Let‘s speculate about 6.0

[_leras]

There is reason why it ends with shouting, often there is a circle of Defanders (tm) around a user with a question or frustration (or whatever, often adorned with a language-barrier of some sort) ridiculing the user. As being a nonbeliever; mostly with the "if you don't like it, switch to another DAW" kind of brainpower.

Please can you link to an example of this happening?

If not, you're being dishonest.

[machinesworking]

Do you truly think some people don’t get completely enamored with a product and refuse to take any criticism at all of it???

I mean objectively that’s just delusional logically, but you do you I guess?

I haven't seen that here. I think that the people who seem to like Bitwig the most, or are most knowledgeable and share their knowledge also have feedback and sometimes even gripes.

I think the difference is there isnt hyperbole and blowing small things into end of the world issues.

I think you'll find most of that group of people have emailed ideas to Bitwig support multiple times, and are not short of suggestions, ideas and things they think would improvement.

I'd say it's framed in a more measured and positive way. This is probably because this group are actively using Bitwig to make music and enjoying using it as it is.

I can't speak for other people but I really don't have any blockers or show stoppers in Bitwig. The only impediments I have when making music in Bitwig come from me.

Now... The negative group... From what I see the same gripes are made repeatedly and loudly. And it seems that small issues are presented as huge issues that prevent any music to be made.

It's not a high traffic forum, so it only takes a few people to turn the conversation from useful and well meaning into a detailed sh1tshow, which is no good for anyone, now or in the future.

I like Bitwig, but I jump around a lot between DP11, Bitwig, Live, the MPC Live and now Push3.
I don't think this forum is any more or less crazy than Gearspace or any other lightly moderated forum.

If you follow my forum posts on Bitwig you'll see my only real complaint is the update plan, and yes, it's always some drama if it comes up. It's literally the only real drama though. So for the most part it's all good.

OK my only other gripe, I wish Bitwig had skipped a simple interface and made a dedicated hardware controller like Push 3. I have no doubt that Bitwig would make a smarter stand alone than Ableton has. I'm glad Push 3 finally has Follow Actions and time signatures, but sitting next to the MPC it's such a massive difference in UX, Akai did it right, and Push is just a performance controller you can write phrases in. Access to the parameters of instruments is just....

[_leras]

If you follow my forum posts on Bitwig you'll see my only real complaint is the update plan, and yes, it's always some drama if it comes up. It's literally the only real drama though. So for the most part it's all good.

Sorry, I thought you were saying that some people are so enamoured by Bitwig that they won't accept any criticism of it. And I don't think that is true.

I think any of the advocates/fan boys that people try to mention have all suggested things they would like to see, and also will have emailed Bitwig about their suggestions as well.

Just not trying to burn the house down while discussing something.

[machinesworking]

orry, I thought you were saying that some people are so enamoured by Bitwig that they won't accept any criticism of it. And I don't think that is true.

For the most part. The Spectral Suite fiasco was an exception, some people absolutely acted like other users were throwing fits about that breach of trust, i.e. toxic positivity at it's finest. Like I said, I don't think this place is any worse than any other barely moderated forum in terms of trolls and defenders of the faith.

[Trancit]

There is reason why it ends with shouting, often there is a circle of Defanders (tm) around a user with a question or frustration (or whatever, often adorned with a language-barrier of some sort) ridiculing the user. As being a nonbeliever; mostly with the "if you don't like it, switch to another DAW" kind of brainpower.

Please can you link to an example of this happening?

If not, you're being dishonest.

Sorry to ask that...but: Really??

There are for sure hundreds if not thousands examples of that here on the forum and you (belonging to these "defenders") have the cheek to stand here and demand:
"So either you are linking examples here because I am too lazy to search myself or you have proven that you are dishonest..."

This post here is already the best example ever... why do you need other links?
Probably you don´t even understand that what you wrote is exactly what SpaceCadetOnLeave has stated...
Do my work or you are dishonest! Perfect... there is seriously no better example to show!

This discussion here is getting really ridiculous that the very people who belong to the ‘club’ stand here and all testify from one mouth: "No, no... There's no such thing here!"

Sure... I've never seen either anyone plead guilty in court unless they were looking for a deal... very believable... no really!

[_leras]

Sorry to ask that...but: Really??

Yeah... Really. And not trying to be disingenuous. I.e. I just read through this thread to try and find something. Anything here is pretty tame.

You said some features (apparently again), some one suggested you use a different DAW if it was really an issue but they didn't think your comments were as big an issue.

You commented you wanted sampler slice, other person said they didn't really care as they didn't use the sampler that much.

You know everyone has different work flows and want and need different features. Some people use lots of samples, some people use the grid, some people use Bitwig FX, and others like me don't use much of any of those but really lean into the tracks grouping/audio routing, modulations.

There's loads of stuff I don't care about that much. For me Bitwig is great and I live with any annoyances as they don't hold me back that much.

Other people may be more affected by different things.

I don't think anyone doesn't want improvements here, but people have different ways and levels of emotion to express that. Some people let it wind them up too much.

[Jac459]

Sorry to ask that...but: Really??

Yeah... Really. And not trying to be disingenuous. I.e. I just read through this thread to try and find something. Anything here is pretty tame.

You said some features (apparently again), some one suggested you use a different DAW if it was really an issue but they didn't think your comments were as big an issue.

You commented you wanted sampler slice, other person said they didn't really care as they didn't use the sampler that much.

You know everyone has different work flows and want and need different features. Some people use lots of samples, some people use the grid, some people use Bitwig FX, and others like me don't use much of any of those but really lean into the tracks grouping/audio routing, modulations.

There's loads of stuff I don't care about that much. For me Bitwig is great and I live with any annoyances as they don't hold me back that much.

Other people may be more affected by different things.

I don't think anyone doesn't want improvements here, but people have different ways and levels of emotion to express that. Some people let it wind them up too much.

Sampler slice? Why would it be useful with the modulators of Bitwig and drum machine?
I am asking because I was using Mimic which is relying on slices when on reason studios and totally stopped for the better workflow of Bitwig. I am curious of the use case.

[_leras]

I presume it's to drop a loop into the sampler and automatically split it and key map it and recreate the loop as midi notes as well.

Its a useful feature for sure. I tend to start with samples, but rarely loops, and record some extra percussion, so this is not high on my list personally.

[_leras]

For the most part. The Spectral Suite fiasco was an exception, some people absolutely acted like other users were throwing fits about that breach of trust, i.e. toxic positivity at it's finest. Like I said, I don't think this place is any worse than any other barely moderated forum in terms of trolls and defenders of the faith.

Oh gosh, I'd forgotten about that storm in a tea cup. But oh my, you'd have thought Bitwig had pissed in the tea pot the way some people carried on.

I didn't think it was that bad to begin with and Bitwig included it for free pretty quickly.

I do wonder if the vocal crowd actually use these regularly these days.

[BobDog]

Im pretty sure all the people that threw their toys out of the pram about the spectral stuff use it every day and could not live without it

[machinesworking]

For the most part. The Spectral Suite fiasco was an exception, some people absolutely acted like other users were throwing fits about that breach of trust, i.e. toxic positivity at it's finest. Like I said, I don't think this place is any worse than any other barely moderated forum in terms of trolls and defenders of the faith.

Oh gosh, I'd forgotten about that storm in a tea cup. But oh my, you'd have thought Bitwig had pissed in the tea pot the way some people carried on.

I didn't think it was that bad to begin with and Bitwig included it for free pretty quickly.

I do wonder if the vocal crowd actually use these regularly these days.

Yep, you were one of the people who didn't think it was that big of a deal. It was, and Bitwig changed because of people who were not Defenders of the Faith™. I'm glad you didn't hold back, but this is exactly what I mean by toxic positivity, Bitwig isn't immune to mistakes, and in this case outrage and criticism changed company policy.

So thanks for proving my point, there aren't too many situations where yours and others overt defensive stance about Bitwig is a negative, but there are some cases, and that's why I said I don't think it's any more or less filled with extremists in terms of company loyalty.

At least there isn't anyone doing the RTFM at people asking questions about Bitwig here, that gets old on other company forums. One I went to for years would accuse people of using cracked versions of the DAW if the poster was new, since for years the manual was only printed..

[pdxindy]

So thanks for proving my point

Your point isn't proven. All you do is claim over and over that it's true, without ever giving a single example. As it stands, your point is 100% unsubstantiated.

[coroknight]

Since Serum 2 came out I've been really into that, and similar synths like Phase Plant. It made me realize how close the bitwig grid is to greatness and if they just gave it some love, it could give Serum and Phase Plant a run for their money, and in many ways it already has.

Workflow, plugability, and paper cuts are holding it back.

[machinesworking]

So thanks for proving my point

Your point isn't proven. All you do is claim over and over that it's true, without ever giving a single example. As it stands, your point is 100% unsubstantiated.

I just gave a "single example" oh loyal Defender™ 

Again neither of you are that bad, but you are 100% shields drawn loyalists, that acted like everyone else was crazy and complainers during that whole fiasco.

[perpetual3]

So thanks for proving my point

Your point isn't proven. All you do is claim over and over that it's true, without ever giving a single example. As it stands, your point is 100% unsubstantiated.

I just gave a "single example" oh loyal Defender™ 

Again neither of you are that bad, but you are 100% shields drawn loyalists, that acted like everyone else was crazy and complainers during that whole fiasco.

Hold up bro, like every one else was crazy? Isn’t that a little overblown? C’mon pdxindy and Leras were and are not like. It’s more like, after someone has bitched about it enough it’s time to move on. Don’t you think that’s reasonable? Say your peace, do it with some respect and move on.