Latest Updates (Revision 3898) for 11 u-he products - now available!

[pdxindy]

Hell, am I really defending my oppinion that I want to use a controller to control synthesizer plugins in 2015? I seem to be totally crazy. In software business you always hear this is not possible ... that is not possible. I tell you: It is possible. If not now, then let's wait.

Push is the ideal device to control synth like Diva or Hive. Bank and modulation target switiching can be made easy enough if both DAW and synth programmers would think about that. Sometimes you just dont want to look at a monitor. Just you, the sound and some knobs. But obviously the demand is too low for stuff like that and we need some more ultra fancy and ultra expensive analog gear.

Look at Ableton and Bitwig: I'm sure guys at ableton would have tell you a while ago this is not possible now and that and here and... ah .. that is also not possible. Then came maybe 12 guys from Bitwig and made nearly everything better than Ableton.

Of course it is possible... just the workflow is horrific.

You did not respond to my example with Push and Hive. If you want to edit Mod1 Env, how would you know what Mod1 Env is modulating? Get down to specifics if you want to advocate for it.

A large computer screen with a visual synth GUI gives a level of feedback of the state of the synth that is impossible with Push.

There are a handful of people in the world who can effectively play chess without seeing the board. Those are the people who could also edit via Push because you need to be able to keep the entire state of the synth (Oscs, Filters, Envs, Sequencer steps, Effects etc etc etc) clearly in mind without being able to see it.

There are two practical avenues possible.

1 - Dedicated controllers with (near) parameter per knob interfaces.
2 - Improve the ways people interact with the computer screen which would include touch screens, gestures, multi-touch and experiments like Urs is talking about.

I enjoy my Push... and I use it with Live and Bitwig. It is good for launching clips, recording clips, modulation using the controller knobs for Macros as set up per preset, some step sequencing. Excellent for composition. For sound design and preset editing? Total dead-end.

[nortle]

Hell, forget creating a sound from INIT, If I were just going to edit an existing Hive preset in Push... say Mod1 Env... I would have to navigate to the Push page for the Mod1 Env. Then I could adjust the parameters of that Env. !! Except I would have no idea what that Env was modulating !!

I Just dont get that point. I have visual feedback that tells me in the filter section: Mod ENV1 is modulating the filter. Now I go to the bank for Mod1 and change parameters. I see no reason why I should forget in these 2-3 seconds, what mod1 is modulating!?

Agree that full control of Zebra, Bazille etc. is senseless. But Hive .. Really? Then we are too different in our way of working with the things. I really can imagine a good workflow with banks and subbanks, even the mod matrix. Of course you have to get used to the new controller workflow. But if you're not using 40 different synthesizer that should be no problem. I personally hate sitting all the time in front of the monitor as when I would use photoshop.

For sound design and preset editing? Total dead-end.

Push enables you to edit all Ableton devices. There are also popular scripts found in the Ableton community that allow you to edit EVERY parameter of the devices or just google pxt-Live. Why do you think is a need for that?

[pdxindy]

Hell, forget creating a sound from INIT, If I were just going to edit an existing Hive preset in Push... say Mod1 Env... I would have to navigate to the Push page for the Mod1 Env. Then I could adjust the parameters of that Env. !! Except I would have no idea what that Env was modulating !!

I Just dont get that point. I have visual feedback that tells me in the filter section: Mod ENV1 is modulating the filter. Now I go to the bank for Mod1 and change parameters. I see no reason why I should forget in these 2-3 seconds, what mod1 is modulating!?

You have to go check the Mod Matrix too... Mod1 Env could be modulating 7 different parameters including the filter.

I can see all 7 at one glance and have edited the Mod1 Env before someone using Push is even halfway done just checking what it is modulating. And when I edit the Mod1 Env, that frequently means I need to then make subtle adjustments to the depth knob for the modulated targets as well as the initial states of the parameters being modulated. That means lots of navigating back and forth between pages in Push to do that.

Really, it's so impractical!

Then try to edit the arp/sequencer... that is like 11 individual pages in Push... hehehehe... Come on, its a comedy!

I have Push, Live and Bitwig and configured various plugins. I'm a beta tester for Live and Push. I have explored this stuff. I've done so with the idea of improving workflow. I approached it completely open minded. I'm just reporting my results. I'll be happy if someone comes up with a way to make this stuff viable. Currently it isn't and it's not even close.

[nortle]

Then try to edit the arp/sequencer... that is like 11 individual pages in Push... hehehehe... Come on, its a comedy!

Thats the worst of all examples. The sequencer is useless on push. I'll just insert an arp device from ableton or bitwig. Its impractical yes ... At first. When you use that synth for years .. Think you can as quick without clicking, drag and drop and this and that. Just the device and you. I'd just like to have that option but it seems that it's hopeless.

Okay, i'll give up. Maybe one day we have such an universal device.

[pdxindy]

For sound design and preset editing? Total dead-end.

Push enables you to edit all Ableton devices. There are also popular scripts found in the Ableton community that allow you to edit EVERY parameter of the devices or just google pxt-Live. Why do you think is a need for that?

I have PXT-Live...

Editing from Push works fine for simple devices... ones with 4-8 parameters and maybe up to 16 which would be 2 pages. Try editing the Ableton Vocoder in Push... then try editing Operator.

Hive is relatively simple and it has 36 pages of parameters in Push and that does not include the various parameters that cannot currently be mapped.

[pdxindy]

Then try to edit the arp/sequencer... that is like 11 individual pages in Push... hehehehe... Come on, its a comedy!

Thats the worst of all examples. The sequencer is useless on push. I'll just insert an arp device from ableton or bitwig. Its impractical yes ... At first. When you use that synth for years .. Think you can as quick without clicking, drag and drop and this and that. Just the device and you. I'd just like to have that option but it seems that it's hopeless.

Okay, i'll give up. Maybe one day we have such an universal device.

I meant try to edit the arp/sequencer in Hive using Push...

Anyway, I do not believe we are going to have any sort of screen free universal device that is practical... By practical, I mean easy, fun and efficient. This is in regards to sound design of synth presets. Push works well for composition.

Touch screens are promising as are dedicated controllers. There is just no way for a universal device (that has no screen) to account for the huge diversity of synths and effects we have today.

[pdxindy]

I've been seeing some CPU spikes in ACE (3898) in Bitwig 1.3 - only with ACE, not Zebra, Diva, Bazille, or Hive

haven't checked to see if other hosts are also having spikes with ACE.

[ZeePok]

 
Sorry if this is a stupid question, but ...

no update for ZebraCM ??
 

[Urs]

 
Sorry if this is a stupid question, but ...

no update for ZebraCM ??
 

No yet. They asked us not to publicly beta test, so we're kind of stripped off our workflow... not sure how to do this properly.

[diaper@ky]

Zebra2 HZ is still my go to 1s and 0s for synthesis techniques my hardware cannot achieve.
Thanks for keeping this alive.
Didn't jump into until a year ago.

[tedlogan]

Is it just me or is Zebra behaving oddly when selecting modules - it usually brings whichever one you've selected into focus, but with this latest revision it focuses on a different module than the one I've just selected, with the one I want being off-screen. Happens with all skins I have - the two default ones and Redux.

I must be the only one having this problem. It is quite the slowdown especially when working with complex patches. The correct module will never be focused on upon selecting it, regardless of which skin or GUI size. I'm constantly scrolling up an down looking for the module I need to tweak.

A few other less important glitches I encounter:

-The GUI would stop responding visually, semi-rarely. You can still tweak and hear parameters changed, but nothing responds or changes on the GUI. Opening and closing the plugin window fixes this.
-Extremely rarely a module would not behave as expected. Once a VCF Formant filter had no effect on the generator above it. I removed it and loaded another one (VCF 2,3,4) with exactly the same parameters, working fine. This only happened once actually.
-Slowdown/lag of visuals - including the DAW's interface, like EQ8, moving pointers in XY panes etc. Only happens with Zebra as far as I know, but rare.

Live 9 latest Beta (perhaps this is causing issues...)
Zebra 3898
Windows 8.1
i7 5820k
32GB RAM
EVO 850 SSD
GTX 980ti

I should probably completely uninstall Zebra and then do a fresh install.

Either way, Zebra is still making me more than happy

EDIT - seems to be only with standard Zebra/ Doesn't happen with ZebraHZ.

[zethus909]

For sound design and preset editing? Total dead-end.

lol i totally agree with this summation...im jsut starting to use push more, and it really is best for tweaking and mixing live.......best for live techno mixing, and playing parts in and recording

Push enables you to edit all Ableton devices. There are also popular scripts found in the Ableton community that allow you to edit EVERY parameter of the devices or just google pxt-Live. Why do you think is a need for that?

ive realized that these things are just not useful...youve fgot to just use push the way itcomes stock....this the best way to get the most out of it.....the scripting and stuff is cool but not very usable uinterms of performance

[3ee]

Zebra rev 3898

Mod matrix modulation values still can't be assigned to XY controls. (seems like it dissipated from the list with these latest updates)

Used that pretty heavily with EQ controls. (+ can't make a cool dyn-eq patch within Zebrify )

[zethus909]

one thing ive noticed is that you cant assign a modmatrix modulator depth as the target of another modulator anymore....you used to be able to to do that

for example....in the matrix you assign one mod to LFO3...then the mod below that one you assign LFO4....then you could make the target of the second modmatrix the first one's mod depth..

so LFO4 could target LFO3 modmatrix depth in the modmatrix....

[Urs]

one thing ive noticed is that you cant assign a modmatrix modulator depth as the target of another modulator anymore....you used to be able to to do that

We've done some tests - while the assignment was possible in earlier versions it never did anything. That's afaik why we dropped it.

(if you have a preset that proves otherwise... send to support at u-he dot com and we'll check it out)