KVR Audio

VitaminD · Post by **VitaminD** » Thu Feb 02, 2012 4:48 am

I think it makes more sense to start with and stick with one of the more wider known hosts for several reasons.. some being better 3rd party support (plugins and hardware), more robust and developed platforms, as well as obtaining and growing skills that can be more easily transferred from one studio to another.. in addition to being able to collaborate with others easier (since the host is more common).

A big con to this is it costs a lot more to stay current with one of these platforms.. then again who needs to really stay that cutting edge current all the time?

so many things to consider...

This is a huge animal you've unleased, ttoz, and could be steered one of 80 directions..

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Thu Feb 02, 2012 5:21 am

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ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Thu Feb 02, 2012 5:22 am

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rockstar_not · Post by **rockstar_not** » Thu Feb 02, 2012 7:42 am

So, $19 isn't free. You are right, sir. But it's a fair sight less expensive than the hosts for which warez show up.

I used the freebie NFR version of Tracktion for at least a year or two - learned about dynamic processing, VSTi usage, etc. etc. etc.

I taught other folks about the stuff using T1 as well.

For those that don't need the Mac compatibility it still works well for them. If you have a Mac, you've laid out more money than I've spent on music gear and software in total over a 10 year period. (well, excepting my Larrivee acoustic guitar) And you have garageband in there, which in my opinion is nice to learn on, but from what I've seen it's a CPU hog because of the lack of bussing capability.

Those that use the excuse to steal software because they can't get real music done through freeware or nearly freeware are simply lazy and explaining away illegal behavior.

BTW, Powertracks and Realband are not 'real' hosts in my opinion, until they can do something as simple as sharing tempo information into VST/VSTi for tempo locking of a delay or what not. They still can't do that after years of asking. Powertracks ProAudio was my first DAW. I think I paid $29 back in 1996 time frame.

I'm giving Reaper a go right now because I am a little tired of the abandonware nature of Tracktion.

Again the point is that there are plenty of host choices for learning how DAW software works without claiming that the lack of choice forces the beginner to a warez choice. Simply not true.

There's also Mixcraft, another fine under $100 DAW. And it's the only place you can get the Kjærhus classic series plugins now. You can learn just about anything you need for audio DSP usage with those plugins.

Hey, I like the sentiment of the idea. But I vouch that it just takes a little work to figure out how to get the job done without going bankrupt, even on a meager income.

Nielzie · Post by **Nielzie** » Thu Feb 02, 2012 9:10 am

ttoz wrote:
Nielzie wrote:
ttoz wrote:
Maybe one month, being so inexpensive host, we could buy 10 copies of energy XT for people who have nothing to get started. or podium.
and we support the indi small dev and put fofd on their table for a month. Why the hell not.

Or MuLab

Maybe Jo, the extremely kind developer can give a good deal on it for the good cause.
Or pay Jo the normal price of the already inexpensive mulab to support him

Even better

AstralExistence · Post by **AstralExistence** » Thu Feb 02, 2012 1:42 pm

ok but, were all thinking poverty on the lines of usa and such, what we haven't entertained is the poverty level of places where 1 dollar might be a a lot of money. money that can be spent (and need be) spent on food, shelter, ect. in these places some people have computers too. how do we even begin to comprehend how to deal with this populace?

Mutant · Post by **Mutant** » Thu Feb 02, 2012 1:58 pm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... erage_wage

aciddose · Post by **aciddose** » Thu Feb 02, 2012 2:17 pm

my hope though is "maybe there could even be a thread where for more than a couple pages reaper isn't mentioned over and over again"

edit: (realized i'm perpetuating the issue)

lionscub68 · Post by **lionscub68** » Thu Feb 02, 2012 2:19 pm

ttoz - I know you just touched on GarageBand and that's what's bringing this thought to the table.

About 2 years ago I tried tutoring teens in high school pro bono (for free) how to produce music via home computer.
With a Mac? No problem. You've got garageband and its excellent built-in synths and effects.
All of that stuff sounds infinitely better than my 80s setup of the 4-track cassette deck, analog delay and distortion pedals... etc. Minus all the noise and 50-60Hz hum.

Anyways the class revolved around utilizing MIDI, VST effects, and VST instruments.
(Or AudioUnits depending on the scenario).
This was done on a volunteer basis and with a budget of $0.
In other words, make it work with what we have on hand.

We hit a freaking solid thick and unbreakable unbridgeable stone wall when we tried to proceed on the classes' PCs.
No free hosts.

Or rather, no *solidly operating* free hosts. We talked about the *theory* of recording, effects, EQ, recording techniques, etc, for a month using dozens of free online resources (e.g. tweakheadz.com). But whenever we tried to put something in practice... crash crash crash.

The program director for that school wrote a grant for, and also, petitioned the school district for a special-case budget to get a few Macs in that program. They succeeded but at the cost of cutting funding for another portion of their program. Once we got the iMacs out of the box, we moved forward with lightning speed and two of the students were recording full-blown 'songs' at a rate of 3 per week, with no additional software or hardware required (I donated a USB MIDI controller with a built-in audio interface; somebody else donated a microphone). When I say songs, I mean it. But the more talented kids were the ones pumping out the tunes.

Prior to this class, none of the students had any skills or experience with digital recording. Given the right tools, they flourished (or realized this wasn't for them).

Moral of the story: without solid tools (software, OS, Host/DAW, instruments), you *will* fail.
It *does* cost money, or at best a major financial commitment or sacrifice of some other perk in your life.

I keep thinking how much I got done with my 2005 1st generation Mac Mini G4.
Right now I'm still using it as a 'server' in my house, sorta kinda. Someday I'll either try to squeeze out a few bucks out of it or donate it to someone who would use GarageBand 2.0 Like I mentioned above. It runs 10.5.x OSX well enough to run any Universal Binary plugins.

I suggest those "in need" to start with an older Mac Mini running GarageBand. If it's for you? You can open all of those GarageBand projects in Logic Pro (since GarageBand was the evolved "MicroLogic" by eMagic from the 1990s, those files are compatible).

DHR53 · Post by **DHR53** » Thu Feb 02, 2012 2:24 pm

Gee... a program like MuLab which is $75. gives you all the synths and fx you need to make music... and the capability to create all the synths and sounds you could ever want. That's beer money for a couple months where I come from.

aciddose · Post by **aciddose** » Thu Feb 02, 2012 2:26 pm

i don't think anyone will need to worry too much about mac support. the percentage of macs owned by people who can't afford a host will be way lower than the percentage owned by people who can.

buying a mac is like buying protools. you only spend that kind of extra cash if you really want to go nuts.

Karmacomposer · Post by **Karmacomposer** » Thu Feb 02, 2012 2:32 pm

BIAB / Realband can share tempo - I used that software along with my hardware synth to lock tempo using BIAB / Realband as the tempo source.

You may want to check again with the new versions - tempo syncing works for me.

Mike

rockstar_not · Post by **rockstar_not** » Thu Feb 02, 2012 2:43 pm

Karmacomposer wrote:BIAB / Realband can share tempo - I used that software along with my hardware synth to lock tempo using BIAB / Realband as the tempo source.

You may want to check again with the new versions - tempo syncing works for me.

Mike

Very interesting. This hasn't shown up over at the PG Music forums. It's been a perennial complaint since the mid 2000's when folks started using VST/VSTi with it.

For example, Jamstix won't jam along. Plugins that need tempo like delays with beat division settings - those don't see the tempo. Perhaps this has changed. I would be VERY surprised because they didn't announce that it works.

So something like Kjaerhus autofilter plugin that has a beat division setting - does that work for you tied to the host tempo?

wwjd · Post by **wwjd** » Thu Feb 02, 2012 2:44 pm

some free hosts
http://bedroomproducersblog.com/2011/05 ... lications/

rockstar_not · Post by **rockstar_not** » Thu Feb 02, 2012 2:45 pm

Karmacomposer wrote:BIAB / Realband can share tempo - I used that software along with my hardware synth to lock tempo using BIAB / Realband as the tempo source.

You may want to check again with the new versions - tempo syncing works for me.

Mike

Oh, I see you are referring to a hardware synth. Yes, MIDI tempo via MIDI ports has worked since the programs were initiated. I'm talking about the programs sharing midi tempo information to plugins hosted by the programs. That's what has not worked and as far as I know still doesn't work.

-Scott

Initiative to help the less fortunate obtain legit software and help spread the love. Seriously.