I tend to be pretty tough when it comes to professional criticism at my job (not music related). I love getting feedback to help me be more effective. When it comes to music, I even surprise myself how deeply criticism effects me. Not from skilled musicians mind you, but from the lay person, the person who just listens to whatever is on the radio and likes it.
I think the difference is this. I make money at my job. It is a profession. You don't like what I'm doing, tell me how to fix it and I will to please you and make more money. I make music for fun, it is a hobby. When someone tells you that they don't like what you labor at for fun, it wounds. Likewise, when someone compliments my music, it is intensely satisfying. Knowing that something I did for the love of it brought you joy? Yeah, I dig that.
Can you really handle the truth/critiques about your work?
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- KVRist
- 236 posts since 18 Mar, 2003 from Jacksonville, FL
Even I was offended by what I was going to put here.
Newest Release, retro EBM, Brute Opposition - Unity of Command, released Sept '22 bandcamp link
Newest Release, retro EBM, Brute Opposition - Unity of Command, released Sept '22 bandcamp link
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- KVRist
- 236 posts since 18 Mar, 2003 from Jacksonville, FL
One other thing. When it comes to critiquing someone's work I look at it like this.
1. Did they ask for honest feedback or did they just put something out there?
2. I am not going to criticize something from a genre I don't like.
3. Keep it constructive if you are criticizing. If you are complimenting, who cares.
4. Try to think how YOU would feel if you were getting the feedback you are giving.
1. Did they ask for honest feedback or did they just put something out there?
2. I am not going to criticize something from a genre I don't like.
3. Keep it constructive if you are criticizing. If you are complimenting, who cares.
4. Try to think how YOU would feel if you were getting the feedback you are giving.
Even I was offended by what I was going to put here.
Newest Release, retro EBM, Brute Opposition - Unity of Command, released Sept '22 bandcamp link
Newest Release, retro EBM, Brute Opposition - Unity of Command, released Sept '22 bandcamp link
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- KVRist
- 239 posts since 19 Oct, 2016 from Madrid
+1Chemik wrote:I tend to be pretty tough when it comes to professional criticism at my job (not music related). I love getting feedback to help me be more effective. When it comes to music, I even surprise myself how deeply criticism effects me. Not from skilled musicians mind you, but from the lay person, the person who just listens to whatever is on the radio and likes it.
I think the difference is this. I make money at my job. It is a profession. You don't like what I'm doing, tell me how to fix it and I will to please you and make more money. I make music for fun, it is a hobby. When someone tells you that they don't like what you labor at for fun, it wounds. Likewise, when someone compliments my music, it is intensely satisfying. Knowing that something I did for the love of it brought you joy? Yeah, I dig that.
Work is payed, if I do it wrong I change it to what is expected as right.
But music, I put so much heart on it that I recognize I've got angry with mates'opinions sometimes, specially when they listen to whatever shit and don't appreciate mine's
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- addled muppet weed
- 105867 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass
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- KVRAF
- 25053 posts since 20 Oct, 2007 from gonesville
A criticism is concrete, it deals in technique/technical problems and what's wrong with specificity. "I don't like this" is not in itself criticism. "I don't like this because _" and you can indicate the reasons might be criticism. If the "reasons" look like "a dated perspective on aliens", if only because someone used the word "alien" in the title, you aren't talking about music, you're just bullshitting.
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- KVRAF
- 2269 posts since 10 Jul, 2008 from Orbit NE US
Criticism of work: yeah, i need to fix it. Criticism of my "music", sound art, whatever? Don't give a crap. I make noise cause i like it, if other people like it that is awesome, if they don't: there's plenty of other stuff for them to listen to. Of course i am not a pop musician in which case my tune would probably change. 
Back when i was in a duo that made Really far out noise, soundscapes, feedback jams, and outer space audio enviroments we played live a lot and distributed cassettes through the mail art network. Anyone who didn't like a gig could have their money back (if they wanted to leave soon after they arrived, which happened all the time). When we got reviews in zines our favorites were the really negative ones, we'd sit around (band, crew, friends) partying and laugh for hours. When the manager of CBGBs came to me after a gig and told me (harshly) "i don't know why you even bothered" i laughed in her face and said "FU, i've seen way worse shit in here many times, at least we did something original."
Having said (typed) all that, i am always aware that not everyone feels this way so i rarely criticize (at least to the musicians face) unless it's really pretentious, plastic crap, meant only for commercial gain. Even then i usually just move on. I know that some people are devastated by criticism, esp when it's harsh.
Back when i was in a duo that made Really far out noise, soundscapes, feedback jams, and outer space audio enviroments we played live a lot and distributed cassettes through the mail art network. Anyone who didn't like a gig could have their money back (if they wanted to leave soon after they arrived, which happened all the time). When we got reviews in zines our favorites were the really negative ones, we'd sit around (band, crew, friends) partying and laugh for hours. When the manager of CBGBs came to me after a gig and told me (harshly) "i don't know why you even bothered" i laughed in her face and said "FU, i've seen way worse shit in here many times, at least we did something original."
Having said (typed) all that, i am always aware that not everyone feels this way so i rarely criticize (at least to the musicians face) unless it's really pretentious, plastic crap, meant only for commercial gain. Even then i usually just move on. I know that some people are devastated by criticism, esp when it's harsh.
gadgets an gizmos..make noise https://soundcloud.com/crystalawareness Restocked: 3/24
old stuff http://ww.dancingbearaudioresearch.com/
if this post is edited -it was for punctuation, grammar, or to make it coherent (or make me seem coherent).
old stuff http://ww.dancingbearaudioresearch.com/
if this post is edited -it was for punctuation, grammar, or to make it coherent (or make me seem coherent).
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- KVRAF
- 1724 posts since 31 Dec, 2004 from betwixt
"the truth"
Truth is a mapping function between a set of linguistic propositions and some (usually binary) value assignment.
So if I claim to be playing 3 minutes of 16th note "legato" on an electric guitar at 140 bpm with some kind of phrygian dominant tonality, and I actually play a lydian sound in nothing but tied whole notes... It is objectively measurable that I have failed, and there is an obvious, useful critical pathway. That's the sort of criticism I welcome.
If, however, I have done exactly what I set out to do, and the "criticism" is "it sucks" well then... someone has failed to engage in any critical thinking at all, and I'm not even bothered by the comment. I may even pleasure myself to it.
Truth is a mapping function between a set of linguistic propositions and some (usually binary) value assignment.
So if I claim to be playing 3 minutes of 16th note "legato" on an electric guitar at 140 bpm with some kind of phrygian dominant tonality, and I actually play a lydian sound in nothing but tied whole notes... It is objectively measurable that I have failed, and there is an obvious, useful critical pathway. That's the sort of criticism I welcome.
If, however, I have done exactly what I set out to do, and the "criticism" is "it sucks" well then... someone has failed to engage in any critical thinking at all, and I'm not even bothered by the comment. I may even pleasure myself to it.
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- addled muppet weed
- 105867 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass
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- KVRAF
- 2367 posts since 17 Apr, 2004
Useful criticism draws attention to a potential issue, explains why you might want to improve it, and how you could do so. I welcome that. I am very grateful to those people who have given me honest feedback and helped me improve areas where I knew I needed to improve.
Useful criticism also provides you with context, so you can decide if you want to act on it. Maybe you want your song to sound like the band is playing underwater, and a crystal clear mix doesn't fit your vision.
Criticism without context is easy to get over. I've received the 2-word feedback "absolute garbage", but that didn't bother me. Some random person on the internet didn't like my song. It happens, I move on. I don't expect everyone to love everything I've ever done, and I definitely won't lose sleep over criticism that won't help me improve.
It can sometimes be disappointing to hear that the track you thought was the bee's knees isn't the finished article yet. But the whole point of asking for feedback is to improve, not to massage your own ego. Of course I like it when people say they think a song is amazing. But that's not why I wrote the song either. The need to create is what drives me to write songs, and the drive to improve what makes me seek feedback.
Useful criticism also provides you with context, so you can decide if you want to act on it. Maybe you want your song to sound like the band is playing underwater, and a crystal clear mix doesn't fit your vision.
Criticism without context is easy to get over. I've received the 2-word feedback "absolute garbage", but that didn't bother me. Some random person on the internet didn't like my song. It happens, I move on. I don't expect everyone to love everything I've ever done, and I definitely won't lose sleep over criticism that won't help me improve.
It can sometimes be disappointing to hear that the track you thought was the bee's knees isn't the finished article yet. But the whole point of asking for feedback is to improve, not to massage your own ego. Of course I like it when people say they think a song is amazing. But that's not why I wrote the song either. The need to create is what drives me to write songs, and the drive to improve what makes me seek feedback.
Voted KVR's resident drunk Robert Smith impersonator (thanks Frantz!)
https://open.spotify.com/artist/2myYesRBRgQB3LkZzEYdt5 | https://soundcloud.com/steevm/
https://open.spotify.com/artist/2myYesRBRgQB3LkZzEYdt5 | https://soundcloud.com/steevm/
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- KVRAF
- 12555 posts since 7 Dec, 2004
vurt wrote:Aleatoriac wrote: I may even pleasure myself by playing 3 minutes of 16th note "legato" on an electric guitar at 140 bpm with some kind of phrygian dominant tonality.
They call that: noodling.
You need some variation in the tempo to really get into it though, you can't just go at a steady 140 BPM! Toss in some swing and triplets ya tosser before you end up with Carpal tunnel.
Free plug-ins for Windows, MacOS and Linux. Xhip Synthesizer v8.0 and Xhip Effects Bundle v6.7.
The coder's credo: We believe our work is neither clever nor difficult; it is done because we thought it would be easy.
Work less; get more done.
The coder's credo: We believe our work is neither clever nor difficult; it is done because we thought it would be easy.
Work less; get more done.
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- KVRAF
- 1724 posts since 31 Dec, 2004 from betwixt
