News from Mackie on international upgrade path inc. plugs!

[aldi]

before you get me wrong, i think they care about the userbase (they have to sell something) but not of comunicating to them.

[ceenda]

Besides, so much of this is speculation until Jules starts to post here again. It would suck majorly if the negative vibe put off the one person who is in a position to correct a number of important issues with Tracktion.

Hehe, I was actually playing around with Ableton Live tonight after hearing it mentioned a few times. Nice, but not my cup of tea. Talking of which, a nice cup of tea would put the world to rights.

[braj]

sorry braj.. I re editied my post... it got cut off...

yes.. criticism is good. I'm not suggesting sitting in silence... but how productive can it be when the point has clearly been made. Is it really productive to continue reiteratting it repeatedly? Are the boat load of slants really helpful in any way? There is definately a difference in being critical and constructive.. vs. critical and destructive.

I wasn't going to post this, but in response tou your post

Regarding stating the same thing over and over: if Mackie is listening then maybe it'll do some good. They don't seem so quick on the uptake IMO or the whole distribution thing would have been handled much better. So maybe through repetition they'll learn something

I'm not sure exactly how much Mackie was participating in development, it doesn't seem like they were much with the talk that Jules was a lone developer up until maybe after the T2 release. If so, I'm thinking that it would have been better for T2 that Mackie not be part of the picture at all. I don't see the benefit of their involvement myself. If it was to help T2 reach a wider market, I don't think it was necessarily successful, and I think it does them good to hear that. They really dropped the ball. They maybe have hurt the product. I don't know and I'm not saying it's so, but it's something for everyone involved to consider. If there's to be a successful T3, they need to learn some lessons.

[semiquaver]

Live is a hoot for tweaking but doesn't work for me either.

[chico.co.uk]

sorry braj.. I re editied my post... it got cut off...

yes.. criticism is good. I'm not suggesting sitting in silence... but how productive can it be when the point has clearly been made. Is it really productive to continue reiteratting it repeatedly? Are the boat load of slants really helpful in any way? There is definately a difference in being critical and constructive.. vs. critical and destructive.

I wasn't going to post this, but in response tou your post

Regarding stating the same thing over and over: if Mackie is listening then maybe it'll do some good. They don't seem so quick on the uptake IMO or the whole distribution thing would have been handled much better. So maybe through repetition they'll learn something

I'm not sure exactly how much Mackie was participating in development, it doesn't seem like they were much with the talk that Jules was a lone developer up until maybe after the T2 release. If so, I'm thinking that it would have been better for T2 that Mackie not be part of the picture at all. I don't see the benefit of their involvement myself. If it was to help T2 reach a wider market, I don't think it was necessarily successful, and I think it does them good to hear that. They really dropped the ball. They maybe have hurt the product. I don't know and I'm not saying it's so, but it's something for everyone involved to consider. If there's to be a successful T3, they need to learn some lessons.

This post contains nothing that hasn't already been said over and over again. Not least in this thread. As a user of this forum, this is becoming a very frustrating place to visit.

Where were you all for the Great Tracktion Drum Challenge?

Where's the responses to the question of "what d'you want prioritised for the next release"?

Where's the positivity?

Where's the joy?

[Lunch Money]

I agree that it's good for a company to know that certain elements of their user base are unhappy. The only thing I disagree with is the assumption that the speed at which bugs are fixed is proportional to the number of threads complaining about it.

Were that the case, the dropped note bug would have been fixed ages ago.

Greg

[braj]

I'm wondering if the dropped note bug is somehow unfixable. That's been outstanding for ages.

[AD80]

This post contains nothing that hasn't already been said over and over again. Not least in this thread. As a user of this forum, this is becoming a very frustrating place to visit.

Where were you all for the Great Tracktion Drum Challenge?

Where's the responses to the question of "what d'you want prioritised for the next release"?

Where's the positivity?

Where's the joy?

I know how you feel. What baffles me even more is why every Mackie bashing thread turns into a Ableton-dick-sucking orgy, then back to a Mackie bashing thread. Its almost like theres some connection between bashing Mackie and sucking Live's penus. Somebody should do a study about that.

[braj]

This post contains nothing that hasn't already been said over and over again. Not least in this thread. As a user of this forum, this is becoming a very frustrating place to visit.

Where were you all for the Great Tracktion Drum Challenge?

Where's the responses to the question of "what d'you want prioritised for the next release"?

Where's the positivity?

Where's the joy?

I know how you feel. What baffles me even more is why every Mackie bashing thread turns into a Ableton-dick-sucking orgy, then back to a Mackie bashing thread. Its almost like theres some connection between bashing Mackie and sucking Live's penus. Somebody should do a study about that.

Wait, it's AD80, not but

[ModuLR]

chico's point is related to what I'm refering to as well... (granted I should have been a participant in the drum challenge.. ). The negativity can be utterly unconstructive on multiple fronts. Speaking for myself, it's definately made me pretty much go silent over the past month...

You can lay the blame on who ever you want, but ultimately it boils down to negative people not being able to come to grips with the current situation. For example, the glitching audio when moving the gui elements in eXT drove me nuts ever since it came out.. as it did many users; However, there wasn't a constant barage of posts senselessly requesting that it be fixed. The point had been made... and every once in a while, it would get brought up.. but handled in a very constructive manner. Well guess what? it took a long time, but it's now fixed. That is really the heart of my point. If you are looking for instant satisfaction, it's not going to happen. It's simply going to require lots of patience. Being critical yet constructive is good, but being negative just generates bad vibes... and who really wants that?

[semiquaver]

I can see both sides of this one - if you offer a gripe or suggestion here and get only silence back well then it seems natural to try again.... when a strong response is made, like with the render bug when Ben said it was a top priority, well ok then I think we can all shut up and wait a while.

I think Mackie would do well to waste a little more time responding here or on their own forum.

[larsby]

ok, everyboy, sing this in a drunken voice.

(count in) one, two, one two three four.

Let the Loooove shine on everyone.
Let the Loooove be universal.

Let us all join haaaands.

The more we are together the happier we beeeeeee.

[headquest]

From what I could tell, headquest had the circular part of the argument well in check without your snyde comments.

Following the same logic, ModuLR, IIRs and pHz had "their part of the arguement well in check without your snyde comments"

As audiobot said before, there are two sides to the debate.

Surely on a forum everyone can chip in with their opinions, preferably without getting flamed

[headquest]

The ableton comparision is wonderful and all (hell, I have my beta version in hand too), but it really doesn't apply here. Since the demo release of tracktion, there have clearly been bugs reported, but that doesn't equate to things moving faster, as the circumstances are totally different. Yes, Live has blossomed as a model of efficiency in terms of resolving bugs... nonetheless, that's Live. Hopefully things will reach that point here as well...

Yeah, I agree Mod. In fact that was mostly the point I was trying (not very well, as usual!) to make

Not comparing the software (that debate belongs on the gernal hosts forum) but the approach to beta testing and bug fixing, I personally think these are some strong points of Ableton that Mackie could perhaps learn from -

1. Because they believed in Live as a product, they hired plenty of developers even BEFORE it started making lots of money
2. Since the success of L4 they hired even more developers to speed up bug fixing and development of L5
3. The beta process allows loads of pps to check for inconsistencies and incompatibilities that might not show up back at base
4. Most of the people (me included) know squat about programming, but can report back in a friendly and hopefully helpful way any problems encountered
5. Abelton can and do then act on the infor and using their team of developers produce a fix very quickly (at present, weekly)
6. They also continue to release bug fixes for previous versions where possible/appropriate. e.g. Live 4.1.4 came out just one day before Live 5 was announced on their site

Now that's not "sucking Live's penus" as AD80 so nicely puts it, but simply expressing the viewpoint that if Mackie looked at and adopted some of the Ableton model, there would now be a lot less bitching, carping and moaning here on the forum, and we would all be better mates still!!

Honestly, I would like to see Tracktion succeed....

Me, too. I would genuinely like Tracktion to succeed. But I also genuinely feel that:
1. I have paid out for software that doesn't live up to its promise at the moment, and
2. The fantastic potential of tracktion could be squandered if more effort is not made to address users' concerns.

Just my personal opinion though, and I respect the fact that many here see things differently.

[zeoy]

Where were you all for the Great Tracktion Drum Challenge?

Don't know about the others but some of us are already here