T-RackS 5 (5.0.1 update,information about free CS version, release date countdown added)

[zvenx]

the answer clearly isn't no. he clearly said, on multiple occasions, that some plugins may receive sonic improvements due to reworked oversampling. why are you so hell bent on ignoring something that is clearly stated? and why don't i have such problems? am i that smart? am i a mind reader?

Maybe you are.
I still see ambiguity in this:

Edit for clarity - As singles, don't expect miracles but some sonic improvement in some cases. Also, using the v5 plug-ins instead of the v4 give a series of other advantages in addition to sound quality. They’re more integrated in today’s DAWs, can be resized to be more readable, and are completely re-coded from ground up on the UI side, meaning more usability, quality, and being more future-proof.

And previous plugins were not re-coded except for the GUI. However they too will benefit from audio improvements to T-RackS 5 as mentioned above in Q9 (improved oversampling being a key way, where applicable).

You don't see there is a contradiction?
What am I missing that you see clearly? And I don't mean that in an antagonistic way, I really want to know what I am missing.
rsp

[musicalwarmth812]

I do believe this pricing is fine. Sure it could be better, but consider people having some or lots of T-RackS plugins, even up to owning MAX, well, they can all upgrade for $70 and get those four new plugins in the process. That's $15 each and $10 for the enhanced metering. Not bad at all. And if you don't want those four newbies, you can upgrade for free with the CS version, that at least gives you the new engine and GUI.
For free.

Sure, the price is fine. As for your consideration of people who have lots of T Racks processors already, everyone already knows the upgrade price and that is exactly why some people are pissed off about it - just as they were with the Amplitube 4 upgrade. Anyone who has purchased $99 qualifies, never mind if you own Amplitube and a lot of it's gear, other IK products and a shitload of T Racks processors - you still get the same upgrade pricing, and that's where some people are getting the screw you/you get the shaft vibe.

[musicalwarmth812]

the answer clearly isn't no. he clearly said, on multiple occasions, that some plugins may receive sonic improvements due to reworked oversampling. why are you so hell bent on ignoring something that is clearly stated? and why don't i have such problems? am i that smart? am i a mind reader?

Maybe you are.
I still see ambiguity in this:

Edit for clarity - As singles, don't expect miracles but some sonic improvement in some cases. Also, using the v5 plug-ins instead of the v4 give a series of other advantages in addition to sound quality. They’re more integrated in today’s DAWs, can be resized to be more readable, and are completely re-coded from ground up on the UI side, meaning more usability, quality, and being more future-proof.

And previous plugins were not re-coded except for the GUI. However they too will benefit from audio improvements to T-RackS 5 as mentioned above in Q9 (improved oversampling being a key way, where applicable).

You don't see there is a contradiction?
What am I missing that you see clearly? And I don't mean that in an antagonistic way, I really want to know what I am missing.
rsp

A crystal clear contradiction yeah.

[Burillo]

the answer clearly isn't no. he clearly said, on multiple occasions, that some plugins may receive sonic improvements due to reworked oversampling. why are you so hell bent on ignoring something that is clearly stated? and why don't i have such problems? am i that smart? am i a mind reader?

Maybe you are.
I still see ambiguity in this:

Edit for clarity - As singles, don't expect miracles but some sonic improvement in some cases. Also, using the v5 plug-ins instead of the v4 give a series of other advantages in addition to sound quality. They’re more integrated in today’s DAWs, can be resized to be more readable, and are completely re-coded from ground up on the UI side, meaning more usability, quality, and being more future-proof.

And previous plugins were not re-coded except for the GUI. However they too will benefit from audio improvements to T-RackS 5 as mentioned above in Q9 (improved oversampling being a key way, where applicable).

You don't see there is a contradiction?
What am I missing that you see clearly? And I don't mean that in an antagonistic way, I really want to know what I am missing.
rsp

no, that's not a contradiction. you don't have to recode the plugins for them to receive sonic benefits - you can also recode the underlying framework these plugins are using - the aforementioned "audio engine" that Peter has mentioned. if you improve oversampling in your framework - all plugins that use oversampling will benefit without being recoded.

[Peter - IK Multimedia]

no, that's not a contradiction. you don't have to recode the plugins for them to receive sonic benefits - you can also recode the underlying framework these plugins are using - the aforementioned "audio engine" that Peter has mentioned. if you improve oversampling in your framework - all plugins that use oversampling will benefit without being recoded.

This.

I apologize if my assumption that some underlying concepts of which I spoke might be clearer fundamentally to those on an audio forum or I would have elaborated but it seems elaboration was also something frowned upon so I suppose that would have been even worse.

[musicalwarmth812]

Since new oversampling has been implemented, will any of the processors (since we don't know which ones) utilizing this cause a high end roll off when using a 44.1 sample rate, like some past processors.

[Burillo]

you can't do oversampling without that high-end roll-off. that's anti-aliasing filter. if you don't do it, you'll have aliasing when downsampling.

[zvenx]

I did think of that,
but this previous quote: "

The new audio engine improvements apply to both, where appropriate (for example where oversampling improvements would give actual benefit, it will affect both standalone and single plugins)."

threw me.

So is it that those plugins that have oversampling have improved in quality.
Is it that all plugins have oversampling and therefore will be improved?

rsp

the answer clearly isn't no. he clearly said, on multiple occasions, that some plugins may receive sonic improvements due to reworked oversampling. why are you so hell bent on ignoring something that is clearly stated? and why don't i have such problems? am i that smart? am i a mind reader?

Maybe you are.
I still see ambiguity in this:

Edit for clarity - As singles, don't expect miracles but some sonic improvement in some cases. Also, using the v5 plug-ins instead of the v4 give a series of other advantages in addition to sound quality. They’re more integrated in today’s DAWs, can be resized to be more readable, and are completely re-coded from ground up on the UI side, meaning more usability, quality, and being more future-proof.

And previous plugins were not re-coded except for the GUI. However they too will benefit from audio improvements to T-RackS 5 as mentioned above in Q9 (improved oversampling being a key way, where applicable).

You don't see there is a contradiction?
What am I missing that you see clearly? And I don't mean that in an antagonistic way, I really want to know what I am missing.
rsp

no, that's not a contradiction. you don't have to recode the plugins for them to receive sonic benefits - you can also recode the underlying framework these plugins are using - the aforementioned "audio engine" that Peter has mentioned. if you improve oversampling in your framework - all plugins that use oversampling will benefit without being recoded.

[zvenx]

no, that's not a contradiction. you don't have to recode the plugins for them to receive sonic benefits - you can also recode the underlying framework these plugins are using - the aforementioned "audio engine" that Peter has mentioned. if you improve oversampling in your framework - all plugins that use oversampling will benefit without being recoded.

This.

I apologize if my assumption that some underlying concepts of which I spoke might be clearer fundamentally to those on an audio forum or I would have elaborated but it seems elaboration was also something frowned upon so I suppose that would have been even worse.

Yes Peter, but
"Fmr, Yes, because the underlying framework that has improved oversampling, will improve the audio quality in those older plugins that use oversampling, without the plugin needing to be recoded" to me is a lot shorter a response and lot clearer than what you actually wrote:

See my answer to Q9 in DarkStar's list.

Edit for clarity - As singles, don't expect miracles but some sonic improvement in some cases. Also, using the v5 plug-ins instead of the v4 give a series of other advantages in addition to sound quality. They’re more integrated in today’s DAWs, can be resized to be more readable, and are completely re-coded from ground up on the UI side, meaning more usability, quality, and being more future-proof.

And previous plugins were not re-coded except for the GUI. However they too will benefit from audio improvements to T-RackS 5 as mentioned above in Q9 (improved oversampling being a key way, where applicable).

[Burillo]

So is it that those plugins that have oversampling have improved in quality.
Is it that all plugins have oversampling and therefore will be improved?

i honestly don't know which exact T-Racks plugins have oversampling and thus would improve. i know British Channel has oversampling (as i did some tests on it recently while demoing Waves SSL). i would guess all the limiters and clippers probably have oversampling. Saturator-X does have oversampling. however, i can't give you a list of plugins that have oversampling, neither can i say how audible this supposed improvement would be.

[zvenx]

So is it that those plugins that have oversampling have improved in quality.
Is it that all plugins have oversampling and therefore will be improved?

i honestly don't know which exact T-Racks plugins have oversampling and thus would improve. i know British Channel has oversampling (as i did some tests on it recently while demoing Waves SSL). i would guess all the limiters and clippers probably have oversampling. Saturator-X does have oversampling. however, i can't give you a list of plugins that have oversampling, neither can i say how audible this supposed improvement would be.

No I didn't expect you to know that.
I was asking you how you read it and interpreted the :
"The new audio engine improvements apply to both, where appropriate (for example where oversampling improvements would give actual benefit, it will affect both standalone and single plugins)."

For me it just added to the ambiguity of his response, even after I considered that indeed the framework may have changed......

I still think a well worded FAQ would be the best solution.

rsp

[Burillo]

ah, my apologies. adding oversampling where there was none would constitute "recoding" in my book, so probably it's the former rather than the latter.

[zvenx]

I think what also adds to my person confusion is T-RackS the main rack or module or whatever it is called and the T-Rack plugins that can be used in DAWs and that S and 5 sometimes look the same if you are reading quickly...........so I interpreted

And previous plugins were not re-coded except for the GUI. However they too will benefit from audio improvements to T-RackS 5 as mentioned above in Q9 (improved oversampling being a key way, where applicable).

as him referring to the T-Rack Main Module/Rack.
anyway I think I am better understanding now..

Will we be able to purchase individual updates to this new version if we have a few single plugins some of which we want to update?
rsp

[evilantal]

I was asking you how you read it and interpreted the :
"The new audio engine improvements apply to both, where appropriate (for example where oversampling improvements would give actual benefit, it will affect both standalone and single plugins)."

For me it just added to the ambiguity of his response, even after I considered that indeed the framework may have changed......

I still think a well worded FAQ would be the best solution.

rsp

I was under the assumption that that referred to hosting the plugins/modules in the standalone T-RackS application, which now supports higher sampling rates. It is the standalone application that has the upgraded audio engine, not the plugins themselves.

Now I'm not so sure.... If the single plugins themselves are also updated, would that then mean that we need to buy upgrades for all the plugins that have oversampling?

Just when I think I get it, an answer is given or some information comes forward that throws me off again.
This is some confusing product release...

[zvenx]

I had that same understanding/assumption too.

Here is what I currently think.

Many developers use frameworks, which i understand are like call to functions to a common code (aka framework)............ so each plugin code doesn't duplicate the tons of code that are common to them, but they call the functions in the framework (my c days are so far behind me, i forgot what it is called there). And when compiling the plugins the compiler incorporates all the tons of codes in the framework that each plugin needs.
The advantage is: 1) you can improve the framework and benefit all programs without recoding the programs themselves just a recompile.

2) you don't have to copy and paste the same code into all your plugins...just do a function call (subroutine? I really forgot the c language name for them).

So some of the plugins we already bought from ik use oversampling.. so those plugins when use as single plugins in our daws will benefit from the oversampling improvements made in the framework, once they have been recompiled using this new improved framework.

That's how I understand it anyway...... hope this helps more than hurts, and I have it right

rsp

I was asking you how you read it and interpreted the :
"The new audio engine improvements apply to both, where appropriate (for example where oversampling improvements would give actual benefit, it will affect both standalone and single plugins)."

For me it just added to the ambiguity of his response, even after I considered that indeed the framework may have changed......

I still think a well worded FAQ would be the best solution.

rsp

I was under the assumption that that referred to hosting the plugins/modules in the standalone T-RackS application, which now supports higher sampling rates. It is the standalone application that has the upgraded audio engine, not the plugins themselves.

Now I'm not so sure.... If the single plugins themselves are also updated, would that then mean that we need to buy upgrades for all the plugins that have oversampling?

Just when I think I get it, an answer is given or some information comes forward that throws me off again.
This is some confusing product release...