Did Ableton hit the sweet spot with v9.6?

[spaceman]

I've been looking for a copy of Standard for ages now, but no one seems to be selling. It used to be very different. Someone was always complaining about something in Live, about PDC or whatever, someone was always bitching about something.

But that seems to have changed now. Did Ableton get it right this time and can we consider Live as close to perfect as it gets in DAW land these days?

Or are people just taking a rest from the bitching?
Refill the vitriol and get ready for the next round?

[tehlord]

Live isn't perfect and there's still a lot of features of Cubase (for example) that I prefer.

But

Live used to make a promise that it'd deliver a certain kind of workflow and failed with a lot of it, but now it does it in spectacular fashion. With 8 I used to have all sorts of bugs and crashes, but it's not 100% stable for me.

I would still hope that they make a few crucial tweaks in 10 (improving the arrangement view which I think is fiddly to use and annoying to edit) but there's not massive problem anywhere any more.

[spaceman]

Live isn't perfect and there's still a lot of features of Cubase (for example) that I prefer.

But

Live used to make a promise that it'd deliver a certain kind of workflow and failed with a lot of it, but now it does it in spectacular fashion. With 8 I used to have all sorts of bugs and crashes, but it's not 100% stable for me.

I would still hope that they make a few crucial tweaks in 10 (improving the arrangement view which I think is fiddly to use and annoying to edit) but there's not massive problem anywhere any more.

I stupidly sold 9 last year when I got depressed about lack of time, but even then I had noticed already how for almost everything I wanted to do, there seemed to be some functionality available. It has, more and more, become an instrument, in my opinion. It's more like Reason now in that way. The way session view and arranger interact can still be annoying and confusing though. But maybe that's just me.

[tehlord]

Live isn't perfect and there's still a lot of features of Cubase (for example) that I prefer.

But

Live used to make a promise that it'd deliver a certain kind of workflow and failed with a lot of it, but now it does it in spectacular fashion. With 8 I used to have all sorts of bugs and crashes, but it's not 100% stable for me.

I would still hope that they make a few crucial tweaks in 10 (improving the arrangement view which I think is fiddly to use and annoying to edit) but there's not massive problem anywhere any more.

I stupidly sold 9 last year when I got depressed about lack of time, but even then I had noticed already how for almost everything I wanted to do, there seemed to be some functionality available. It has, more and more, become an instrument, in my opinion. It's more like Reason now in that way. The way session view and arranger interact can still be annoying and confusing though. But maybe that's just me.

I agree that session/arrangement view could be better integrated (more drag and drop for example), and I get what your'e saying about it being an instrument too.

The biggest draw for me is the speed with which you can get the basics of a track together. The other DAW I use (Cubase 8 Pro) seems cumbersome and inhibitive by comparison, but kicks Live's ass in other areas.

Next step for me is Push 2, which looks sexeh

[spaceman]

Yes, Push looks cool. But I'm still weighing up Maschine as well.
I haven't decided yet which one is going to suit me best.

[SLiC]

I am contemplating selling my Live 9 suit as I mainly use Bitwig now for EDM/loopy stuff; just being hanging on in case Live 10 (live 'X') is killer....Absolutely nothing wrong with Live if you want something rock solid for 'Live' type DJ stuff, I just found my stuff needed more linear editing most of the time.

[xbitz]

The biggest draw for me is the speed with which you can get the basics of a track together. The other DAW I use (Cubase 8 Pro) seems cumbersome and inhibitive by comparison, but kicks Live's ass in other areas.

depends on your genre, if it's trance(which is mainly chord/melody driven, and not sample based) then chord track/pads of Cubase + Nora 2(pattern clip based chord chopper) + some modular based VSTs if u need them beats Live in every aspects (except of Push ofc.), the last weak point was the drum MIDI editor which is finally usable from C8.5 (it has finally got folding, MIDI note lengths can be sett etc.)



ofc. Cubase can't be used on stage

[tehlord]

Yes, Push looks cool. But I'm still weighing up Maschine as well.
I haven't decided yet which one is going to suit me best.

I think if Live is going to be your primary DAW then Push is a no brainer. Maschine will work as a DAW within a DAW and I found that very fiddly and unintuitive when I had one. So it's gone!

depends on your genre, if it's trance(which is mainly chord/melody driven, and not sample based) then chord track/pads of Cubase + Nora 2(pattern clip based chord chopper) + some modular based VSTs if u need them beats Live in every aspects (except of Push ofc.), the last weak point was the drum MIDI editor which is finally usable from C8.5 (it has finally got folding, MIDI note lengths can be sett etc.)


ofc. Cubase can't be used on stage

I will concur that Live is more suited to grid based dance music, but I would still use Cubase for ambient/film style music anyway.

I've used Cubase for 10 years, but Live is just miles ahead of Cubase in terms of speed of workflow. The Drum Rack (for example) is just genius and makes a mockery of the way you have to use Cubase for drums, even if you use the 'integrated' Groove Agent.

[Mister Natural]

dunno if it's "the" sweet spot . . . but it's certainly "a" sweet spot with the evolution from 9.1x to 9.5
that really was/is a big jump in both the quality of certain instruments & effects but also the use-ability of the software. Details of which are everywhere & don't need to be repeated here.

re: 9.6 - some are reporting issues with the file management in upgrading from v.5 to .6 - I'm gonna hold off until v.6.1 just to be safe

[billcarroll]

I've been looking for a copy of Standard for ages now, but no one seems to be selling. It used to be very different. Someone was always complaining about something in Live, about PDC or whatever, someone was always bitching about something.

But that seems to have changed now. Did Ableton get it right this time and can we consider Live as close to perfect as it gets in DAW land these days?

Or are people just taking a rest from the bitching?
Refill the vitriol and get ready for the next round?

Live is darn close now. There are still some issues with 3rd party plugin delay compensation (3rd party plugin latency is still not compensated within a track, although the extra audio buffer of delay has been removed for 3rd party plugins), but Ableton has fixed most of the other issues around PDC.

I use Ableton Live with Cubase 8.5. Live is the perfect DAW to develop percussion and song ideas quickly. Then, I usually move to Cubase at some point.

[Mister Natural]

OP - keep an eye here for a used copy :
https://forum.ableton.com/viewforum.php?f=43

peace

[spaceman]

OP - keep an eye here for a used copy :
https://forum.ableton.com/viewforum.php?f=43

peace

Yup, I've got a thread going there

[GabryRox]

While I am far from an expert in Live (so can't really fairly assess the improvement with v9.6 yet), I too have noticed a lack of people selling Live licenses here. I am actually looking for the Suite version but neither that or standard have been seen much over the past few weeks. I just missed out on the last Suite posted here by a reputable user a couple weeks ago and it was for a great price too... 300 Euro I believe. Since then it has been slim pickings. As for the Ableton forum, there have been a few listed over there but all from new members with it being their only post. To me, it is too risky to deal with someone with no forum history so I just ignore those.

Something that I did just discover though is the Best Service sells Live for the lowest prices I've seen. I was shocked to see that they offer Suite upgrade from Lite for about $490. That's close to 25% off the regular going price from Ableton and pretty much everywhere else of $649. I was going to wait for Ableton's next sale if I couldn't find a good deal on a license transfer, but I may just bite the bullet and get it from BS. Sure, it's gonna run about $90 more than the $400 going rate for 2nd hand license, but at least I could get it now and also not have to worry about being ripped off. Anyway, I would assume that Best Service's prices on Standard are also about 25% so that may be something you want to check out Spaceman.

[stillshaded]

If you like "jamming" ableton is amazing. If you like writing things out in a linear fashion, there are better options. Studio one comes to mind.

[tooneba]

I don't think it's perfect. I prefer FL piano roll, mouse control responsiveness and internal controller plugins, but I keep Live for reasons. I sometimes click different target, and have hard time with organizing and working at the same time, and remembering the linking (aliasing) of regions, probably because I don't have good short-term memory or good muscle memory. Live's everything is undo-able, folded automation tracks and no aliasing regions (for those who need aliasing, unfortunately there are no aliasing option at all in Live) make life easier at least for me.