Logic and general state of Mac OS and iOS integration

[chagzuki]

Until about two years ago I had a general dislike of Apple in general, and certainly never saw myself owning their products. Then the iPad 2018 came along, which was a revolution for visual activities such as illustration. So for the first time I bought an Apple product, and it has been life-changing, though I get the impression Android alternatives are catching up. I then got excited by the forthcoming Catalina features promising integration with iOS and iPad apps, so incredibly weirdly I ended up with an Apple computer. Which was then very much a let-down; the Sidecar function seemed to be not quite good enough to make it worthwhile. So I'm currently cross-platform on Windows and Mac OS, and have likes and dislikes regarding both... no clear winner.

I used Logic back in 2002 or so, but once Tracktion appeared I never felt the need to look at other DAWs, and in sometime around 2006/7 I stopped making music altogether.

So now I'm looking at the price of Logic and it seems good, highly competitive. I'm guessing it's incorporated some of the ergonomic improvements that Tracktion pioneered, such as general mouse-wheel navigation, zooming etc... I seem to remember Cubase incorporating some of those things, and eXT and others did... so I assume it's become standard.

There's much Apple hate on this forum, but for those who have owned a recent iPad, they know just how powerful apple silicon is likely to be. I really have no idea which platform will be worth investing in; I think Apple laptops are going to enter a new era with Apple silicon, finally we'll have cool and quiet machines with long battery life, i.e. the design goal of laptops since day one. I don't know how quickly Windows machines will become properly compatible with ARM processors, last time I looked into it it seemed like it would be a messy process.

So I'm just wonder how Logic users here feel about the product? Is Apple's walled-garden approach generating any problems for Logic users? The feature set looks comprehensive on paper... at a good price. I wonder what the downsides are? How much do upgrades generally cost and how does that work out over time? Have there been any OS compatibility problems, particularly with the Catalina general issues/bugs?

Is Logic incorporating iPad input methods... I assume there are cool ways to use the iPad as a controller?

[antic604]

The feature set looks comprehensive on paper... at a good price.

I never used Apple product and don't intend to change that, but from what I heard the ratio of quantity and quality of features vs. price is 2nd to none for Logic.

So "good" is a gross understatement

[Michael L]

Logic updates are free, there is a free iOS Logic controller, Logic only uses AU plugins and you can demo Logic for 90 days to see how it feels with your workflow. (I am on the fence.) "Why Logic Pro Rules" has good free youtube tutorials. Apple only fixes OS bugs in the current version.

[BertKoor]

Is Logic incorporating iPad input methods... I assume there are cool ways to use the iPad as a controller?

It's called "Logic Remote". Lots of videos on that subject on the 'tube...
Or read Apple's own info: https://apps.apple.com/us/app/logic-remote/id638394624

[Bombadil]

I bought it for €179 in 2013, haven't paid for an update yet, and the program has continually gotten better. There's nothing on the market that can compare for bang/buck ratio. It's quite solid on my iMac, and unless Apple does something to seriously piss me off, I don't foresee changing.

[jancivil]

As to the 'walled-off garden' through itself creating a lot of problems, not a lot.
If a developer has not signed (purchased) something identifying them to OSX Catalina an error message pops up saying no can do when you open the installer.
Then you go to Sys Prefs, Privacy and Security and tell it to open the installer anyway. Not real different than the unsigned drivers sitch in Windows (when I was on it anyway).

I've had more things uninstallable due to 32-bit only than with this. I've had exactly one thing I couldn't work around - and their rep here sez there is one (probably using Terminal) - BFD2, which is absolutely not a supported product, last update 8 yr ago.

[macmuse]

There is no other DAW on the market as fully-featured as Logic which includes the wealth of content for that price.

[jancivil]

There are things written to make the iPad a controller. I have a couple of them installed on mine. I ended up buying a dedicated tablet controller (Sensel Morph) before I got into setting that up. Downside of that is it does not support MIDI over Bluetooth. I think this probably isn't a problem with the iPad.

[chagzuki]

What do you guys who are users think of the inbuilt instruments and FX? It's all sounding positive so no doubt I'll have a proper period with the demo, but I like to get feedback first.

[dellboy]

I bought a new Mac Mini a few weeks ago to give Logic a go.It reminds me of Studio One in some ways.

The one thing I have found odd is no drag and drop. Its not like they have not had the time to get such a simple thing implemented.

I was messing around with the new clip launcher last night and was trying to record into a cell but was finding it difficult. Its probably something I am doing wrong, but its not as simple as Live to make work.

The included instruments are fine, but the old legacy stuff has been hidden away and takes some digging to find.

[Bombadil]

Built in fx? Better than other daws I've tried, especially the verbs and delays.
Instruments? ALCHEMY! Drum Designer is better than anything I've heard from any other daw, if natural kits are your thing. Sculpture! Studio Strings and Horns are also very useable.
Iirc, there's a 90 day trial. Why not see for yourself?

[chagzuki]

there's a 90 day trial. Why not see for yourself?

Yes, I think I will. It wasn't even on the radar... not sure why. I guess partly because it hardly seems to get any mentions here at KvR, which I now assume is because users are generally pretty happy with it, and its maturity means there's not much in the way of major changes to discuss?

I wonder how much of Falcon's functionality overlaps with the built-in instruments. I might have been premature in thinking Falcon was going to essentially be my main sonic tool, with the DAW merely acting as midi sequencer.

It takes quite a long time to get a good sense of a host... 3 months is an OK time, so long as I know I won't have other commitments that eat into it too much.

[pdxindy]

What do you guys who are users think of the inbuilt instruments and FX? It's all sounding positive so no doubt I'll have a proper period with the demo, but I like to get feedback first.

The Logic instruments and fx are impressive... Anywhere from solid to world class. There is no DAW that comes close to the power of Logic for the price. Add in year after year of major updates for free and Logic is a no brainer if you have a Mac...

The latest 10.5 was an eye opener! They did an exceptional job and the range of improvements is kinda mind boggling. Drum designer is great... so is the new Sampler. the Logic dev team is doing creative work and not just going through the motions.

If you have an iPad then Logic Remote is excellent as a Logic controller. As the Macs move to Apple Silicon, seems inevitable that an iOS version of Logic will eventually show up. For a DAW that has been around for a long time, development seems fresh and with an exciting future.

Of course there are a few issues and long standing annoyances... but that is inescapable with complex software.

[Etienne1973]

The one thing I have found odd is no drag and drop.

Where do you miss drag and drop in Logic exactly?

[dellboy]

The one thing I have found odd is no drag and drop.

Where do you miss drag and drop in Logic exactly?

Just loading of software instruments.

I have Cubase and Studio One and you just drag any instrument and drop it and it automatically creates a track with the chosen instrument ready to go.

Unless I am doing something wrong in Logic you have to make a software instrument track first and then assign an instrument to it.

Even in a very old DAW like Energyxt 3 you could right click and scroll down an instrument list and select a VST, which is a step on from Logics way of doing it, although its not drag and drop.

Bandlab Sonar has drag and drop of instruments, and its free, so it seems odd that Logic never got around to doing this simple workflow thing.