How important is VST3 support for you as a customer

[Bronto Scorpio]

Love this thread
I've voted for "I'd prefer VST3 plugins but would buy VST2 as well"

2.4 VSTs have worked perfectly for years for me and they will be working fine the next years, but there is nothing wrong with VST3 or 3.5

I haven't installed any VST3 plugins yet but that will change as soon as Zebra goes VST3 or 3.5

I may even upgrade to Cubase 6 for that single reason.
Steinberg achieved their goal, I'll buy the upgrade because of note expression. But thats no conspiracy, just a nice feature I'd like to have.
The same reason for every single upgrade I've ever bought

Really don't know whats sometimes going on with some guys here...

Cheers
Dennis

[trimph1]

megh...if it ain't broke don't fix it....

[aciddose]

plus, we hate NI too don't we?

I never got that way of thinking.

that's actually a stab at the people claiming any distaste for vst3 must be due to some hatred or otherwise illogically/emotionally based point of view. (that is, it was sarcasm.)

in fact there isn't a single reason i don't like vst3 that isn't entirely logical, well thought out, pros and cons considered and so on. i wish we could discuss only those aspects, but this isn't a coder/programmer forum anyway so i guess that would be an illogical thing to wish for.



also i should answer your question; why is it "considered unfortunate" for someone to use vst3; which is the best way to describe how i actually feel, i never said someone specifically shouldn't use vst3.

any support lent to vst3 only helps to push us further to the point where vst2 can be dropped. for every reason i've pointed out that makes vst2 better than vst3, although there are a few in the opposing direction, that leads to negative consequences for everyone. for some there are little or no negative consequences they care about - no simple c interface? "who cares". no open specification? "who cares". added bloat which is considerably worse than vst2, which already had plenty of it's own bloat? "who cares". it goes on and on. these are just the most obvious issues from the programmer's point of view.

the efforts to eliminate vst2 - such as what you mentioned - restriction of trademark use (wasn't this already granted unlimited in the previous license?...) for anyone using vst2, make it clear they want to eliminate vst2 for some reason.

like i pointed out, at least here in north america this isn't such a major issue. you can't advertise that your plugin is "vst alpha beta gamma ultra edition plus", but you can say "... (available in format compatible with ...)" without an issue. you can't put a glaring vst symbol on your package, but who really wants to do that anyway? i personally hate that kind of thing and i'll actually tend not to buy products that do it. i prefer a product that can support itself, not via association with some brand or mark that supposedly lends credibility - mostly because i suppose i have a very pessimist view regarding this idea itself, and that such an association with an unrelated mark lends negative credibility in my mind when i see it.

(in other words, i don't fall for such kinds of bullshit marketing ploys)

as far as i've heard, vst3 was the pet project of a new hire. i'm not sure if this programmer was a student hire, or an experienced one. i'm not sure if there was any previous experience with vst2, audio programming or interfaces. it seems in my opinion that the negative side of each unknown is somewhat more likely, but i can't say i know for certain.

we all know charlie stienberg was intending to pay a lot less interest to the company at that time, and as far as i've heard at this point he has absolutely no interest at all.

i don't know specifically, but i had heard some arguments were involved regarding the way vst3 was to be designed. again, i feel as if there was likely an intention to purposefully put implementation code into the interface to throw it and it's legal issues into the mud; take note "linux vst" started to appear at about the same time.

lots of questions that i'll possibly never have answered. you probably have a lot of access and know some of those answers, some of which i bet you won't share.

[hibidy]

Really don't know whats sometimes going on with some guys here...

I stabbed it with my steely knife, but I just can't kill the beast.

I guess my objection to this thread is it was dead and then rose up to to be the walking dead. The name of the thread is "how important is vst3 to YOU AS A CUSTOMER" but mostly has been anything but that since the resurrection.

CLEARLY by this pole not many care and I stated when things were fresh accordingly but now we've got all the "defend your opinion with your honor" bs going on and I for one would just like to see it go away. Of course me bumping it surely doesn't help but I just needed to say it.

[Bronto Scorpio]

Really don't know whats sometimes going on with some guys here...

I stabbed it with my steely knife, but I just can't kill the beast.

I guess my objection to this thread is it was dead and then rose up to to be the walking dead. The name of the thread is "how important is vst3 to YOU AS A CUSTOMER" but mostly has been anything but that since the resurrection.

CLEARLY by this pole not many care and I stated when things were fresh accordingly but now we've got all the "defend your opinion with your honor" bs going on and I for one would just like to see it go away. Of course me bumping it surely doesn't help but I just needed to say it.

Maybe we should try to lead the thread into a different direction. It worked for the "Very expensive presets" thread

Lets talk about cats. I like cats. I have a cat. She's called Susi

Cheers
Dennis

[trimph1]

[aciddose]

the very expensive presets thread is still on topic, it's just about presets for the style of silly hats and other garments for your cat. obviously if you can't knit your own cat mittens like any cat collecting insane old lady, you're lazy.

anyway this thread is still about the user's perspective, that's my whole point. i'm perfectly happy if users keep using vst2, we can make improvements and changes to the spec that are agreed upon in some centralized way to ensure stability between hosts and plugins and everyone lives happily ever after la-de-da and so on.

if user's perspective is that vst3 is so much better than vst2, that they can't do what they want with vst2.5 although that could be accomplished in a matter of minutes with many existing implementations then i have a serious problem with that.

the slow but sure pace that a combination of fud and sly marketing tactics are moving users to cubase and it's dog in a dress plugin format "must be better than the old dog format", is extremely concerning. it should be concerning to anyone involved in vst plugins, vst hosts and so on - it seems solely to benefit cubase and cubase users, which is obviously the entire point of vst3.

best thing in the world that could happen: yamaha hands down that they'll jump to vst5, skipping vst4's bugs and implementing a system identical to everything good about vst2, while removing anything bad and adding a slew of new features that are useful to everyone and not included in vst3.

[hibidy]

You guys are on to something!

If you use vst3, you are LAZY! Only a sod who uses presets would use vst3

[hibidy]

[AdmiralQuality]

Stop it, you're being silly.

[hibidy]

Stop it, you're being silly.

are you telling me to

[AdmiralQuality]

Stop it, you're being silly.

are you telling me to

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Colonel_(Monty_Python)

[shamann]

(and how many years old is VST3 now?)

Just over two years old.

VST3 is four and a half years old. The SDK (which was delayed for more than a year) is just over three years old.

[hibidy]

good job shamann, NOW we've gone back to the off topic ON topic

[koolkeys]

(and how many years old is VST3 now?)

Just over two years old.

VST3 is four and a half years old. The SDK (which was delayed for more than a year) is just over three years old.

pfft, still nothing. I don't care if the world ever accepts VST3 as standard. It's importance to certain users is still legitimate.

Thing is, people are still jumping on board, so it hasn't exactly "died" yet either.

Brent