synthedit synths ... free or not ?

Modular Synth design and releases (Reaktor, SynthEdit, Tassman, etc.)

do you object to paying for synthedit-built vst stuff ?

yes
13
22%
no
16
28%
depends on the quality
29
50%
 
Total votes: 58

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x_bruce wrote: ...
And I hope SE based VSTi developers are reading this because the idea of paying for your labor isn't at issue for me or for the corporation that is my band, the issue is whether you are in it for the long haul and if you charge anything for your labor, I don't care whether it's $1.00, at that point you are doing business and as such should be expected to work just like rgcAudio or reFex, or LinPlug, Big Tick or any of the other shareware developers.
...
What it comes down to is not only whether it's ok to sell. If Jeff has no problem with it then it's none of our business what designers do. But the minute they decide they want money they, at least for me, have to accept responsibilities for bugs, customer service - the whole works. For me the developer that puts something up for sale is expected to have quality and be able to prove it with freeware or track history especially since you can not make a demo VST as far as I know in SynthEdit.
...
If someone feels their work is worth payment they have a right to charge, but we as consumers have a right to quality service, distribution of the VSTi and accountability.
Great sentiment, x_bruce!

However, I have to say that while I find your approach superb, I can't see the whole world lining up behind you. :( The truth of the matter is, at least in the Western world quality and customer care have long ago lost the battle to economies of scope and scale - and to "low, LOW prices!" Most of us will go and buy our hardware not where the sales staff is the most knowledgeable and courteous, but where we can shave off the most from the prices.

We live in a disposable society. We don't expect our VCR or DVD to last beyond 3-4 years, and even if they did, in 3-4 years they get woefully outdated and incapable of handling the new standards - whatever those might be. It appears e.g. that the DVD's you have today will not even play in the machines due out in a couple of years... :shock:

Let's face it: just how MUCH support can you realistically demand for U$19, when your U$400 DVD Player has a ONE YEAR WARRANTY? And how long do you want an author to support a VSTi that may not even run on your next PC or in your next host? And how long do you exactly want to use an instrument that's hi-tech today but may well become a quaint reminder of the passage of time tomorrow? And how long do you expect an individual to stand behind their product in a market where huge companies can emagically stop casting their spells, and close the Gates on their OS within 5 years of its introduction?

As a matter of fact, the entire software market of the world is based on f**king the customer, for heaven's sake! :x Your average EULA states exactly that much: no warranty of any kind, no responsibility for damages, no recourse, no refund, no exchange, no ownership, NOTHING. I've watched here a hundred threads on piracy lighting up within the last year or so (and I do take an anti-piracy stance, in case someone wants to threadjack this discussion by twisting my words); your message is the FIRST I've seen that concerned itself with establishing merchant responsibility. We have anti-piracy legislation galore, and many cases are pursued in court; I have yet to see a straightforward decision againts a software developer or company. And please don't mention that farce of a judgement against Microsoft... :shock:

I'm not trying to silence your call to arms, but I have to be honest: if someone offered me a VSTi for U$15 that did the same thing as its U$400 competitor, I'd buy it and rather put up with its bugs and inconsistencies, even if I knew that the author will disappear as soon as my creditcard cleared... :roll: Especially since I know that whatever happens, I will not be in a legal position to fight back, whether I paid one dollar or a hundred.
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Up until now much of what you say points to major screwups in business models and the unanticipated outcomes of these "fix it now" decisions.

It takes one person to start anything just as it takes a group of people willing to stand up for what they believe in. That said, I don't expect people to be any different than I've experienced which means they'll do what makes them feel good.

As for people being in it for the long haul, how's this?
1. I expect support for a minimum of 90 days and preferably 1 year
2. I demand accountability for something that isn't as advertised

And why do I think some people might think twice? Because the VST shareware community has been the cleanest, fairest, most value-for-money software I've seen hands down. I'd hate to see that spoiled by well meaning but ill prepared sellers.

We have it good right now both as consumer and as developer. We have dialog and we have seemingly mutual respect which could be ruined unintentionally by a lot of new developers popping up overnight. It wouldn't be too good for shareware developers either.

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It is very easy to set up check out the download by payloads. No money is involved unless you acualy sell something. I am more willing to support my software with updates and enhancements if I get something for it. If I don't think it measures up to a cost to the user, I get something out of it in advertising. right now that goes towards paying the rent and food things being what they are right now.
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Hy, just wanted to state my point of view on SynthEdit. Please, don't flame me if I steped on your toe... :D

I WAS working a lot on SynthEdit and planning to release daJupitar8 clone on it. I actually got it ready and Liqih was working on the GUI. BUT the CPU usage was way high. Also, I got this bad feeling: "What if Jeff goes away from the project? He is not doing this for a living..." and I know, that a lot of projects just died even with a lot of users on the community. Look my beloved AXS program. snif... I loved it, and the guys had to get jobs and stoped doing it... That's why I decided to code in C++. I'm not saying SynthEdit is bad, or that no one should sell synths for it. NO. I just didn't feel like doing, that's all... ;)

I think that people who do stuff with SynthEdit deserves to get paid, but MUST public state that is a SynthEdit product. In order to respect people who are coding...

Regards, WilliamK

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bluey wrote:Difference is, good clay is not free either !! Synthedit is FREE. Drawing comparisons with sync modular and reaktor is not comparable. In the open source code world, it is generally not seen as ethical to recompile the code and pass it off as your own work.
This is not true. There is nothing wrong with taking an open source project, and selling it. Usually, there are restrictions, such as you have to distribute the source code, etc...

But Open Source does not always mean free.

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There is nothing wrong with taking an open source project, and selling it.
I asked Jeff about selling SynthEdit creations, he said: "No problem at all"
Also, on SynthEdit DOCS it says that. So, no problem on selling SynthEdit creations. Just don't forget to remark: "Made with Synthedit" ;)

Wk

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Just because you CAN do a VSTi, doesn't mean that you SHOULD do one.
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