Arturia V Collection 10. Predictions.

[TheMaestro]

But what you didn't do is compare them to an actual Minimoog.

Go ahead and find any in-depth Minimoog video on YouTube. Then, at any given time, pause it and dial in the Arturia Mini the same, knob for knob, however the real Minimoog is set. You will get the same sound, and it will be an accurate, unhyped reproduction when you A/B it. I haven't tried all of the ones you've listed, so I don't know if any of them will do the same. Some I've tried were producing sounds that weren't even in the ballpark of those settings on the Minimoog. And others didn't even have the same controls so trying to matching a real Minimoog was futile.

Here's a video you can use as a guide:

https://youtu.be/0hfdSrK46EE

What!? No

[dlandis]

Spark was kind of crummily implemented imo. They should have another go at it in VST form.

Also, implement it with MiniLab, KeyLab, and KeyStep rather than require its own hardware.

With that said, I absolutely loved the SparkLE hardware. It worked flawlessly and was super fast/intuitive to use.

Yeah. Maybe a Hybrid BeatStep Pro with a drum sampler built in that paired with a matching VST. Like an updated SparkLE. Or at least a BSP that that had more interaction with the VST software.

I tried the Spark 2 software recently and was left underwhelmed with the sounds coming out of it and the UI. I just hope they revisit it with an update to the concept.

I'd be ok with them simply buying Geist 2 from Roli and working it into the Arturia lineup with some hardware.. I really did enjoy the workflow and sounds in Geist.

What you're suggesting would be great, but, of course, Arturia dropped Spark 2 from the V Collection several versions ago, so I doubt that's going to be in the cards. Arturia buying Geist 2 is a really interesting idea, however.

BTW, when was the last time Roli did any updates with what they acquired with FXPansion's purchase? I am glad that they haven't killed them yet, but I can't remember the last time an update came through.

[ghettosynth]

Here's a video you can use as a guide:

https://youtu.be/0hfdSrK46EE

What an incredibly boring video.

[jamcat]

Here's a video you can use as a guide:

https://youtu.be/0hfdSrK46EE

What an incredibly boring video.

What an incredibly useless comment.

The video was selected because Claudio clearly shows you what he's doing, with a full view of the Minimoog's settings, and it demonstrates a wide variety of settings, any of which can easily be copied to Arturia Mini or any other Moog emulation for a real-world comparison.

If you have another video that does that, that you like better, go ahead and share the link to it.

[ghettosynth]

Here's a video you can use as a guide:

https://youtu.be/0hfdSrK46EE

What an incredibly boring video.

What an incredibly useless comment.

No, if you're really interested in accurate emulation, it was an incredibly spot on comment. Nobody cares that you can reproduce a basic Moog bass sound, never mind that we've not yet discussed what the metric for replication quality will be.

Milk-toast sounds like that are fairly easy to replicate with some degree of success. Here you go, a much better test for starters. FM modulation with full on resonance and fast envelope modulation. All controls in view and you even get multiple clear demonstrations of the sound with easy to replicate control changes that result in quite different sounds, e.g., from one osc octave to another, and from one waveform to another.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Piv1ikBFUTo

To be clear, I don't give a rats ass about Minimoog emulation. I'm not a Moog fanboi at all. But if you want to argue that the experience is accurate, at least start with something that has a little bite to it.

[jamcat]

If you don't give a rat's ass about Minimoog emulation, then why are you commenting?
And why so aggressive?

I did a quick test of that sound in Mini, and it gets in the ballpark. It's not as harsh or percussive on the square wave, though, when the noise is being added in. It seems the noise isn't as loud on the Mini V.

However, that's not a sound I would ever want to put in music.
Not everything needs to be so extra all the time.

If I'm using a Minimoog, it's because I want the typical Minimoog sound, which the Mini V3 does 1:1.

[ghettosynth]

I did a quick test of that sound in Mini, and I got something in the ballpark. It's not as loud or percussive, though, particularly when the noise is being added in. And the square wave+noise definitely sounded different and not as harsh.

However, that's not a sound I would ever want to put in music.

Speak for yourself. As the author points out, it is a sound that he uses all the time. If you can't get the sound, and I don't think that you can with the Arturia, then you don't have an accurate emulation, as others were saying. The percussive nature of that sound IS the Minimoog. Saying that you can't get that important property is like claiming that your minivan is just like a Ferrari when looking for a parking spot, but it just can't corner as well at the racetrack.

I can get "something in the ballpark" of the sound of the first video with pretty much any basic VA synth. You were making a stronger case without understanding the weakness of your argument. Basically, fast modulation of the filter with high resonance settings will quickly reveal the weakness of a digital emulation, whereas slow filter modulation with low resonance settings will falsely convince you that you have the real thing when you don't.

I guess we're done here.

[jamcat]

You're missing the point completely. Any typical Minimoog sound can be dialed in on Mini V using identical settings, and will be indistinguishable from the original. This is what matters to me, and probably most people looking for a Minimoog VST.

You're bringing up an edge case that no one actually cares about, and which I was able to get 90% of the way in about a minute of fiddling. But there may be something I overlooked in setting it up. The filter worked the same. That wasn't the issue. I created the same frequency modulation with the mod wheel all the way up, and observed the same filter behaviour. The part that wasn't quite the same was only when mixing the noise in with the modulation mix. I had to turn the it up about 80% instead of 20% to start getting a similar sound, and the noise still seemed weak.

Lucky for me, I use Minimoogs for 'boring' 'milquetoast' sounds like classic prog rock leads and Numanesque basslines, and other normal stuff people actually use Minimoogs for, so the Mini V3 is 100% spot on for my needs. Imagine that, using a Minimoog to get Minimoog sounds!

Dredging up edge cases just for the sake of being contrarian is what's actually boring. And masturbatory, too.


This is the problem with KVR. I guess the whole internet, really.

Sensible person:
"Hey, Piantoteq is a really good piano model."

KVR poster #1:
"Oh yeah, can it do this, idiot?
*shows video of burning piano strung with rubber bands being played by squirrels*

KVR poster #2:
"Diva is the best piano!"

[Arashi]

Any typical Minimoog sound can be dialed in on Mini V using identical settings, and will be indistinguishable from the original.

I couldn't disagree more with this statement. There are some excellent Minimoog emulations that really do sound extremely close to the hardware, but Mini V is not one of them.

[jamcat]

Then you’ve clearly never actually done a comparison of Mini V to a real Model D.

[electro]

Compare the difference between Arturia's reworked Prophet V4 to Prophet V3 which comes from the same generation as the current Mini V3. What you're describing is parameter accuracy but that does not automatically mean resolution is equivalent to hardware. Resolution and VCF accuracy is not equivalent, far higher on the competition less sounding like static plastic softsynth and more like breathing circuits. Mini V3 resolution at 96Khz for example cannot withstand this level of scrutiny
https://soundcloud.com/nativeinstrument ... comparison

You're missing the point completely. Any typical Minimoog sound can be dialed in on Mini V using identical settings, and will be indistinguishable from the original. This is what matters to me, and probably most people looking for a Minimoog VST.

[Scotty]

There are limits to audio comparison at YouTube University. I’m amazed so many of you have well calibrated 40 + year old Model D synths kicking around. I’ve got three clones here, two from Behringer and one from Roland and they are all clearly in the ball park but slightly different at the same knob positions and they use higher tolerance components than the original on which they were based. Tuning behaviour is the most obviously variable difference even after calibration. Given aging electronics and the component tolerances on hand at the time of manufacture, getting two Model Ds to match at the same knob settings would be surprising to me.

[ghettosynth]

There are limits to audio comparison at YouTube University. I’m amazed so many of you have well calibrated 40 + year old Model D synths kicking around. I’ve got three clones here, two from Behringer and one from Roland and they are all clearly in the ball park but slightly different at the same knob positions and they use higher tolerance components than the original on which they were based. Tuning behaviour is the most obviously variable difference even after calibration. Given aging electronics and the component tolerances on hand at the time of manufacture, getting two Model Ds to match at the same knob settings would be surprising to me.

Sure but, all of this is often overstated when people are trying to argue that what they want to believe is true. I have enough experience with multiple identical models of well calibrated 40 year old synths from different owners to say that the effects that you're talking about aren't going to make much difference when it comes to showing that some software models aren't very accurate.

Component drift and slight differences in tuning are not going to impact the clear difference heard in the video that I posted when one switches octaves or waveforms. Those are acute changes that demonstrate fast modulation of the filter. I don't think that you can make the Arturia sound like that. As others have pointed out, the model is quite old at this point and, despite Artuira wanting you to believe otherwise, the Mini reflects the limitations of their modeling as it was a number of years back.

[Arashi]

Then you’ve clearly never actually done a comparison of Mini V to a real Model D.

Believe whatever you want.

[Uncle E]

There are limits to audio comparison at YouTube University. I’m amazed so many of you have well calibrated 40 + year old Model D synths kicking around.

Well, I've owned two extremes: one very old and very out of calibration Mini and one Moog Model D Reissue. The current version of Mini V is farther from either of those than any of the newer software emulations out there, IMHO.

Anyway, we all know a new version of Mini V will show up eventually and it's safe to assume it'll be just as great as their other recent reboots.