Nexus 4

[msvs]

rather end of the year, give us a break

[LoveEnigma18]

rather end of the year, give us a break

I thought you would get a better break after putting it out.

I don't have Avenger, but listening to Avenger Expansion Demo: Melodic Techno 1. Superb sounds, congrats!

In fact, this video is what made me ask about Vintage Synths.

[msvs]

yes the Vintage Synths could be very very well used for Melodic Techno as well
(and vice versa)

[BenfordLaw]

Yuo may think about the update (or that 3/4 was only 2 years apart) what you want, but this is a fact: Nexus isnt just a "player". Its a deep synthesizer.

Well, it IS a "player" to the users, isn't it? That's what matters to us. What happens inside Nexus, we can't access, so it might as well not be there. If we have no control over those parameters, they don't exist and don't help the user, the customer.

[LoveEnigma18]

yes the Vintage Synths could be very very well used for Melodic Techno as well
(and vice versa)

Nice. I hope it will also have presets suitable for use across multiple genres.

[Evoider]

There has been much conjecture about Avenger and Nexus.
The way I look at the situation.
One is a preset machine the other is a programmable synth.
The artist who values unique sounds who wants to sound current will pick up Avenger. Because they can fully edit nearly every parameter or aspect of the Synth.
Nexus from a bygone age that allows sounds from the past that once sounded influential.

[msvs]

Yuo may think about the update (or that 3/4 was only 2 years apart) what you want, but this is a fact: Nexus isnt just a "player". Its a deep synthesizer.

Well, it IS a "player" to the users, isn't it? That's what matters to us. What happens inside Nexus, we can't access, so it might as well not be there. If we have no control over those parameters, they don't exist and don't help the user, the customer.

no. A "player" means for me static playback. But Nexus "generates" its sounds in realtime / synthesis. And yes, you hear the difference to a "static" Kontakt library. And "having no control over the parameters": Well, there is a lot you can do...with the newer N4 XPs you have assigned controls per preset via the 4 Macro buttons. Andy many things can also be done with the modmatrix on the user side. The effects are fully editable and re-sortable. The ARPs are fully editable, the TGs, All Layer transposes, pannings volumes. You have access over filters and amp Envs. Thats quite a lot tbh

[Loudness_Contour]

Yuo may think about the update (or that 3/4 was only 2 years apart) what you want, but this is a fact: Nexus isnt just a "player". Its a deep synthesizer.

Well, it IS a "player" to the users, isn't it? That's what matters to us. What happens inside Nexus, we can't access, so it might as well not be there. If we have no control over those parameters, they don't exist and don't help the user, the customer.

nAnd "having no control over the parameters": Well, there is a lot you can do...with the newer N4 XPs you have assigned controls per preset via the 4 Macro buttons. Andy many things can also be done with the modmatrix on the user side. The effects are fully editable and re-sortable. The ARPs are fully editable, the TGs, All Layer transposes, pannings volumes. You have access over filters and amp Envs. Thats quite a lot tbh

It's true that you can do a lot to transform a preset into something completely different with Nexus. From all the people complaining about how Nexus is not a real synth, I'd be curious to know how many actually program their patches from scratch using other synths. I'm sure many of them start by tweaking presets rather than creating a sound from nothing.

[LoveEnigma18]

Sound design things apart, I wonder how do Avenger and Nexus4 compare in terms of sonic quality. In general, are they both on par with each other in terms of presets included in the factory content and expansions? Of course, I would exclude some very old, not-so-great Nexus expansions in this context.

[GMusic]

Sound design things apart, I wonder how do Avenger and Nexus4 compare in terms of sonic quality. In general, are they both on par with each other in terms of presets included in the factory content and expansions? Of course, I would exclude some very old, not-so-great Nexus expansions in this context.

I would not judge based on Avenger's qualities on Soundcloud demos on the product pages. Check their Youtube demos and reviews/walkthroughs on Avenger expansions (like Bartek's). Soundcloud to me just doesn't sound that great.

I would buy Avenger, even if the expansions are a bit more expensive, it's worth it. If you like Nexus, you will probably love Avenger. So much more flexibility, sub outs for every layer/drum sound so you can apply your own FX in your DAW's mixer, tagging system is so much better. Layers are labeled nicely. For some reason, Avenger just sits better in mixes for me with less tweaking. Could just be coincidence based on the particular sound designer or expansion though.

[LoveEnigma18]

Sound design things apart, I wonder how do Avenger and Nexus4 compare in terms of sonic quality. In general, are they both on par with each other in terms of presets included in the factory content and expansions? Of course, I would exclude some very old, not-so-great Nexus expansions in this context.

I would not judge based on Avenger's qualities on Soundcloud demos on the product pages. Check their Youtube demos and reviews/walkthroughs on Avenger expansions (like Bartek's). Soundcloud to me just doesn't sound that great.

I would buy Avenger, even if the expansions are a bit more expensive, it's worth it. If you like Nexus, you will probably love Avenger. So much more flexibility, sub outs for every layer/drum sound so you can apply your own FX in your DAW's mixer, tagging system is so much better. Layers are labeled nicely. For some reason, Avenger just sits better in mixes for me with less tweaking. Could just be coincidence based on the particular sound designer or expansion though.

Thanks for the answer. Yes, I am comparing audio demos on YouTube only.

The thing is I already invested a significant amount in Nexus4 recently because I am not into sound design, and if needed, I have other synths for that purpose. Since Avenger is along similar lines I thought it might be redundant. Also, as you said, Avenger expansions are a bit expensive, and although the factory library of ~ 900 presets sounds great, I might start getting into their expansions, which can quickly turn expensive, especially with Nexus4 expansions ecosystem alongside. Avenger sounds awesome and the feature set is exceptional, no doubts. Also, it is on sale, so tempting. But not sure it would be worth it for me. If I did not buy Nexus4 already, it would have been a difficult choice.

This is why I asked this question. If sounds are of comparable quality, maybe I am fine with Nexus4. I am also looking forward to the upcoming Vintage Synths expansion for it.

Guess I will stick to the Nexus4 ecosystem.

[GMusic]

Sound design things apart, I wonder how do Avenger and Nexus4 compare in terms of sonic quality. In general, are they both on par with each other in terms of presets included in the factory content and expansions? Of course, I would exclude some very old, not-so-great Nexus expansions in this context.

I would not judge based on Avenger's qualities on Soundcloud demos on the product pages. Check their Youtube demos and reviews/walkthroughs on Avenger expansions (like Bartek's). Soundcloud to me just doesn't sound that great.

I would buy Avenger, even if the expansions are a bit more expensive, it's worth it. If you like Nexus, you will probably love Avenger. So much more flexibility, sub outs for every layer/drum sound so you can apply your own FX in your DAW's mixer, tagging system is so much better. Layers are labeled nicely. For some reason, Avenger just sits better in mixes for me with less tweaking. Could just be coincidence based on the particular sound designer or expansion though.

Thanks for the answer. Yes, I am comparing audio demos on YouTube only.

The thing is I already invested a significant amount in Nexus4 recently because I am not into sound design, and if needed, I have other synths for that purpose. Since Avenger is along similar lines I thought it might be redundant. Also, as you said, Avenger expansions are a bit expensive, and although the factory library of ~ 900 presets sounds great, I might start getting into their expansions, which can quickly turn expensive, especially with Nexus4 expansions ecosystem alongside. Avenger sounds awesome and the feature set is exceptional, no doubts. Also, it is on sale, so tempting. But not sure it would be worth it for me. If I did not buy Nexus4 already, it would have been a difficult choice.

This is why I asked this question. If sounds are of comparable quality, maybe I am fine with Nexus4. I am also looking forward to the upcoming Vintage Synths expansion for it.

Guess I will stick to the Nexus4 ecosystem.

The thing with Nexus is once you're in the ecosystem, you're at the mercy of buying new expansions to acquire sounds...you can't really think of a sound and think, man I bet I can find that sound in a Nexus expansion...lol. Good luck. You'll be buried in presets with a rather abysmal tagging system, taking forever to find something remotely close to what you want.

At least with Avenger the more detailed tagging can narrow things down a bit more, you can import your own samples, substitute a preset's sound sources with other soundsources from any expansion/factory content, substitute arp patterns from any expansion/factory content, send each layer to DAW mixer channel, etc...I can go on and on. There really is no contest in my opinion. With this much power and flexibility, you can't complain at a $5-$10 price difference per expansion. The price difference is not that much, and is completely justified and worth every penny.

I was contemplating the Nexus 4 upgrade, but at $99 and what it does not add to what I already find perfectly fine in Nexus 3, I will not be upgrading. Unfortunately, but understandably in a technical regard, all new expansions are Nexus 4 only. In most cases, aside from a few nexus expansions (like Hollywood series), Avenger covers the same ground. So moving forward, all my money is going to be invested into Avenger's ecosystem.

I secretly wish Manuel would ditch Nexus, Mirko ditch Rapid, and they both focus on Avenger and the expansions, making them even greater than they already are! But I know this is likely impossible to happen.

[LoveEnigma18]

All valid points. No denying that Avenger would probably be a better investment for anyone starting out. If you have Nexus3 and don't have Avenger, then it would make full sense to spend that $99 towards Avenger.

Also, I presume the CPU usage of Nexus4 would be much lower than Avenger and would allow for many more instances than Avenger. So, it is still a bit of choice paralysis: whether to be with Nexus4 only, or only Avenger, or does it make sense to keep both, etc.

The difference is actually clear for what they do and whom they would suit, but it's just the possibility of owning both that creates this dilemma.

I just saw a teaser video of Avenger 2.0. Looks promising and the GUI looks much better. Not sure when that's coming and what the upgrade price will be like. If there is any fresh info on that it might help with in deciding whether to buy Avenger right now.

[GMusic]

I just saw a teaser video of Avenger 2.0. Looks promising and the GUI looks much better. Not sure when that's coming and what the upgrade price will be like. If there is any fresh info on that it might help with in deciding whether to buy Avenger right now.

I had no idea those teasers existed, thanks. Looks to be 1 year old though. Hope it's coming soon. Looks great!

Yes, Nexus offers some CPU savings as MSVS mentioned in another post. But for my experience/project sizes, this is not a factor. I hardly use more than 10 instances and never had an issue with Nexus or Avenger...can't say the same for U-HE plugins though...my god lol. Try using 10 Divas or Bazilles without overloading CPU

It sounds like you still want Avenger By the way, off topic but... SweetWater sells it with two other payment options if buying at once is not your liking: 36 months 0% interest payment option with their card (currently $5/month) or 3 payments per month (currently $55/month).

[tony10000]

I think they are different tools for different tasks. I use Nexus because it has a wide range of sounds and I have favorited the ones I like and they are instantly searchable available. Avenger for me is more of a sound design tool, although I have purchased a small number of packs for the kinds of sounds I am interested in.