Inadvertent Theft

[Jazzyspoon]

[Igor]A great composer steals, the lesser composer borrows.[/Stravinsky]

By that logic Andrew Lloyd Webber is a great composer...

Take that, Andy.

[vurt]

[Igor]A great composer steals, the lesser composer borrows.[/Stravinsky]

By that logic Andrew Lloyd Webber is a great composer...

:eek!:

[jancivil]

[Igor]A great composer steals, the lesser composer borrows.[/Stravinsky]

By that logic Andrew Lloyd Webber is a great composer...

The idea of Igor's statement is, if you STEAL something, you now own it, you have made it yours. If it sounds like your source, you've merely borrowed it.

Who did ALW even borrow from? I wouldn't know, I mean I kinda sorta remember Jesus Christ Superstar, none of his tunes there seemed too identical to anything I heard before.


AND! Is John Williams a great stealer or great borrower?

[robogone]

Who did ALW even borrow from?

Far too obvious to call it borrowing.

In the early days he stole from classical composers, notably Puccini and Mendelssohn, but in later years he stole from the Grateful Dead, Pink Floyd and I'm sure others that haven't heard about.

[knockman]

Inadvertently giving it away has always been my problem.

I still rue the day I mailed Ringo Starr a 1/4" reel to reel tape instead of the get well soon card I'd meant to send. But quite how "Yesterday" then became known as a Paul McCartney composition is anyone's guess. I expect he pinched it from the hospital bedside.

I do however recognise McCartney's creative contribution and his adaption does show a certain lyrical flair. My original was intended as a grammar exercise for those learning English as a second language, and taking the title of "The Day before Yesterday", was primarily concerned with the contrasting of past and past perfect tenses. Indeed, a brief snatch of the original lyrics does reveal McCartney's gift for phrasing when you consider the melody itself was lifted wholesale:

The day before yesterday,
All my troubles had seemed so far away.
But then yesterday it looked as though they were here to stay.
Oh I believed in the day before yesterday.

Oh well, these things happen...

[vurt]

AND! Is John Williams a great stealer or great borrower?

either way, he is not here to explain himself, you however are.
do you consider yourself a borrower or a stealer?

[Meffy]

do you consider yourself a borrower or a stealer?

[Ringo] I'm a bealer. [/Ringo]

[Ogg Vorbis]

The day before yesterday,
All my troubles had seemed so far away.
But then yesterday it looked as though they were here to stay.
Oh I believed in the day before yesterday.

Oh well, these things happen...

Seriously????? :-

[eduardo_b]

AND! Is John Williams a great stealer or great borrower?

either way, he is not here to explain himself, you however are.
do you consider yourself a borrower or a stealer?

Doesn't intention play a role in these? To borrow is to give credit, to steal is to pretend it's yours?

[rp314]

Since old Igor's quote has been made so much of in this thread, where does the following fall in regards to using other composers' material?

Much of Igor Stravinsky's ballet Pulcinella, which ostensibly reworks pieces by Pergolesi, is actually based on spurious works.

To be fair, it apparently was others before Stravinsky's time who were largely responsible for incorrectly attributing certain works to Pergolesi after he died at only 26 years of age. But probably not all of it was. I think Stravinsky just mostly did what he wanted to. Sometimes stealing, borrowing, inventing "Pergolesi", etc. When you're a great composer who's paid his dues you get all kinds of license. I'm not sure how much his nice quotes will do for the rest of us, though...

[Minouris]

[Igor]A great composer steals, the lesser composer borrows.[/Stravinsky]

By that logic Andrew Lloyd Webber is a great composer...

If I recall correctly, didn't Lloyd Webber get a spanking from Pink Floyd a few years back over main riff in "Phantom of the Opera" being lifted from "Echoes"?

[vurt]

AND! Is John Williams a great stealer or great borrower?

either way, he is not here to explain himself, you however are.
do you consider yourself a borrower or a stealer?

Doesn't intention play a role in these? To borrow is to give credit, to steal is to pretend it's yours?

i guess you would have to ask someone who conciously either borrows or steals, as the intention is theirs alone.

[eduardo_b]

AND! Is John Williams a great stealer or great borrower?

either way, he is not here to explain himself, you however are.
do you consider yourself a borrower or a stealer?

Doesn't intention play a role in these? To borrow is to give credit, to steal is to pretend it's yours?

i guess you would have to ask someone who conciously either borrows or steals, as the intention is theirs alone.

Well, there's also perception of intention.

[vurt]

i always assumed the intention was "to make something that sounds good/right".
at least its the only intention i care about.

[robogone]

AND! Is John Williams a great stealer or great borrower?

either way, he is not here to explain himself, you however are.
do you consider yourself a borrower or a stealer?

Doesn't intention play a role in these? To borrow is to give credit, to steal is to pretend it's yours?

Roger Waters said that it was an obvious rip off, but he didn't want to go through the litigation. However, he ripped ALW a new one in the lyrics to 'It's a Miracle' on 'Amused to Death':

"Lloyd-Webber's awful stuff runs for years and years and years
An earthquake hits the theatre but the operetta lingers
Then the piano lid comes down and breaks his f**king fingers
It's a miracle"