hmmm...

[IIRs]

Speaking as a percussionist, if Igor wanted to chat to me about how to brush a snare drum or tap a finger, I would be interested.

I might have a few words to say to him about MELODY!!

[IIRs]

Anyway, this entire ridiculous discussion is founded on a bad analogy: Stravinsky needed a better triangle VSTi, not a whole new method of notation

[jens]

crumbs jens, you've really lost the plot now! you seem determined to miss the point of what's being said and get offended.

I don't think so!

[jens]

Anyway, this entire ridiculous discussion is founded on a bad analogy: Stravinsky needed a better triangle VSTi, not a whole new method of notation

it was an example for a thorough and detailed discussion about a certain tool of musical expression!

[Lunch Money]

Jens, I love you like a brother... OK, OK... not THAT much. But I really DO like you despite our continued arguments over this issue.

But before you get on other people's cases, you need to consider that Tracktion is simply the perfect fit for some people (or, as perfect as it gets with the current selection).

And in the end, you can list features and flaws for ANY app and try to make it look either great or bad, and none of it matters because there's no accounting for the perfect fit.

Some guitarists love Ibanez "super-strat" guitars, and can't play 'their way' on a hollowbody jazz box with no whammy and low-output mini-humbuckers. As a guitarist, they'll probably enjoy puttering around on the jazz box, and it'll be fun for them, but it won't be a perfect match like the way they feel when they're on that Jem.

Ya know?

Maybe it's a poor analogy, but that's a part of the problem. For analogies, there's always some smart ass using a counter-example within the same analogy. I know because I'm one of the people that is that smart ass.

But there's no list of flaws and features... no analogy... and no justification needed for the fact that Tracktion provides me with the fit I'm most productive and comfortable with.



Greg

[jens]

But before you get on other people's cases, you need to consider that Tracktion is simply the perfect fit for some people (or, as perfect as it gets with the current selection).

A

I wasn't criticizing Tracktion at all, Greg!

(or at least not this time... )


the discussion broke loose because of this stupid often repeated pseudo-argument:

I don't want to sound like a smart ass, but do people really sit around at their computer going "damn, if only I had this one more feature, I could finally complete my vision!!"

Just friggin' record. Be a musician. Use what you've got.

it a paraphrase of the stupid:
'the Beatles recorded Sgt. Pepper on eight tracks and you're still crying for more features with all you've already got? Real musicians can work with anything!' (or some similar bullshit)

Polaris insulted you as well as me (and many others) round here.

[headquest]

it a paraphrase of the stupid: 'the Beatles recorded Sgt. Pepper on eight tracks and you're still crying for more features with all you've already got? Real musicians can work with anything!' (or some similar bullshit)

Polaris insulted you as well as me (and many others) round here.

I agree with jens on this one. In a way it was insulting, although I'm sure we've all come across this attitude a hundred times before!

Usually people resort to this arguement if...:

* they are technologically challenged and afraid/can't be bothered to stay up to date with new technologies... or:

* they know full well that the eqipment they personally own/have/can afford is somewhat lacking compared to the latest "state of the art" stuff.

If people don't want to discuss their views on technology, why are they here anyway? Surely that is the whole purpose of KVR forum!

[jens]

Yup! Exactly!

[pHz]

when Strawinsky conducted one of his pieces he cared for the most tiny details
- e.g. he could talk for five minutes with a triangle-player about how exactly to hit the triangle at one certain stroke... - what does that tell about his ability as a composer?

Just because he cared doesn't mean it mattered this just proves you can be a great composer despite having your head firmly up your own orifice

that's fkucing arrogant of you - who do you think you are to decide what and what not matters for the creative work of others?

just me that finds that REALLY funny ???

slainte rob

[pHz]

...

slainte rob

[Lunch Money]

OK, Jens, I was just getting wires crossed about what the argument was.

[rich_h]

I don't want to sound like a smart ass, but do people really sit around at their computer going "damn, if only I had this one more feature, I could finally complete my vision!!"

Just friggin' record. Be a musician. Use what you've got.

it a paraphrase of the stupid:
'the Beatles recorded Sgt. Pepper on eight tracks and you're still crying for more features with all you've already got? Real musicians can work with anything!' (or some similar bullshit)

Actually I don't interprete it like that at all, I consider it as "use what you like - if Tracktion doesn't suit you, fine, quit bitching and use what *does* suit you" and it's the logical conclusion to what has become an "is", "isn't", "IS TOO!!", "my dad's bigger than your dad", "IS NOT!!!" argument. Different things suit different people. I like using Tracktion, others don't, nothing wrong with that, but I will get peeved if the naysayers come and start suggesting that I'm using the wrong thing.

Arguing the points for and against something that is subjective in the extreme is a pointless waste of time. And now I've wasted five minutes on it too

[aldi]

Actually I don't interprete it like that at all, I consider it as "use what you like - if Tracktion doesn't suit you, fine, quit bitching and use what *does* suit you" and it's the logical conclusion to what has become an "is", "isn't", "IS TOO!!", "my dad's bigger than your dad", "IS NOT!!!" argument. Different things suit different people.

but exactly that is the problem with tracktion, or better to say with all the other stuff out there.
most stuff is completely overblown with too much features. and there aren't many sequencers on the market. i think most of us had chosen tracktion because it came nearest to what we want. i do so.
and thats the point why i (for example) m still here and hoping that few things get sorted out. i felt allway like : god, if i where the programmer of tracktion, it would be so much fun to improve it while still following this great concept of simplicity.

so switching over to something different isn't that easy, if tracktion is the closest to what you like, while the others are so far away (ok, soon energxt...)

[rich_h]

Aldi, I think I'm saying the same thing as you are, just not in a clear way. Essentially I'm "use what fits you" rather than trying to fit something that's inappropriate. That's why I use Tracktion, it was the first sequencer I have trtied that slotted directly into the way I like to work, everything else I tried I found hindered me. Having said that, I fully appreciate that Tracktion will not suit other people for whatever reason (or whatever Reason *chortle*!)

[jens]

I think most of us had chosen tracktion because it came nearest to what we want. i do so.

yeah, for sure - when I converted to Tracktion from Sonar this was exactly the reason - what other reason could I have had?

At the moment it's eXT for me but Sonar5 looks damned tempting and Jo just decided to code a follow up for Muzys...