What are your favorite non-Valhalla reverbs, and why?

[codec_spurt]

I've been demoing Room a bit and Shimmer too.

I will go for Shimmer before Room. Room is subtle, probably what you need.

Anyway, my favourite non - valhalla verb is Verbtone by http://www.sknote.it/Verbtone.htm

Nothing, not even a real Lexicon box comes close to this. It's juicy. No presets. Whatever. It's an EMT 140 plate clone irc.

But maybe i got that wrong too.

Jesus, Verbtone is the best ever reverb i ever heard in my life.

No offence man.

[valhallasound]

What reverb was Angelo Badalamenti using during the Blue Velvet / Twin Peaks era?





I would guess Lex 224 or 224XL, but it could be something weird like a Quantec. Does anyone know for sure?

Sean Costello

[Arrested Developer]

... but it could be something weird like a Quantec. Does anyone know for sure?

The reverb in "Floating" in fact has the vibe of the Quantec, i'm not sure though.
btw.: Sean, have you ever took a closer look at the Quantec? iirc, the developer once stated that it's a rather simple model, which in fact has a great sound...
(i once compared the Quantec IR-s of Logic (before they renamed them) with a hardware unit.
The difference was huge (in favor of the real thing)...

[valhallasound]

... but it could be something weird like a Quantec. Does anyone know for sure?

The reverb in "Floating" in fact has the vibe of the Quantec, i'm not sure though.
btw.: Sean, have you ever took a closer look at the Quantec? iirc, the developer once stated that it's a rather simple model, which in fact has a great sound...
(i once compared the Quantec IR-s of Logic (before they renamed them) with a hardware unit.
The difference was huge (in favor of the real thing)...

Which Space Designer impulses started off as Quantec impulses?

The Quantec is a true stereo reverb, which means that, in order to capture the impulse correctly, you would need 4 channels of impulse response:

Left in, left out
Left in, right out
Right in, right out
Right in, left out

Assuming that the Quantec is an LTI system (Linear Time Invariant), a 4 channel impulse response should be able to capture the state of the reverb exactly for a given setting. My guess is that the current high end Yardsticks are fairly linear, and are time-invariant. Quantec proudly states that they don't use modulation (time-variation).

The older Quantec QRS was probably nonlinear. Without a service manual, it is impossible to verify how nonlinear of a unit it is. The Lexicon service manuals, and the AMS RMX16 user manual, go into a fair amount of detail about the types of A/D and D/A convertors being used (including the floating point gain tricks that were used to make a 12-bit A/D and D/A work), the headroom of the processor, the delay word size written to RAM, stuff like that. I don't know of any publicly available service manual for the Quantec. Still, given the era that it came out, I would guess that there was some fixed point grit going on inside the QRS.

The basic Quantec algorithm topology was discussed in a thread on Gearslutz. The devil is in the details, of course. Breaking my own thread rule here: I created an algorithm for ValhallaRoom (Medium Room) that was inspired by the proposed Quantec topology. Medium Room is, by far, my least favorite algorithm in ValhallaRoom.

Sean Costello

[bmanic]

There's a fairly interesting Quantec Yardstick recreation in the Reaktor user's library. It's fairly interesting sounding and at least according to the author, it's very authentic (the guy who programmed the reaktor program had a hardware quantec to do direct comparisons with, side to side while programming the ensemble).

EDIT: Correction.. he used impulse responses to try and understand how the Yardstick works.

So any reaktor user can download that ensemble from the user's library. It's fairly unique sounding that's for sure. Useful? Well that comes down to taste.

I think this is the latest version

Cheers!
bManic

[Arrested Developer]

Which Space Designer impulses started off as Quantec impulses?

Sean, thanks a lot for the informative answer!

The logic IR-s were called "Munich neo" iirc, but i think that Logic rearranged all their IRs later, so one never knows
what unit the IR is from...
(i actually don't use the new preset folders of Logic...)

[valhallasound]

There's a fairly interesting Quantec recreation in the Reaktor user's library but it doesn't sound at all like your medium room though. It's fairly interesting sounding and at least according to the author, it's very authentic (the guy who programmed the reaktor program had a hardware quantec to do direct comparisons with, side to side while programming the ensemble).

So any reaktor user can download that ensemble from the user's library. It's fairly unique sounding that's for sure. Useful? Well that comes down to taste.

Cheers!
bManic

I've checked that one out. The basic architecture seems off, but the delay lengths might be correct.

Medium Room just kinda sucks. I don't worry about it too much, as there are 10 other useful reverb modes in there (11 modes in a few days). My code folders for my released plugins are full of several dozen other reverb modes, which all kinda sucked in one way or another.

I tend to take a very experimental/experiental approach to reverb design: Don't overthink things, just code it up and see how it sounds. Mind you, I DO think about this stuff. A lot. Some of my reverb modes have been percolating in my brain for a long time. I found a drawing in a notebook from 2006, that was pretty much identical to the Sanctuary reverb mode I put in ValhallaVintageVerb in February 2013. The point is that these algorithms will have side effects that won't be immediately obvious when they exist on paper or in my mind, but will become immediately apparent when coded up.

Sean Costello

[Amberience]

My BigSky is on its way!

Did you order direct from Strymon?

I have a guitar shop about 5 blocks from my house that carries the Strymon pedals. I should see if I can preorder through them. I need to pick one of these pedals up, just to keep track of what is going on in this space.

I'm reasonably confident in my own algorithm design skills, but putting algorithms of this quality in a beautiful metallic box...well, it provokes my professional jealousy.

Sean Costello

If I could have one thing, it would be ValhallaRoom in a stompbox

[valhallasound]

What reverb was Angelo Badalamenti using during the Blue Velvet / Twin Peaks era?

I would guess Lex 224 or 224XL, but it could be something weird like a Quantec. Does anyone know for sure?

I'm gonna answer my own question: If it wasn't a Lexicon 224/224XL, it was something that could EXACTLY nail this sound. Definitely a Lexicon Concert Hall running in there. I set up a Logic project that nails this sound almost exactly, using the Dirty Hall algorithm in VVV.

Sean Costello

[lacandon]

For me the Uad 140 plate,SKnote Neckplace ,SK Verbtone and The Relab Lx 480 they are just so smooth and nice !

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

Anyway, my favourite non - valhalla verb is Verbtone by http://www.sknote.it/Verbtone.htm

Nothing, not even a real Lexicon box comes close to this. It's juicy. No presets. Whatever. It's an EMT 140 plate clone irc.

But maybe i got that wrong too.

Jesus, Verbtone is the best ever reverb i ever heard in my life.

I'm also a BIG fan of Verbtone. It's a plate reverb simulation, but I don't think it's specifically a 140. It sounds a lot more like the real plate verbs you hear on classic recordings than the UAD Plate 140 plugin. Verbtone actually sounds like audio passing through a metal plate versus a plate-like algorithm. I think Quinto said somewhere that it's a physically modeled plate, which probably accounts for why it sounds real. The problem though is the latency. That plugin just needs too much latency. Quinto has said he plans on taking another stab at Verbtone to address the latency and bugs, but it seems like he's got a ton of stuff on his plate (no pun intended) so I'm not holding my breath.

[vastarray]

D16 Toraverb has unique sound. There's something unnaturally pure about it that I really love.

[codec_spurt]

I'm also a BIG fan of Verbtone. It's a plate reverb simulation, but I don't think it's specifically a 140. It sounds a lot more like the real plate verbs you hear on classic recordings than the UAD Plate 140 plugin. Verbtone actually sounds like audio passing through a metal plate versus a plate-like algorithm. I think Quinto said somewhere that it's a physically modeled plate, which probably accounts for why it sounds real. The problem though is the latency. That plugin just needs too much latency. Quinto has said he plans on taking another stab at Verbtone to address the latency and bugs, but it seems like he's got a ton of stuff on his plate (no pun intended) so I'm not holding my breath.

Yeah, the latency is a bit of a passion killer for sure. I seem to remember getting Shimmer quite close in terms of lushness. In fact Shimmer was more versatile, so would make a lot more sense for someone if they were buying their first 'verb.

In fact, I just got EOS by Audio Damage, which Sean did the algos for iirc.

And that is lush beyond belief. Never having heard it before coz there is no demo I was very pleasantly surprised. Then again the reason I got it was everyone blahing on about what amazingly deep sounds it made. Not disappointed at all so far. It would be interesting to re-visit Verbtone next to it.

I'd pay good money to get Verbtone updated no problem. It's kind of limited and kind of only for the master bus, but it's pretty out there. The only reverb that is better than the Valhalla stuff, to my ears. But then again, I'm a bit of a noob even when dialling in sounds with my VVV, so my opinions should be taken with a greater pinch of salt than normal.

[Cimbasso]

Edit: Oops, wrong thread.

[Triplefox]

Happened across this video today and was reminded of this thread.