Pitch bend while playing live in Waveform Pro

[eelcok]

Hi, I'm relatively new with Waveform Pro, still trying to figure out some things. I have what I believe is a simple question but can't find a solution for it anywhere. I want to configure a pitch bend for a VST instrument I'm playing live (i.e. I do NOT want to use the MIDI editor after I play). The idea is that during every note I play the pitch bends up (or down) in a preset time, going up (or down) a preset number of notes. I figured I just add an effect after the VST instrument, but I can't find an effect that does what I want. I've googled extensively but nothing seems to do this (simple?) thing. Note: I don't want to use Pitch Shift (wonderful for other live play stuff), as this shifts the note entirely, rather than changing the pitch over time during a note (bending). Maybe I'm overexplaining , but hope my question is clear.

[Watchful]

The pitch bend capability is built into the VST instrument. Pitch bends are programmed in the instrument* itself, usually through one or more parameters.

Assuming you just want a basic +/- semitones and nothing custom, you're probably all set to go.

- Load the VST into the far right of the track.
- Create a MIDI clip on the track.
- Double-click it to open it up in the MIDI editor.
- Put a note in that you want to bend.
- In the bottom of the editor, look for the controllers button, which will open up a small window below.
- Ensure that Pitch Bend is selected (there are a lot to choose from!)
- Using the pencil tool, draw your pitch bend into the small window.

* Assuming the instrument supports pitch bending; I've seen a couple over the years that don't. But 99% do.

[Watchful]

Incidentally, if you have a hardware keyboard configured to work with Waveform, you can control the VST's pitch bend right from there. Your thread title makes me think this is more what you're going for.

And, better, you can record a pitch bend right in the MIDI track which you can edit later using a slight variation of the above steps. That way you can see what you like (or what you don't!) when creating your own in the future.

It's also possible--sigh--to record a pitch bend in a clip, and merge it into another clip if you'd like.

[eelcok]

Many thanks for your response(s) - much appreciated! But I'm afraid that we're miscommunicating slightly. I've set-up a MIDI keyboard, and I use Waveform pretty much only in a live configuration. I configure things in Waveform, but I want to play on the keyboard, so the sound that I look for comes out live. I think that's what you're suggesting in your second reply. And therefore I said I don't want to bend a note after I play it in the MIDI editor. I can't use the MIDI editor when I'm playing somewhere in live mode!

I don't understand why you say I can control the pitch bend from my hardware keyboard either. It's a standard MIDI keyboard, no fancy buttons, just 88 keys, that's it. No slider wheel or anything fancy which I see on much more expensive keyboards. It just outputs MIDI, which I run through the VST in Waveform to create a nice synth sound, which I then need to bend, immediately using a plug-in, or possibly in the VST itself. The VST I'm experimenting on is Superwave P8, and it has a pitch bend knob which of course I've tried to fiddle with extensively, but nothing happens. Sorry for my frustration, it feels like there is so much potential in Waveform Pro and the VST I load into it, but I can't get it to work.

Bottom line is, I'm not creating a clip, I'm playing live, so I don't see how I can use your answer for my situation... Am I misunderstanding?

[talby]

To my understanding you will need to play a keyboard having the modulation wheels. Keyboards with the modulation wheel are really not anything exotic, they exist for 3 decades now and are meanwhile even cheap, very cheap. They exist for solving exactly what you are in need for. This is why you will hardly find a software solution for this anywhere. Working around this standard and easily available mainstream solution is not worth to get headaches about, even less if you check for prices of a midi controller keyboard 3 decades after they started to flood the market. If you have already some 88key board, then you might be fine with just adding some cheap 61, 49 or even less keys board to your setup. Especially when playing live then you want to rely on a long time stage tested solution and not on some tricky software workaround.

[pough]

I figured I just add an effect after the VST instrument

If what you want is pitchbend and not pitch shift then this is impossible. Pitchbend is a MIDI thing and what comes out the arse end of a VST instrument is audio. No MIDI applied to it can have any effect.

There might be a MIDI FX plugin that can send pitchbend data but I have never seen it.

[Watchful]

As others have said, you'll need a means to tell Waveform "I want a pitch bend here." If you have a keyboard with no pitch bend wheel or joystick, Waveform--and indeed no DAW--will know when to bend, how much, and for how long. MIDI views this as "controller" data, which is completely separate from "note" data (which key I press, when, how hard, and for how long I hold it down).

[DaveL60]

As several others have stated, the "proper" way to do this is with a controller on your keyboard. The typical arrangement is two "wheels" on the left edge of the keyboard, usually configured with one for bending pitch and the other for controlling modulation depth. (My Kurzweil piano has ribbon controllers rather than wheels and I really don't think they're an improvement over the traditional solution). You might be able to get a standalone touchpad and somehow configured things so it controls pitch on one axis and modulation on the other. But a traditional controller is probably still easier.

In addition to having a proper controller, I have to ask: why you are using Waveform to host a VSTi live?, versus a more focused VSTi host as described here: https://unison.audio/vst-host/ That would seem like a better hosting environment for live playing.

[dysjoint]

For a predefined and consistent pitch bend on every note you would program it into the patch, using an envelope tied to global pitch. What you're wanting to do is done inside the synth, not after.

[Peter Widdicombe]

If you DO find a MIDI pitchbend effect, note you probably want it to be placed LEFT of the VST and not right. AFTER the VST, you normally have audio information only, so would need something to "pitch shift audio" after the audio is generated, as opposed to a pitch bend that is altering the generation of audio within the VST.

There is a set of MIDI tools by Piz that can be used to alter or convert MIDI; although what do you expect to use to control/add pitchbend during live? You may need an inexpensive 25-key controller with pitchbend ?

[eelcok]

Thanks everyone! I'm understanding things a lot better now, your feedback has been really helpful. I've managed to use the Portamento option in Superwave P8, which sort of does what I hoped to achieve.

Coming back to some of your replies/questions:

• I understand the effect, if it acts on the MIDI signal, needs to be placed on the left of the VST. To my surprise, the pitch shift effect built in Waveform Pro does work when you put it on the right of the VST. However, on the right it introduces a small but noticable latency.
• For other purposes I found J's MIDI tools which have helped me a great deal in the past as well. Very helpful in modifying MIDI, for example in adding sustain to a VST that doesn't have it and in helping to isolate parts of the keyboard for specific tasks. I'll check out the ones by Piz!
• As for why I'm using Waveform to host a VSTi live, that's a good question. Honestly? Lack of knowledge. I had a keyboard, and am able to play a little bit. Now also learning to sing and joined a band. Next question in the band of course was: how can we play different sounds when we play? The existing sounds on the keyboard were rather limited. I simply went looking for something and people I talked to recommended a DAW. Waveform made sense, I managed to learn it a little bit, and I was able to get to a whole bunch of virtual instruments . What really helped in the band was that I can now isolate parts of the keyboard for completely different sounds, even stack them. Or switch quickly to another VST by assigning a key to do so. I'll check out the VSTi host suggestion you made. I had no idea that existed.
• Might be good for the band if I have an additional little keyboard with a separate two wheel controller for pitch bending!

[Watchful]

Might be good for the band if I have an additional little keyboard with a separate two wheel controller for pitch bending!
[/list]

You might consider something like a control pad, that gives you even more options, such as pads, sliders, etc. Generally, these can be remapped to do just about anything you need, and let your keyboard be a keyboard.

And some of these aren't terribly expensive.

But a MIDI controller can offer these, too, and hey--who doesn't like two keyboards going at once?