Advantage of buying Kontakt7 over Bitwig Sampler

[Uplay]

Hi folks,

I cannot find the comparison chart between Bitwig Sampler and Native Instruments Kontakt sampler. How are they different and what is the benefit of buying and using Kontakt7 in Bitwig while Bitwig has the Sampler device? Since there is a free version of Kontakt7 player, there is no benefit of buying the paid version for Bitwig users?

https://www.bitwig.com/sampler/
https://www.native-instruments.com/en/p ... kontakt-7/

[nowiamone]

Kontakt is a whole ecosystem, much more than a sampler. It has incredible in-depth editing tools, FX for internal usage, Scripting, and much more.
Remember that countless companies are producing their products, their professional sample libraries within Kontakt. Some of them release their full product only on the full version of Kontakt, not the Kontakt Player.

Kontakt has so many more abilities than Bitwigs sampler that it’s even hard to compare the two.

If we were to compare them based on the rudimentary limited features of Bitwigs sampler, than Bitwigs sampler will come on top in its specific field of workflow, just because it is way more integrated into the DAW, and therefore faster to use.
Also don't forget that the sampler can be part of the grid and can be used for some advanced magic, like granular playback, slicing etc, all controlled within a grid device. So the sampler can be powerboosted within Bitwigs system, as it’s well integrated.

General question to you: if you have a hard time comparing tools and don’t know if you need one, you probably really dont need it, because a "real need" comes from knowing exactly what's lacking in your workflow, and then asking specifically for that which is lacking - so what are you trying to find in a sampler, what do you need?

If we were to talk about what's lacking in Bitwigs sampler for my personal workflow:
1. Ability to record live audio with it. Bitwigs sampler is Unusable for creating an audio looper in the grid.
2. Quick and dirty audio slicing for live performance a la "Simpler" of Ableton. Better slicing (no fiddly workaround via grid, but real one. And improving the fiddly slice-adjustment region...) https://bitwish.top/t/chopping-slicing- ... sampler/33
3. Timestreching could be improved with better workflow. https://bitwish.top/t/time-stretching-i ... ampler/196
4. Bpm, transient, pitch, scale detection in Bitwig is bad/non existant, compared to top notch software on the market.

My workaround for those "needs" was as follows:
1. I built an audio looper for Bitwig via Touch OSC, a Touch controller software with scripting abilities.
2., 3., 4. As sampler which has a really really better timestreching, bpm and transient detection algorithm and pitch detection (!), i am using the serato sampler. The experience of slicing, chopping, timestreching there is on a whole other level compared to Bitwig. At least until Bitwig will hopefully release a Sampler+ and better transient and bpm detection, and introduce pitch and scale detection.

[Uplay]

Thanks for your advice!

[JHernandez]

While it's capable of a lot more (it's a full featured sampler and beyond), the only reason I started using Kontakt recently (for a job) is for the professional (mostly acoustic) instrument libraries I couldn't dream of making myself. They have some amazing stuff.

For all my other needs Sampler in Bitwig. It's no slouch either, it lives in Bitwig after all. It's just different.

You gotta know what you want to do. nowiamone is right.

[xbitz]

I'm not an expert in these, isn't it easier to use a cloud service?

It says,
"The Opus Player engine remains the industry leader" - MUSICTECH
Hyper-fast loading, only loading the samples you need when you need them"

how fast is this, because at first glance, let's ignore the fact that it's a subscription model, but it seems better than managing GBs of instrument libraries locally

https://www.soundsonline.com/composercloud

[JHernandez]

"What happens to my compositions if I cancel my membership?"

"If you do not have an active license for the libraries, they will not load up in the Opus software, but any tracks you have exported to audio will continue to playback. However, nothing will happen to your compositions if you pause or cancel your membership, you simply won't be able to access the instruments as before to create new compositions or make edits to the Midi instrument performance. In the unlikely event you decide to cancel you can render (bounce) the instruments in your compositions to your digital audio workstation before you leave. You can always resubscribe, activate the license, and those software instrument tracks will reload for you to use again."


Personally I rather buy the few libraries I actually need.

[lunardigs]

I really like working with the Bitwig sampler. It's a pleasure to build instruments with. As it should be I guess since it's so integrated.
Otoh, when I had Kontakt, years ago, the thing I liked best was the defacto-standard plethora of premium instruments offered.
However, I didn't enjoy making my own instruments with it! And if I really think about it, that was my general experience with NI all together--with the exception of GuitarRig perhaps.

Anyway, the Bitwig sampler is superior to Kontakt in many ways since it's part of the daw.
I definitely want to see it developed more, especially for building instruments.

Regarding a replacement for Kontakt, in terms of premium instrument packs, I personally want to see Decent Sampler blow up. OR, maybe, UVI Falcon, provided they build for Linux.

[duanosforde]

I use Kontakt these days mainly for the vast number of sample libraries, you can't go wrong. Bitwig for sound design because its easier to work with vs Kontakt. I actually like using the UVI sampelrs as well.

[KaifengOut]

I use Kontakt these days mainly for the vast number of sample libraries, you can't go wrong. Bitwig for sound design because its easier to work with vs Kontakt. I actually like using the UVI sampelrs as well.

This is the way.

I've been using Kontakt for years, and I find it most useful when all I need to do is load up an instrument from one of the Kontakt libraries and start playing it. Usually I'll find an instrument I need, tweak it to my liking, then save the instrument as a Bitwig preset. In this way, Kontakt is just another "instrument" bank to me.

Although, I've found Kontakt to be kindof buggy/glitchy. I have version 6 and have been wondering if Kontakt 7 has most of the prior kinks worked out or not.

[nowiamone]

I use Kontakt these days mainly for the vast number of sample libraries, you can't go wrong. Bitwig for sound design because its easier to work with vs Kontakt. I actually like using the UVI sampelrs as well.

This is the way.

I've been using Kontakt for years, and I find it most useful when all I need to do is load up an instrument from one of the Kontakt libraries and start playing it. Usually I'll find an instrument I need, tweak it to my liking, then save the instrument as a Bitwig preset. In this way, Kontakt is just another "instrument" bank to me.

Although, I've found Kontakt to be kindof buggy/glitchy. I have version 6 and have been wondering if Kontakt 7 has most of the prior kinks worked out or not.

Kontakt 7 can be tried via free Player version!

My assessment: it got worse.

Not only Kontakt, but especially Komplete Kontrol, which of course is a little of topic, but i have to mention it:
I m leaving komplete kontrol, because Native Instruments is not able to deliver their former high standards. The loading times imcreased, the forced usage of Kontakt 7 within Komplete Kontrol.. the worse GUI where you can EITHER see the browser OR the plugin... the broken customization of user presets.. I'm now changing to Bitwigs Browsing instead of using Komplete Kontrol.
Even replacing the keyboard.

[KaifengOut]

I use Kontakt these days mainly for the vast number of sample libraries, you can't go wrong. Bitwig for sound design because its easier to work with vs Kontakt. I actually like using the UVI sampelrs as well.

This is the way.

I've been using Kontakt for years, and I find it most useful when all I need to do is load up an instrument from one of the Kontakt libraries and start playing it. Usually I'll find an instrument I need, tweak it to my liking, then save the instrument as a Bitwig preset. In this way, Kontakt is just another "instrument" bank to me.

Although, I've found Kontakt to be kindof buggy/glitchy. I have version 6 and have been wondering if Kontakt 7 has most of the prior kinks worked out or not.

Kontakt 7 can be tried via free Player version!

My assessment: it got worse.

Not only Kontakt, but especially Komplete Kontrol, which of course is a little of topic, but i have to mention it:
I m leaving komplete kontrol, because Native Instruments is not able to deliver their former high standards. The loading times imcreased, the forced usage of Kontakt 7 within Komplete Kontrol.. the worse GUI where you can EITHER see the browser OR the plugin... the broken customization of user presets.. I'm now changing to Bitwigs Browsing instead of using Komplete Kontrol.
Even replacing the keyboard.

That's unfortunate about Kontakt 7 >_<

[Milkman]

Kontakt and the NKI standard, in general, have gotten worse. 100s of paid, 3rd party products I own stopped working a few months back, and so far NI is offering no way to make them work again. I assume each 3rd party creator would have to buy a new license from NI, and unless they do that their stuff doesnt work.

An example of a NKI seller who adopted the new method? Soundiron -- they now make you buy a download code from them, which downloads and installs the package, and then you have to use another code to authenticate that package with Native Access. 100s of other sellers I use, including Rigid Audio and a few others, dont have that sort of DRM in place, so Kontakt doesnt recognize their NKI or KT3 anymore. KK is broken, and the 'Library' thing in Kontakt is terrible and inconsistent.

Is there any real comparison between the full version of Kontakt7 & Bitwig's internal sampler?? I wouldnt touch Kontakt with a 10 foot pole today, if I didnt already own it because of my last Komplete purchase.

[Soundiron]

An example of a NKI seller who adopted the new method? Soundiron -- they now make you buy a download code from them, which downloads and installs the package, and then you have to use another code to authenticate that package with Native Access. 100s of other sellers I use, including Rigid Audio and a few others, dont have that sort of DRM in place, so Kontakt doesnt recognize their NKI or KT3 anymore. KK is broken, and the 'Library' thing in Kontakt is terrible and inconsistent.

It's not additional DRM, it's just the standard installer for all Soundiron products in general. Most of our products don't require Native Access activation at all.

If you order NKS encoded products from the Soundiron shop, you can actually just use the NI serial number in Native Access to download it directly there. The NKS serial number is included in the download information email. The installer is provided in case you prefer to download it manually from us instead, and as a fail-safe in case it's ever not available to download in Native Access, but our downloader is not required for our NKS products at all. NKS libraries that require the serial number to unlock in Native Access are still available to download through the standard installer, but all you really need is the serial number by itself.

[Milkman]

An example of a NKI seller who adopted the new method? Soundiron -- they now make you buy a download code from them, which downloads and installs the package, and then you have to use another code to authenticate that package with Native Access. 100s of other sellers I use, including Rigid Audio and a few others, dont have that sort of DRM in place, so Kontakt doesnt recognize their NKI or KT3 anymore. KK is broken, and the 'Library' thing in Kontakt is terrible and inconsistent.

It's not additional DRM, it's just the standard installer for all Soundiron products in general. Most of our products don't require Native Access activation at all.

If you order NKS encoded products from the Soundiron shop, you can actually just use the NI serial number in Native Access to download it directly there. The NKS serial number is included in the download information email. The installer is provided in case you prefer to download it manually from us instead, and as a fail-safe in case it's ever not available to download in Native Access, but our downloader is not required for our NKS products at all. NKS libraries that require the serial number to unlock in Native Access are still available to download through the standard installer, but all you really need is the serial number by itself.

While I was not criticizing Soundiron for their ability to keep up with NI's inhospitable changes, and I was actually referencing the Soundiron content as an example of what you have to do to successfully continue working within that ecosystem, this is indeed less efficient for customers, and it is indeed another layer of complexity and a potential point of failure.

I am currently onboarding myself into the Triaz (Sound Alchemy) system for percussion and some melodic content, and I plan to move fully away from the NI ecosystem until they stabilize and/or their new private equity bosses get tired of the new toy and pump/dump.