DAW Add/Switch, From Sonar to...?

[logan_4600]

Let me get this right (to know we are talking about the same thing )
In sonar 8.5 i have Track Layers, where you go, record as much as you like, overlap clips in a same track, and then, when you activate Track Layers for that track, it auto-sorts them to fit. Then you can mute, move, crossfade etc. all in the very same Track.
Since Sonar X1 (and in X3 too) they removed Track Layers for Take Lanes, where, if activated in a track, every single new clip creates its own ´lane´ (sub-track) and they cannot be auto sorted, or cleaned, etc.
Is there a third option in newer versions? Are we talking about the same thing, don´t we?

I think we are close, almost on the same page - but you are solely thinking loop recording and don't like the new take/comp handling.

I have not seen a daw that do as old Sonar did.

I think Reaper with free item placement and play all items setting are the closest - and but don't think take handling do it automatically as old Sonar. Otherwise overlap of audio clips is a no-no everywhere as far as I recall. Cubase allow on midi though.

I kind of like the new style of comp lanes - more organized.
You get so many clips in one place with old style.

Pfffsss... It seems i will have to re-try or re-learn X3 or get in the Platinum wagon. Etiher way, from all the replies, i got curious about Studio One, dos it have a feature full demo?

[lfm]

S1 is a good daw - many like it.
When it comes to doing show/hide of stuff in mixer view - I prefer Cubase/S1 style with a sidebar and one click does it. New Sonar takes some clicks through menues - even if there are screensets you can save and recall.

So look for tall mixer view in S1 if you run it - so you get good overview. Otherwise that is hiddeous amount of clicking seing which inserts and sends were used.

Other things Sonarites probably are used to are track templates to resuse setup of tracks. I read a comment from someone that it should be something in S1v3 regarding that.

When it comes to using external midi gear I feel S1 really complicated things.
With all VST instruments no problems really.

About demo - no idea...

[logan_4600]

Track templates, a very usefull feature! The best of it is when you have something like BFD set up with multi outs and routing to buses; it recalls everything, from the plugin setting settings, to fx chains, busses and sends. V
I thought it was a common feature amongst DAWs, isn´t it?

[lfm]

Track templates, a very usefull feature! The best of it is when you have something like BFD set up with multi outs and routing to buses; it recalls everything, from the plugin setting settings, to fx chains, busses and sends. V
I thought it was a common feature amongst DAWs, isn´t it?

One would think so. One of the major things I look for - I just hate repeating boring operations.

S1v2.x did not have it(just hearsay that V3 do). They got something close called Musical Loops or whatever the name was, you could almost fake it if saving some data too - but names of tracks were not restored.

And Cubase you need to go to Pro to get track archives - and still rather limited not supporting Rack Instruments, only Track Instruments - if we talk about synths. But rather good, it does the job - and very good in the sense that you can make one larger archive that you can pick individual tracks from - so no need to make one for each setup if you know what you are looking for. One bauta project and save as archive - and loads really quick to make the selection what you want.

ProTools got SessionData - which I haven't tried hands on.
I only found 12.1 manual - and there it said PT HD so not sure if now in standard PT 12.4 too. Listed in comparison chart anyway, so I don't think you need HD.

Even Sonar Artist has that - and well implemented too.
Reaper was well made too. But both load everything from the template, you need to make individual ones - which is not a biggy.

Samplitude does not have it still, as I recall.
Not Mixcraft either.

[Unfocused]

I just upgraded to Sonar Platinum last week after much reservation about the subscription model, and "do I really need it," futzing about. Well, I'm really liking Platinum--was totally worth the upgrade for me: much faster, resolved some lock-up issues, and added some welcome new features I never knew I wanted. Most satisfying DAW purchase for me since Sonar 8.5. You really should give it a look.


-u

[logan_4600]

I just upgraded to Sonar Platinum last week after much reservation about the subscription model, and "do I really need it," futzing about. Well, I'm really liking Platinum--was totally worth the upgrade for me: much faster, resolved some lock-up issues, and added some welcome new features I never knew I wanted. Most satisfying DAW purchase for me since Sonar 8.5. You really should give it a look.


-u

Forgive me if you mentioned before, did you jumped from 8.5? Other version, or other DAW?

[lingyai]

Pfffsss... It seems i will have to re-try or re-learn X3 or get in the Platinum wagon. Etiher way, from all the replies, i got curious about Studio One, dos it have a feature full demo?

This of course only my experience, one's mileage varies etc .... I used Cakewalk from CW6 through Sonar 2, then returned to the fold one year ago with X3e, upgrading to Sonar Platinum in July. Really wanted to like it, settle down, have kids etc. The list of features is deep and way impressive.

The list of features which work reliably, however, is shorter. And for me, anyway, it has been amazingly erratic. I have easily spent a larger proportion of my "play time" in Sonar on interruptions to look up things which aren't obvious, to debug, and to post at length seeking help on forums than any other DAW I've used over 18 years as a hobbyist. (Search posts under lingyai there if you want details about my PC specs and problems).

It's just ... always something with Sonar. A number of recent fundamental problems (automation being ignored, routing setups arbitrarily changing / not being recalled correctly) which no one on the forum has been able to advise me on have prompted me to jump ship as I no longer really trust it, bottom line. Why craft a mix if the software doesn't remember it? I'll still use it for certain things but not as my Mother Ship for mixing. I say with some real regret, given my time investment. But as I finish the roughly dozen projects I started in Sonar, I am constantly reminded of how nice it will be to leave this work environment.

Even if it behaves better on your machine, it does require a lot of study to do some quite basic things (depending on what you find intuitive).

I'm not sure whether my new DAW, Studio One v3, will be the stable Mother Ship but I can at least say that it is for me so refreshingly easy to just do stuff in without consulting anything. If it proves to be stable as well, then I'm fine -- I'll trade a huge features list for ease-of-use and stability any day.

My suggestion to you would be, before signing up to Sonar Platinum, download the free demo of Studio One v3 and *really* try it out, to see if it's for you. My guess is it will at least be easier to get going with than with Sonar. If in doubt, then really try out the demo of Sonar.

Good luck.

[Unfocused]

I just upgraded to Sonar Platinum last week... Most satisfying DAW purchase for me since Sonar 8.5. You really should give it a look.


-u

Forgive me if you mentioned before, did you jumped from 8.5? Other version, or other DAW?

I've had every major release of SONAR between 8.5 and Platinum. I think Platinum finally delivers on the initial promise of the "X" platform, and then some.


-u

[LawrenceF]

S1v2.x did not have it(just hearsay that V3 do). They got something close called Musical Loops or whatever the name was, you could almost fake it if saving some data too - but names of tracks were not restored.

It's about 40% there in v3 with multi-instruments. You can save and recall instrument setups, drums, samplers, etc, with all of their plugs and names but no busses or fx routing. Nothing for audio tracks yet.

That first step was a nice add. Hopefully there's more to come.

As track templates go in general, Reaper is about as good as it gets anywhere.

[lfm]

S1v2.x did not have it(just hearsay that V3 do). They got something close called Musical Loops or whatever the name was, you could almost fake it if saving some data too - but names of tracks were not restored.

It's about 40% there in v3 with multi-instruments. You can save and recall instrument setups, drums, samplers, etc, with all of their plugs and names but no busses or fx routing. Nothing for audio tracks yet.

That first step was a nice add. Hopefully there's more to come.

As track templates go in general, Reaper is about as good as it gets anywhere.

Thanks for clarification.

I think both Sonar and Reaper shine in this track template area.
Total still Reaper on top considering how track folders and tracks/busses can be placed anywhere.

Cubase still good, but missing the point a bit in how track archives are implemented - does not feel they had track template idea as main focus doing it(and also found serious bugs in Pro 8.5). I also thought multi track presets would be like track template - but no.

[logan_4600]

Very informative, thank you all. It really seems i will have to try out S1 and ( maybe ) reaper. I´ve tried cubase years ago ( then, went te Sonar route ) so, Cubase is a no-go.
It would be really nice to try PT ( i think there is a Windows no-hardware dependant version ) but i dont´know if it has some trial. After all, even if i stay with Sonar, i will have a steep learning curve

[lfm]

It would be really nice to try PT ( i think there is a Windows no-hardware dependant version ) but i dont´know if it has some trial. After all, even if i stay with Sonar, i will have a steep learning curve

If you have an iLok key you can trial PT, yes, it has no hardware version.
Just note that AAX 64-bit plugins are required or some kind of wrapper for VST->AAX like Metaplugin or Patchwork. If you intend to use shipped plugins then no problem.

If you are selfsufficient on plugins/instruments you can get by with $99 annually to stay current with all upgrades - but entry cost is higher.

If you've got Avid hardware, like Fast Track or Mbox interfaces there were a crossgrade offer just ending last year. But still might be the cheapest route whatever price is now - if $299 or something, instead of $199 just ended. But if you have the interfaces you've already got PT Express which is quite ok for evaluating.

And maybe look at ProTools First which is free. You don't need that actuall iLok key then, just soft license on computer. But if needing plugins you cannot run your own - only what you buy from Avid store.

[tonedef71]

I have been a Cakewalk on Windows customer since Twelve Tone Systems's "Cakewalk for Windows Professional v1.0", and I have upgraded to every new Windows version they have ever put out, including the latest Sonar Platinum. I never did reach any sort of proficiency on any of the versions; I just mindlessly handed over the money for each upgrade; ditto for their professional instruments and Project 5.

That said, I took a chance and dropped $60 on Tracktion 5/6. The Tracktion DAW is quite different from Sonar, but once I started to get the hang of it, I realized that I could complete a piece of music much faster with Tracktion than I ever could with Sonar. Tracktion lacks some Sonar features I liked (e.g. 32 to 64-bit VST bridge; low-level and granular MIDI editing capabilities; prettier UI), but Tracktion makes up for it with a simple, consistent UI and several clever features of its own.

What won me over to Tracktion was watching Bill Edstrom's Groove 3 tutorial videos for Tracktion. He has since written a nice e-book user guide for Tracktion 6.

While the monthly updates to Sonar Platinum were refreshing, I have yet to decide whether or not I will be renewing my yearly subscription for Sonar Platinum.

[Alfalfa]

Just note that AAX 64-bit plugins are required or some kind of wrapper for VST->AAX like Metaplugin or Patchwork. If you intend to use shipped plugins then no problem.

I just discovered that the free Komplete Kontrol software hosts vsti, so you can use it in Pro Tools, because it has an AAX version, and you can use any vsti in it.

[Lejurai]

wich other DAW

Reaper. As simple as you want as deep as you need.