Zebra Oldskool Project

[tencentcat]

Just listened to the demos. Can you have these ready tomorrow?

[mkastrup]

Just listened to the demos. Can you have these ready tomorrow?

Visit the Preset exchange topic, i posted some patches there or just use this link:

http://www.xsynth.com/download/MKastrup_Zebra2_V1.zip

These are 17 of the first patches i made. Most of them are being re-worked for the final package.

/Michael

[soulibertad]

Wow - everytime I hear a Zebra2 sound I wish to get it, but I am so intimidated by synth programing, and I have a thing about using other peoples presets. But I may just have been persuaded with your sounds. Thanks!

[beej]

Actually, Z2 is imo the least intimidating complex synth I've ever used.

I actually originally bought Zebra 1 on the basis of the interface design and not on how it sounded, because I was really impressed with it...

So... go for it...

[Notron User]

Urs is the trifecta as far as developers go. He's a monster coder, he's got mad skillz with user interface design, and he's got good people skills. Most of the time you're lucky IF you find a developer who excels in one of the categories.

[soulibertad]

I know - I bought filterscape and have interacted with Urs in the past. Great guy. I've just never had the luck with these modular type of synths, and I'm sure some of you will laugh. For instance, Massive by NI does my head in with its routing scheme, and its supposed to be one of the easiest! I gave up on absynth too. I use the the synths in the Legacy collection, Alphakanal Automat, and some racks in Live 6.

In all honesty, I lost having the time needed to learn proper synthesis because of law school, and pretty much program my synths the way I program my sh-101 and juno 106 - very basically! I wonder if I will ever have the time now... But I will probably go with Zebra2 after I graduate next week, and "retire" my analogs for awhile. I need to pick a great sounding synth which has lots of potential and stick with it. Urs deffinetly gets my money over NI, or any other manufacture of modular synths.

Sorry I hijacked the thread. Those old skool patches are bad ass!

[Howard]

Massive by NI does my head in with its routing scheme, and its supposed to be one of the easiest!

Although less powerful, Massive and Virsyn Tera (BTW) are certainly more difficult to program than Zebra2, and both have an overall "colder" sound. Urs has put a lot of thought into both the UI and the engine, and it shows.

I need to pick a great sounding synth which has lots of potential and stick with it.

[joke mode on]
So how's about our amazingly fantastically brilliant KeyToSound Nexsyn?
C'mon guys, let's hear those Remedy competition entries...
[joke mode off]

[mkastrup]

Wow - everytime I hear a Zebra2 sound I wish to get it, but I am so intimidated by synth programing, and I have a thing about using other peoples presets. But I may just have been persuaded with your sounds. Thanks!

Softsynths come and go all the time and choosing a few as workhorses can be difficult but if your looking for a synth which can be sculpted into just about anything, then its Zebra. When you browse the patches made by you can actually HEAR who made a certain patch cause each individual adds his own little special to a patch. Not many synths around which can do that. I'm yet to hear 2 identical strings made by 2 individuals in Zebra. So in other words, i'm sure if you just stick to tweaking in the start you will feel you added something of yourself to an existing patch.

Zebra is a workhorse, period

/Michael

[pdxindy]

Wow - everytime I hear a Zebra2 sound I wish to get it, but I am so intimidated by synth programing, and I have a thing about using other peoples presets. But I may just have been persuaded with your sounds. Thanks!

Zebra is actually fairly easy to get started with and to understand. The structure of a patch is so easy to see... Module 1 goes into Module 2 which goes into Filter 1. It is right there.

When I demoed Tera, I had a hard time figuring out what went into what. Various modules can be routed in different ways and by pull down menus in various locations. Egads! 2 weeks of playing around with it it still did not make sense to me. Couple hours with Zebra2 and I understood how things were organized, structured and so on. Obviously making good presets takes some more understanding of sound, adding good modulation and so on, but Zebra invites that understanding.

and besides the GUI, Zebra sounds great. The full stereo signal path is valuable. One of the things I listen to with a synth is how it sounds with all effects off. Here is a very simple Zebra preset sound with no external effects and no Zebra effects either.

http://www.draigathar.org/zebra/mozart.mp3

It still has life and some body in it. Turn off the effects in Tera and see how a preset sounds without.

Another thing I look for is how a synth sounds when it is not multiple osc's with lots of unison making a big wall of sound, but rather a single osc making 1 clear sparse sound. Zebra stands out for me in this case. 1 osc can sound great!

[codef0x]

Although less powerful, Massive and Virsyn Tera (BTW) are certainly more difficult to program than Zebra2, and both have an overall "colder" sound.

That's one thing I'm confused at!
I've been struggling a bit trying to get Z2 to sound "icy" (without being metallic), shrill, thin, and razor, razor sharp. Silly as it sounds, I need a little bit of that -- but still want to use Z2.

Hints?

Also off-topic, I've noticed 'chorus' ModFX turns square/pulse waves into wedges, that resemble a saw wave. I've also noticed that no matter what I do I can't get chorus to phase-cancel periodically.

To get this effect I have to use another osc and detune very slightly, and then I have to use an LFO to get it to move 'back and forth' by modulating the detune. Seems like a bit of a waste to use 2 OSC's and an LFO, without superbly distorting the waveform and wanting/getting intermittant phase cancellation because Chorus won't move all the way to the 'start' of each wave.

[Howard]

I've been struggling a bit trying to get Z2 to sound "icy" (without being metallic), shrill, thin, and razor, razor sharp.

Try the other oscillator modes.

Also off-topic, I've noticed 'chorus' ModFX turns square/pulse waves into wedges, that resemble a saw wave.

You'd be surprised what some "true analog" so-called square/pulse waves look like!

I've also noticed that no matter what I do I can't get chorus to phase-cancel periodically.

Chorus isn't meant to do that. Use a phaser.

To get this effect I have to use another osc and detune very slightly, and then I have to use an LFO to get it to move 'back and forth' by modulating the detune. Seems like a bit of a waste to use 2 OSC's and an LFO, without superbly distorting the waveform and wanting/getting intermittant phase cancellation because Chorus won't move all the way to the 'start' of each wave.

Again, you shouldn't expect chorus to do that. BTW: Have you played around with the Phase parameters built into the oscillators? Activate "Invert" -> instant cancellation

[mkastrup]

I've been struggling a bit trying to get Z2 to sound "icy" (without being metallic), shrill, thin, and razor, razor sharp. Silly as it sounds, I need a little bit of that -- but still want to use Z2.

Try set OSC to SpectroMorph in the Waveform window. Then experiment with Batman kinda waveforms just keep it to sharp edges (Triangle and Saw) then you should get something similar to the Bandworks under OSC FX but with a different sharp timbre.

/Michael

[mkastrup]

I was wondering how many of you people check the XY option when browsing a patch ?

Problem is, lets say i created a drawbar organ like thing and we all know that alot of timbres can come out by just adjusting the levels on each harmonic. Should it be left to the user to play with the settings or should i suggest settings ? A drawbar can have a pretty many settings heh heh

So how would you like it ? 1 patch or lots of patches with variation ?

Ooops here is one good example where i manipulate the XY's:

http://www.michaelkastrup.com/synthdemo ... ool_06.mp3

/Michael

[pdxindy]

I was wondering how many of you people check the XY option when browsing a patch ?

Problem is, lets say i created a drawbar organ like thing and we all know that alot of timbres can come out by just adjusting the levels on each harmonic. Should it be left to the user to play with the settings or should i suggest settings ? A drawbar can have a pretty many settings heh heh

So how would you like it ? 1 patch or lots of patches with variation ?

Ooops here is one good example where i manipulate the XY's:

http://www.michaelkastrup.com/synthdemo ... ool_06.mp3

/Michael

Maybe in the future Urs can add some snapshot buttons on the XY page (there is room) so you can save XY presets in a preset. That seems to me like a good approach to this.

As for your question, I do check the XY page on presets (and use it myself). I suspect there are plenty of people who do not check the XY page though.

You could make two directories. 1 with the single 'master' preset, and one with the XY variations saved as presets as examples of what that preset could do.

[beej]

Should it be left to the user to play with the settings or should i suggest settings ?
So how would you like it ? 1 patch or lots of patches with variation ?

What I do is program the preset as I want, then set up the XY's to provide good useful variations on that base preset. In the case of a drawbar organ patch, maybe I'd emphasise/de-emphasise one set of harmonics on the X axis, and another set on the Y-axis (or frequently, multiple sets of parameters one each axis).

I try to make each patch as useful as can be, as then even if the base patch isn't to each user's exact tastes, a quick XY tweak or two can get it broadly there, making the chances of each patch being useful to each person is much increased.

Then, if you want to, you can always save out XY variations as different sounds, as I did in the Transmission set, but I keep these separate from the main patch.