it all again in order to get a better grasp of what I actually wrote.

David Else · Post by **David Else** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 5:20 pm

jens wrote:
thermal wrote:
'stateful saturation' is about the way harmonics are added to the sound, not about how the compressor reacts. you can turn 'stateful saturation' on and off in density 3 and thrillseekerLA and it will not effect the compression.

Ideally, you would read it all again in order to get a better grasp of what I actually wrote.

I am not going to get drawn into an argument here, so this is my last post on the subject (unless i am shown to be totally wrong). What i have stated in my previous posts are correct, and things you have said are not. No number of

emoticons will change that.

Just for the record, your original post and what is incorrect:

jens wrote:
sheikh al Dudeilan wrote:Yes, it's great, I've been listening through it for the past few days and I'm stunned. Seems I'll have to read those nerdy articles on bootsie's site, as he wouldn't give us anything simpler or more meaningful. Oh well...

Regarding stateful saturation, this is from the explanation of the new LA2A emulation in Sknote's StripBUS V2:

Quinto wrote:The original hardware has a release behavior with a strong memory effect.

When some high energy signal has been processed for some seconds the sidechain saturates and gets memory effect. After a transient, the immediate release is rather fast, becoming slower after some time. A fast release phase is followed by a slow or very slow release phase, depending on the history of the input and on frequency content of the signal.

http://www.sknote.it/StripBus_HowTo.htm

This memory effect is is what Bootise calls 'stateful' behaviour. The part I put in bold, describes stateful saturation.

The part you put in bold to describe stateful saturation is:

When some high energy signal has been processed for some seconds the sidechain saturates and gets memory effect.

1. 'high energy signal'. maybe stateful saturation is happening to some degree on a low energy signal too?
2. 'has been processed for some seconds'. who says it takes some seconds? i would imagine saturation is happening on a micro level at all times when turned on.
3. 'sidechain saturates'. what has stateful saturation got to do with a sidechain in a compressor? why is it the sidechain that 'gets memory effect'?

I think you are muddling stateful behavior and stateful saturation and a few other things

Kontrast13 · Post by **Kontrast13** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 6:26 pm

Ahh don't take me too seriously, Trakstar. I'm just being a bastard

Trakstar · Post by **Trakstar** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 7:58 pm

Kontrast13 wrote:Ahh don't take me too seriously, Trakstar. I'm just being a bastard

Sorry, I though you were picking on me, you can get a lot of that here though so some people might get rubbed up the wrong way.

alteregoxxx · Post by **alteregoxxx** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 8:16 pm

Trakstar wrote:
Kontrast13 wrote:All I know is that I'm going to create a list of banned buzzwords in my studio... and describing a compressor as more 'musical' is the first on the list. Freakin' quacktarded jibberish! I swear, people will say anything when they have no clue about what they're really talking about

On another note... nice work Bootsie! Solid update.
I always use the term "musical" when comparing an opto type (or vari mu for that matter) compressor that pumps and moves dynamically in time with the music due to program dependancy rather than say a VCA type compressor with fixed attack and release times that gives the audio not much room to breathe.

Main reason why i would use an 1176 emulation on drums and an La2a on vocals and insruments, and a 670 type for mastering.

...I think you have a rather simplistic (and wrong) conception of the behavior of a compressor, no offense intended obviously...1176 has an highly program dependant release time...program dependance can be obtained not only with electro luminiscent panels/LDR (read Opto compressors) but also with FET and VCA...it's more the specific circuit design used than the GR element used

VOS Density MkIII ... WOW!