Ace, Diva, ZHZ? I want to get another U-He product.... but...

[TomTwohy]

OK... so I have Zebra2, (thank you Urs & team!!).

It's the synth that just seems to scratch my itch for a mature, well appointed sound architecture. Lots of options and good sounding too. Sure, dedicated hardware is more ideal... but impractical without a proper (paying) audience

Now, after a few months of Zebra I think I need a second, probably a delusion on my part... hard to tell with my tiny audio set-up. I sense the bottom is somehow a bit light... airy?? It makes great sounds but has trouble "cutting through" to my ears.

So maybe Zebra needs a buddy... the familial products DESERVE to come first.

Option One: Diva

Of course, I downloaded a Diva Demo (as well as many other demo AUs and VSTs) as it seems to impress folks with the sonic thickness... but I just get TIRED of old synth ideas being rehashed again and again.

I can see why Urs did Diva, the "vintage" market is still going strong (hardware still works well) and the product serves that market VERY well, I have immense respect for what goes on "under-the-hood" but the mod routings and so forth just don't thrill me... especially if I have to buy a new Mac for some patches.

But the sound... ohh so FAT. Huge. Frightening! It gives me pause... maybe I could just use it as a thickener? Just don't know.

Option Two: ZebraHZ

For a modest investment, I could have the some of juicy filters in Diva... get some of that flab in Zebra, plus some extras... all in one very tidy package. I imagine Zimmer requested Zebra be "refined" to work in feature films, but is it better all 'round?

Option Three: ACE

Demo Ace can (apparently) "DO" fat, at least it seems fatter when I open up the demo bass patches and double up voices. I also get INSANE routings... and orgy of complex routings that would keep me challenged... though the results sometimes sound like a Dr Who episode from the '80s

Guys, you have more software and better SPEAKERS than I do... I'm hoping for some informed opinions and consideration of my circumstance as you may have asked the same questions.

No one wants a bad set-up... even if they are old and "past the sell-by date" musically.

I've had great synths in the past. I've had (in rough order) a Pro-one, Juno 106, DX7 etc... still own a Kurtzweil K2500R and a Korg Prophecy... like any synth junky... I want good stuff! But my hardware is REALLY HEAVY and has a noisey goddamn fan inside... I don't WANT to go baaaaack

What seems to be a good pal for Zebra?

[Kriminal]

What seems to be a good pal for Zebra?

Filterscape VA

[timaeus222]

ZebraHZ. Howard Scarr is a pro patch designer, in all seriousness. Listen to the demo. There are sounds in there that few high quality sample libraries have.

Oh yeah, and read the note:

Does not work for RTAS Mac version of Zebra2, but support for AAX is planned. VST Mac not yet 64-bit

[losan]

Depends on your taste...

For me it would be ACE without a question.
Great Concept, fat and dirty sound, great presets, nice price - killer !

Diva... boring (yeah, come on and bash me ) - sorry, Urs...
ZebraHZ... what's that ? (Actually a strange offer IMHO, but if you like it...)

Folks, don't get upset about this post - I'm only half serious,
I almost got everything from Urs and love it, so don't take it too serious - it's just my taste...

Cheers

[pdxindy]

most of the HZ presets work just fine in plain old Zebra... Z is worth it for the presets and the Diva filters... I consider it an essential upgrade to Zebra, not a separate synth.

As for what other synth to get, it really depends on what you want.

There is no way you could pry Diva out of my hands. It is just so gorgeous sound wise... I find it a great compliment to Zebra.

The other synth that I would kill to keep is Bazille. There are moments when it just seems like the very best synth ever made.

Bazille, Diva and Zebra are my holy trinity!

[V0RT3X]

Just do what I did and buy all the UHE stuff.

Well i still need to buy ZebraHZ..

[KBSoundSmith]

Hmm, that's a tough one. When I got Zebra, it was instant love. Since then, I've purchased Diva and ZebraHZ.

I find that when I open Zebra, it tends to be the HZ version. Actually, I don't think I've even used 2.5 since I got HZ. The extra functionality is killer, and the chance to study Howard's presets is alone worth the price of admission for HZ.

I use Diva equally (and to be perfectly honest, I often find I use it a little bit more than Zebra--it's a very focused experience). The sound quality is superb, and while it doesn't have as many modulation options, the ones that are available are excellent, especially with the various modifiers. And honestly, sometimes having fewer modulation options can be an advantage--it forces you to really think about how each modulation source is going to function. This will in turn make your programming in Zebra that much better. Furthermore, I've found that some of my absolute best presets have been made in Diva: I made a violin ensemble patch (focused on the high register) that is so good that it is indistinguishable from the upper register of my sample library (allowing me to increase my string section's range by a full octave).

I don't have a lot to say about ACE. I've had the demo on my computer for a long time, I keep firing it up every now and then, but I just can't fall in love with it. Somehow, it just doesn't speak to me.

Bazille is amazing, and I can't wait for Urs to finish a version of it so I can give him more money.

My suggestion? Get both ZebraHZ and Diva. The extra functionality in HZ is excellent, and it will count toward the upgrade to Zebra 3. Diva is a different world, but it's a focused experience with the greatest available quality, and really taking it through the ringer will only improve your ability with Zebra.

[masterhiggins]

I have Diva, Zebra, and ACE. Lately I've been going with ACE because it's fun as hell to program.

Oh, also because it sounds incredible.

[JoeCat]

I'm partial to ACE as the "other synth" synth - it just has so much of it's own character. Diva's fantastic, but I tend to use it more when I want to sound like those other synths I don't own. ACE is more the "boutique" instrument.

If your'e not convinced (and I am guilty of posting this many times - it's my only great patch!) - here's single patch with only reverb and limiting, and the only patch modulation is velocity (no aftertouch, mod wheel or automation). I'm not hearing this coming out of any other plugin synth, let alone hardware. The flute is filter resonance:

https://soundcloud.com/joe-cat/sad-symphony

(I STILL don't have Zebra - must purchase SOON! )

[aaron aardvark]

This thread caught my eye because I still own a (non-working) Juno-106 I bought new in 1984, but then quit working in 1991 (decided to buy a new synth instead of paying $200+ to fix the Juno, but I kept it for sentimental reasons: my rock band days). Still have the Pro-One I bought in 1981: it mostly works, but rather noisy (not the good kind) due to old age. We live in a day where we can try tons of synths for free, or free as a trial version (for limited time or other inconveniences to urge us to buy them). I own various soft synths, different brands, I think the Zebra is my favorite single synth; hoping to get the Dark Zebra for Christmas. Everyone has a different idea what sounds good, just try them out & decide if you like one enough to buy it (except there is no trial version for the Dark Zebra, just have to listen to other peoples demos).

[ew]

What seems to be a good pal for Zebra?

Filterscape VA

This. I might use Filterscape VA more than I use Zebra, to be honest. A very underrated synth.

ew

[n6smith]

I'd recommend Diva because it just sounds so damn good..

But.... if you have Zebra I'd get HZ and then you also get Zebra3 when it is released (late next year..) for free...

so you end up with a great (and it truly is great...) expansion for Zebra and the next version too, all for the same money.

[TomTwohy]

Thanks for your responses so far, guys (assuming your'e all guys).

Hmmmmm, a few that I hadn't considered in the mix.

Yes, Diva is a strong front runner... cost and oscillator worries in my tiny MacAir, wouldn't mind it a bit if it were less (erm) bulky?

Ace is going to have to wait until I'm smarter... plus a chance listening caused me to find Madrona lab's "Aalto"... a modular SVT based on Don Buchla's stuff. They're both modular STVs... but I've always wanted to try using Buchlas (much more than revisit the Roland system 100), and patching seems a little less confusing for me compared to ACE.

Sadly, Aalto lacks the extensive learnable knobs and other niceties to bring it under the heal of my DAW. It's a remarkable sound maker, but using it in a controlled, rhythmic manner like I want is awkward... it was clearly invented mostly to just run wild while you watch.

Though Aalto had breathtaking, unique sounds, Zebra2.5 seemed much smarter when I returned to it's awesomeness.

Urs and Team are amazing!

As for Filterscape VA, I downloaded the Demo and found it charmingly Proto-Zebra-esque in function and found the animated display rather hypnotic. The interface threw me off my game as I wasn't sure if the sounds thrilled me... or the Sci-fi lookin' filter display! A rather new experience to be sure.

All in all, I have tightened up my potential shopping list, the first is non-negotiable:

1) Buy the regular version of Ableton "Live" so I won't be cursed with just FOUR non-native Plug-ins (FUUUH)... it's on "sale" and I can get Live 9 FREE when it shows up... thus, I can use HUNDREDS of instances of Zebra and Zebralette until I score a copy of...

2) Diva... cause she's so FAT! Aww yeah... I like BIG buttsandIcannot LIE, thoseotherbrotherscan'tdeeNIGH... Divas got some JUNK-in-de-TRUNK!

3) Aalto, 'cause it's cheap fake-Buchla thrills and I can make with the weird sounds until Urs and team make the all new Zebra 3.

Might nab ZHZ for amusement... but I need an proper AD/DA converter, faster MAC and other junk too... like the rent and new glasses.

Any more recommends?

[jdoo]

Are you looking for the recording / mixing capabilities of a DAW (Ableton) or just the ability to stack and layer multiple VST/Audio Units for live performance, or additional virtual instruments? Asking, because one of the better kept secrets for live performance, and included sonic capabilities is Apple MainStage. It comes with Logic's sounds/synths ( http://www.apple.com/logicpro/mainstage/ ), 15,000 Apple loops, and allows you to plug in AU synths to layer along with your others. While I am a Logic user, I use MainStage "Concerts" which are set based preset lists, that have song / sonic related patches pre-grouped for jamming / recording / toolin' around. That may sound confusing, but in essence, it's just a way of packaging up the patches I use for playing particular songs, ahead of time, so I can pull up patches / keyboard layouts from hitting controls on my keyboards. All that said... strictly for getting additional sounds / patches -- you may want to consider MainStage as an excellent way of adding more synths ( 11) a drum machine, and various effects. For $30 . . nothing comes close, for value.

To your options..

1) Forget Ableton. Get MainStage.
2) Diva -- fantastic synth. I love my copy... but in your shoes, would consider Dark Zebra. At least on my MacBook Air, HZ seems to be a little easier on the cpu.
3) Dunno about Aalto. I can't imagine it having near the sonic abilities of MainStage.

That's about it. Strictly from a u-he product perspective, I would pick up Dark Zebra. It will play better with your MBA, and give you Zebra 3 free next year. If you're considering Ableton or another product, costing more than $30... and you already have a Mac... then Apple MainStage is the deal of the century.

/two cents mode off

[nilhartman]

I think it's quite a mistake to consider Diva "vintage". She has attitude, personality and character, not nostalgia. She's iconoclast in her ability to build your own frankenstein synth. Her limited set of features and routing is a blessing for creativity. I see you're a mac user : use her inside Numerology and you'll never find here limited in any way.