Hive 2 vs Synthmaster One

[VELLTONE MUSIC]

Are you sure about that?

I somehow feel like clearing up some things which I feel like come about wrong here.

Hive 2 has 30 different filter algorithms - each of 10 responses has subtle or not so subtle differences in each of its 3 engines. And those are not just variations of the same old same old, they're all really useful and complementary to the sound generation possibilities. Other synths may have more flavours, but then they often don't offer such a complete set of responses with a similar attention to flavour as Hive does.

Likewise, the engines provide for different envelope slopes, as was topic further up in this thread. These are modelled after whatever was praised most at the time, so if someone needs "this punchy" or "that snappy" from this or that synth, they should find that in Hive easily.

Furthermore, not just self modulation and the Function Generators (which admittedly might seem obscure at first) can be used to shape envelopes or act as envelopes themselves. The ModMatrix has transfer curves and slew limiters which allow for multiple ways to shape envelopes with a click or two of routing. In addition, the Shape Sequencer can be "halted" and run by the envelopes, so one can probably create as many envelope shapes in Hive as in any such synth, easily.

Such that, Hive is a lot deeper than first meets the eye, but it does not require a degree in sound design to get great results, fast.

Hey thanks for tech info
I was on buy button two times,but wasn't convinced i need it badly...
Definately both kv331 and u-he need more tech info and examples of what their synths do unique way
I like Hive just point the facts,which stop me to become user...mostly the price

[Urs]

I'll be honest, I think the problem is that we do not have any great pressure to improve things. Business is doing well. So when we do things, they're things that we actually love or things that we want to stop hurting. And unfortunately we have developed some pains over the years, like making some of the highest regarded filter algorithms, but not having any of these in our dedicated filter plug-ins. So we're working on that, even if it doesn't address some of these frequently asked things that might promote growth.

We have once started working on a technology to do in-plug-in-tutorials, like, instead of a video, there'd be step by step tutorials or guided tours in the user interface itself. That's nothing new either, but it seems to predominantly be a thing in graphics apps and games. It just never went anywhere, or other things became more important.

[VELLTONE MUSIC]

To me all synth developers are some sort of tech wizards,creating these incredible synths:)
But...
I am just music lover,who need intuitive and fast control.
What confuse me about Hive is this simple thing:
- Let say i wanna do preset with two filters in serial mode,first is sort of acid 303,second sort of Ms20.
How to achieve such vibe and character with Hive or how to make easy something like this?
With SM1 is easy just select the filter type from menu.
When work inside the mix i need fast and simple access to change filter 'colorization' cuz some times mix need more color than complex modulations.
Sorry for simplification of the question,but that's most important step to me as filter lover,if i can't easy control filtering,could justify the money.
For example Icarus2 have so many classic and exotic filters,man get lost in the list when browse.
Cheers:)

[Urs]

Sure, yeah, that's what Hive does not offer. Instead, you can quickly try different flavours across the complete sound. The idea is, instead of making you try dozens of combinations, you get effortless variation. With Hive we opted for latter, because that's something one doesn't see that often. It surely is less versatile, but it also puts emphasis on differences that may often be subtle.

[vitocorleone123]

Sure, yeah, that's what Hive does not offer. Instead, you can quickly try different flavours across the complete sound. The idea is, instead of making you try dozens of combinations, you get effortless variation. With Hive we opted for latter, because that's something one doesn't see that often. It surely is less versatile, but it also puts emphasis on differences that may often be subtle.

And that's the flip side. I'd rather have fewer - or even just one - incredible filter than 100 great ones (thus my most expensive synth being an OB-6, which also gets quite a few subtle combos). Definite a market for both approaches.

[Jac459]

I'll be honest, I think the problem is that we do not have any great pressure to improve things.
....

Whaou, lucky you ! Does it mean that:
1 . You are closing shop soon and go retire in Hawaï.
2 . You are just maintaining while investing in pilate class.
3 . You are just improving what is fun to improve for you (from coding standpoint)
4 . You are continuing to work as usual but you are confident about your product and only improve what make sense for the products in your view?
5 . Any other I didn't thought about?

[Urs]

I'll be honest, I think the problem is that we do not have any great pressure to improve things.
....

Whaou, lucky you ! Does it mean that:
1 . You are closing shop soon and go retire in Hawaï.
2 . You are just maintaining while investing in pilate class.
3 . You are just improving what is fun to improve for you (from coding standpoint)
4 . You are continuing to work as usual but you are confident about your product and only improve what make sense for the products in your view?
5 . Any other I didn't thought about?

Hehehe, context matters. We improve things all the time, we just don't currently have the resources and/or justification to improve on that particular area.

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

I'll be honest, I think the problem is that we do not have any great pressure to improve things.
....

Whaou, lucky you ! Does it mean that:
1 . You are closing shop soon and go retire in Hawaï.
2 . You are just maintaining while investing in pilate class.
3 . You are just improving what is fun to improve for you (from coding standpoint)
4 . You are continuing to work as usual but you are confident about your product and only improve what make sense for the products in your view?
5 . Any other I didn't thought about?

You probably left out:

6. You already have a sustainable business model that works for you and a loyal customer base that appreciates your products and overall design choices

[SamDi]

Of course there's a whole spectrum of needs and desires, and nobody can fit everyone's in every respect. I do however think we're doing fine on our part for a pretty broad spectrum of users.

Seems to be true, so I can't contradict here. Hive is also one of my favorites, what doesn't mean, that there isn't much potential to get improved from my point of view

To be honest, I ask myself, why U-He synths tend to need, making things complicated, where they wouldn't need to be. It seems like Bazille lasting inspired you, to implement all this trick-based stuff in all synths in your program.

I think that dumbing down things is often disgusting and possibly condescending to users (or people in general). People are not generally stupid, and quite a few love to take on a challenge. I believe that mastering a challenge is a key to happiness, and the challenges our software presents sit in a sweet spot for many.

Funny enough, I think there's an overlap between the challenges that playing and learning an instrument pose and that particular sweetspot of complexity that I see in our software.

I think that "more complex than u-he" is going to hurt creativity. Likewise, I think that "easier" is going to be dull quickly.

So you say, offering freely drawable LFOs und ENVs is dumbing things down and condescending users, while offering 4 sliders on an ENV amd a ton of hidden modulation options is providing a nice challenge, which make us proud and happy to master?

Don't know, but mastering a challenge makes you happy, when the core of the challenge is challenging. Not a thing, which would be easy to solve principally, but then it's made artificially complicated.

Climbing the Mount Everest successfully would make me happy. Climbing a small hill on my knees not so much, even when it's also a kind of challenge.

[VELLTONE MUSIC]

If i understand it right Hive could be considered as a super advanced moog synth.
It seems every developer make different 'Moog'
For example analog-ish filters i like,use and know well so far are Tone2 Warlock analog 12db,Synthmatser analog and Icarus analog types and they all have different character.
I guess in dirrect comparision between SM1 and HIve the 'Moog' charactter of Hive will be more noticeable,to my taste it's immediately perceivable that 'retro' analog vibe.
If some 'Moog' fan could compare them to real Moog and make conclusions will be nice,but i don't think SM1 is some super authentic emulation or something,just sounds nice and modern,especially BP with 'acid' button on can make nice reso sound,concidering how dangerously unpredictable is moog filter with more resonance.
Not sure how Hive behaive in such situations,but from what Urs explain i guess behavior could be shaped so to squeeze nice harmonics.
Definitely both synths are capable and friendly,the GUI is lovely Sylenth1 type,just different character and modulation options.
One page synths are really fun to play with no doubt,especially if sound so good as these two
Cheers .

[vurt]

If i understand it right Hive could be considered as a super advanced moog synth.

nope. not really.

[audiojunkie]

I'll take Hive 2 over Synthmaster One any day of the week. I own both. Only one supports Linux. 'Nuff said.

[Jac459]

I'll be honest, I think the problem is that we do not have any great pressure to improve things.
....

Whaou, lucky you ! Does it mean that:
1 . You are closing shop soon and go retire in Hawaï.
2 . You are just maintaining while investing in pilate class.
3 . You are just improving what is fun to improve for you (from coding standpoint)
4 . You are continuing to work as usual but you are confident about your product and only improve what make sense for the products in your view?
5 . Any other I didn't thought about?

You probably left out:

6. You already have a sustainable business model that works for you and a loyal customer base that appreciates your products and overall design choices

He he, that was 4 for me bro.... but your explanation work!

[Jac459]

Hehehe, context matters. We improve things all the time, we just don't currently have the resources and/or justification to improve on that particular area.

Clear, thanks for explaining!

[Jac459]

Any good pointer for hive 2 training? Like youtube channel or so?

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... D5aYPD1Mpk

Thanks dude! I just took a 12 hours plane and watched the whole set carefully! Waiting to be home to play around.