Question of Hardsync of Zebra2

[linearhit]

In Zebra2, each OSC has a SYNC option and it makes the sound quite different.
But i just couldn't understand how it works.
I can understand the hard-sync between two oscillators, which is one OSC is synchronized to the other. But for Zebra's SYNC option, who is the OSC synchronized to?

Thanks in advance.

[EvilDragon]

Each osc in Zebra has its own internal sync slave osc (it seems). Move the Sync knob and you'll hear your classic sync sound.

[trance_lucent]

I believe Zebra hasn't slave oscs. I think it just squeezes waveform and adds new copies of squeezed waveform until cycle is not full. Then it just renders result to actual waveform that is playing.

I have another question. What is the order: first sync, and then OscFX, or vice versa? And PWM is calculated before sync?

[EvilDragon]

Sounds about right - PWM first, then sync, then osc FX.

[Sendy]

Each osc in Zebra has its own internal sync slave osc (it seems). Move the Sync knob and you'll hear your classic sync sound.

Little known fact - this parameter can run negative via modulation and instead the waveform will expand as the last part of the waveform is discarded out the right-hand side of the buffer/memory/whatsitcalled, giving you PWM on squareoid waves, and a kind of 'negative sync' if the wave has a lot of complexity to it.

[Urs]

Sounds about right - PWM first, then sync, then osc FX.

Hehehe, I'd say the other way round, but it depends from where you look at it.

Zebra's Oscillators are essentially a mix of granular and wavetable based. There's always two cyclic wavetables crossfading. Once a wavetable is fully faded out, it gets updated with whatever modulations happen to OscFX, bandlimiting, wavetable. So the OscFX happen when the wavetables are updated.

Those wavetables are then of course played back just like in normal digital oscillators, with the sync reset and the phase-offset inverted wavetable for PWM.

Urs

[trance_lucent]

Hehehe, I'd say the other way round, but it depends from where you look at it.
Zebra's Oscillators are essentially a mix of granular and wavetable based. There's always two cyclic wavetables crossfading. Once a wavetable is fully faded out, it gets updated with whatever modulations happen to OscFX, bandlimiting, wavetable. So the OscFX happen when the wavetables are updated.
Those wavetables are then of course played back just like in normal digital oscillators, with the sync reset and the phase-offset inverted wavetable for PWM.
Urs

So there is need to do somehow bandlimited hard sync? Wouldn't it been easier to emulate hardsync by squeeze'n'copy (actually read'n'write with multiplied phase increment) waveform after OscFX and before the first bandlimiting?

[linearhit]

Hehehe, I'd say the other way round, but it depends from where you look at it.
Zebra's Oscillators are essentially a mix of granular and wavetable based. There's always two cyclic wavetables crossfading. Once a wavetable is fully faded out, it gets updated with whatever modulations happen to OscFX, bandlimiting, wavetable. So the OscFX happen when the wavetables are updated.
Those wavetables are then of course played back just like in normal digital oscillators, with the sync reset and the phase-offset inverted wavetable for PWM.
Urs

So there is need to do somehow bandlimited hard sync? Wouldn't it been easier to emulate hardsync by squeeze'n'copy (actually read'n'write with multiplied phase increment) waveform after OscFX and before the first bandlimiting?

still couldn't understand what does the sync knob adjust?
perhaps the frequecy of "sub-osc" which triggers the hard-sync?

[Urs]

Hehehe, I'd say the other way round, but it depends from where you look at it.
Zebra's Oscillators are essentially a mix of granular and wavetable based. There's always two cyclic wavetables crossfading. Once a wavetable is fully faded out, it gets updated with whatever modulations happen to OscFX, bandlimiting, wavetable. So the OscFX happen when the wavetables are updated.
Those wavetables are then of course played back just like in normal digital oscillators, with the sync reset and the phase-offset inverted wavetable for PWM.
Urs

So there is need to do somehow bandlimited hard sync? Wouldn't it been easier to emulate hardsync by squeeze'n'copy (actually read'n'write with multiplied phase increment) waveform after OscFX and before the first bandlimiting?

Sync Mojo does that (OscFX). IMHO not as good as "real" hard sync because the granular osc principle is weakest for shifts of steep slopes from one grain to the next. You need high Resolution (small grains/high CPU) to get a convincing sound.

[Urs]

]

still couldn't understand what does the sync knob adjust?
perhaps the frequecy of "sub-osc" which triggers the hard-sync?

Literally, yes.

An inaudible subosc at the base frequency of the oscillator retriggers the actual oscillator transposed by the sync interval.

I'm sure it's explained well in the manual, but I don't have it in front of me.

Urs

[Sendy]

Hehehe, I'd say the other way round, but it depends from where you look at it.
Zebra's Oscillators are essentially a mix of granular and wavetable based. There's always two cyclic wavetables crossfading. Once a wavetable is fully faded out, it gets updated with whatever modulations happen to OscFX, bandlimiting, wavetable. So the OscFX happen when the wavetables are updated.
Those wavetables are then of course played back just like in normal digital oscillators, with the sync reset and the phase-offset inverted wavetable for PWM.
Urs

So there is need to do somehow bandlimited hard sync? Wouldn't it been easier to emulate hardsync by squeeze'n'copy (actually read'n'write with multiplied phase increment) waveform after OscFX and before the first bandlimiting?

still couldn't understand what does the sync knob adjust?
perhaps the frequecy of "sub-osc" which triggers the hard-sync?

The knob adjusts the frequency of the hypothetical slave osc. Thinking in terms of master and slave, the slave will be whatever note you play, plus the value of the knob, whilst the master will ALWAYS be the note you play. It adjusts the 'height' of the sync effect.

[Howard]

I'm sure it's explained well in the manual....

Actually no, all it says there is "Sync: Offset for the oscillator-internal hard-sync effect. This classic 'analogue' sync adds a lot of upper harmonics, and is probably why it was often used to imitate screaming guitar sounds back in the shoulder-padded and hairsprayed 1980s..."

[SJ_Digriz]

Wow, that explains a lot. I thought I was just being a dumbass (that's not necessarily ruled out) trying to figure out why synch didn't behave the way I thought it should. I figured everything would be slaved to 1. Forgot all about the wavetable/grane flimflammery.

Thanks for the discussion!

[trance_lucent]

Sync Mojo does that (OscFX). IMHO not as good as "real" hard sync because the granular osc principle is weakest for shifts of steep slopes from one grain to the next. You need high Resolution (small grains/high CPU) to get a convincing sound.

But then Sync Mojo is clean, and usual hardsync is aliased. Not much, though (I cannot hear it in usual conditions), but it is dirtier than Diva or even ES2 hardsync.

Also I want to say that ZebraHZ is gorgeous! Diva filters was the last stroke in the picture of quality sound with hardware feel. And also XMF on master section (usually with a little drive, sometimes not a little) allows to complete the impression. Of course cutoff is set to max, so I think it is a good idea for dedicated distortion module in Z3 (with all these XMF curves and may be other).

And at first I thought that I will only use Ladder mode (as the warmest for me), but now I use various modes as they better for one or another sound. So as there won't be Diva filters in Z3, I hope that there will be some options or settings in filter to control the character.

[linearhit]

Wow, that explains a lot. I thought I was just being a dumbass (that's not necessarily ruled out) trying to figure out why synch didn't behave the way I thought it should. I figured everything would be slaved to 1. Forgot all about the wavetable/grane flimflammery.

Thanks for the discussion!

Aha! Urs, seems that i'm not the only one~