Vendor license policy collection

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mgw38
KVRian
1402 posts since 26 Jul, 2015 from Philadelphia

Post Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:23 pm

joe_b wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 9:29 am
If dongles are optional I will consider it user friendly, if they are mandatory I won't.
Is that a definition we can agree on?
No, there is no correlation between the authentication method and anything you could call „user friendliness“. You are confusing a personal preference with what is supposed to be an objective metric.

Max369
KVRist
116 posts since 9 Aug, 2017

Re: Vendor license policy collection

Post Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:47 pm

Some vendors like AcousticSamples and ViLabs (probably they are not alone) don't transfer licenses from one account to another though they are not against transferring the license from one ilok account to another. As a result, the license remains at the former owner's dev account. The new owner has no access to download links, and will not get updates etc if someone will not help him...

If someone asks me for VST files of product that I own and have on my account, is it legal to help this person with downloading files from my account and providing them to him?

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mgw38
KVRian
1402 posts since 26 Jul, 2015 from Philadelphia

Re: Vendor license policy collection

Post Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:05 pm

Couple of other weird licensy things:

- Initial Audio officially does not allow license transfers but in case you must they suggest to transfer licenses through an account takeover. As a result, the buyer of an Initial Audio license will have access to the invoices of the seller (including all personal data).

- iZotope allows two types of licenses (iLok and through iZotope account). But when you transfer a license, they do not really care with what you do with the iLok version of the license. I always transferred that one to the buyer as well, but I guess I could just have kept it.

- NI licenses become an absolute PITA once you have a lot of Kontakt Player libraries. Whenever an NI plugin is loaded it checks for the license and the length of that process depends on the number of NI licenses you have. It can get so slow that some DAWs will no longer be able to successfully scan NI plugins once you have a very large number of Kontakt Player libraries.

- If you want to know what real pain is, try to transfer a Wibu license. ;)

ontol
KVRian
1143 posts since 29 Jun, 2012

Re: Vendor license policy collection

Post Tue Mar 19, 2019 5:02 pm

mgw38 wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:23 pm
joe_b wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 9:29 am
If dongles are optional I will consider it user friendly, if they are mandatory I won't.
Is that a definition we can agree on?
No, there is no correlation between the authentication method and anything you could call „user friendliness“. You are confusing a personal preference with what is supposed to be an objective metric.
+1

Not to turn this into a DRM thread, but categorizing iLok as unfriendly is subjective.

I prefer iLok, and it actually increases my likelihood of purchasing from a company. Amazingly easy to go from place to place with your licenses. When I built a new rig last year, not having to re-authorize the 100+ titles was certainly user-friendly.

But I'm not trying to preach the glories of any particular method of DRM, just illustrating why it's my preference. Some like serials, others like C/R...

Including the DRM information can be helpful, but categorizing a company's license policy as unfriendly due to DRM method is certainly subjective.

To be objective, you'd need to include each company's method as people's opinions on DRM are as varied as which DAW is the best.

joe_b
KVRist
105 posts since 21 Nov, 2017

Re: Vendor license policy collection

Post Tue Mar 19, 2019 11:35 pm

mgw38 wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:23 pm
No, there is no correlation between the authentication method and anything you could call „user friendliness“. You are confusing a personal preference with what is supposed to be an objective metric.
Imho there is. Forcing a user to buy and plug an external device can never be considered user friendly. Giving users a choice though is. I understand the advantages of a hardware dongle, which is why i put it in the table.

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mgw38
KVRian
1402 posts since 26 Jul, 2015 from Philadelphia

Re: Vendor license policy collection

Post Wed Mar 20, 2019 4:37 am

joe_b wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 11:35 pm
Imho there is. Forcing a user to buy and plug an external device can never be considered user friendly. Giving users a choice though is. I understand the advantages of a hardware dongle, which is why i put it in the table.
By that logic everything we do is user unfriendly because we are forced to buy all kinds of external devices and plug them into our studio setup. ;)

But seriously, if I have a choice between an iLok license and, say, a C/R license, I will always chose the iLok because it is significantly more user friendly for the type of setup I have. You cannot extrapolate your experience to the experiences of all other users when you talk about "user friendliness". In a list like that, given that it has become sticky, you really need an objective metric. That's really all I'm saying.

joe_b
KVRist
105 posts since 21 Nov, 2017

Re: Vendor license policy collection

Post Wed Mar 20, 2019 8:24 am

mgw38 wrote:
Wed Mar 20, 2019 4:37 am
By that logic everything we do is user unfriendly because we are forced to buy all kinds of external devices and plug them into our studio setup. ;)

But seriously, if I have a choice between an iLok license and, say, a C/R license, I will always chose the iLok because it is significantly more user friendly for the type of setup I have. You cannot extrapolate your experience to the experiences of all other users when you talk about "user friendliness". In a list like that, given that it has become sticky, you really need an objective metric. That's really all I'm saying.
The thing is: I did not explicitly mention iLok as non-user friendly. iLok does offer on-machine authentication, so users have a choice. VSL, however, is not using iLok but eLicenser and does not offer a choice to authenticate on the machine. Which is why VSL got an honorable mention on the bad policy list and companies using iLok did not.

And now let's end that discussion.

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mgw38
KVRian
1402 posts since 26 Jul, 2015 from Philadelphia

Re: Vendor license policy collection

Post Wed Mar 20, 2019 10:31 am

joe_b wrote:
Wed Mar 20, 2019 8:24 am
And now let's end that discussion.
Crap, now I have to continue arguing. :lol:

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shidostrife
KVRian
568 posts since 22 Nov, 2016 from Tokyo, Japan

Re: Vendor license policy collection

Post Wed Mar 20, 2019 6:39 pm

joe_b wrote:
Wed Mar 20, 2019 8:24 am
mgw38 wrote:
Wed Mar 20, 2019 4:37 am
By that logic everything we do is user unfriendly because we are forced to buy all kinds of external devices and plug them into our studio setup. ;)

But seriously, if I have a choice between an iLok license and, say, a C/R license, I will always chose the iLok because it is significantly more user friendly for the type of setup I have. You cannot extrapolate your experience to the experiences of all other users when you talk about "user friendliness". In a list like that, given that it has become sticky, you really need an objective metric. That's really all I'm saying.
The thing is: I did not explicitly mention iLok as non-user friendly. iLok does offer on-machine authentication, so users have a choice. VSL, however, is not using iLok but eLicenser and does not offer a choice to authenticate on the machine. Which is why VSL got an honorable mention on the bad policy list and companies using iLok did not.

And now let's end that discussion.
If it's about choice, what about those companies that doesn't give you the choice to use dongle at all? Surely from the perspective of dongle lovers ( :hihi: ), THEY are not user-friendly.

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lunardigs
KVRist
359 posts since 6 Jun, 2016 from Austin, Texas

Re: Vendor license policy collection

Post Wed Mar 20, 2019 10:15 pm

iLok ... It's a fine idea, as a business model. It's also very clever. Although, it's onerous and a potential point of failure. 3rd parties have to subscribe, customers have to subscribe; they're in the middle of all that business. Ugh.
If I were a plugin developer, I wouldn't adopt iLok as a DRM solution. Yes, I appreciate the problems iLok solves. Yet, middle-man like this cut into margins and who ultimately pays for that?--the customer, of course. Plus, the potential for software to break due to a variety of issues which could occur to the iLok device ...
Yet, that said, I'd never demand a plugin developer drop iLok, or give us an alternate option; they can do whatever they want--and so will I. I'll avoid any vendor who obligates iLok.

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dionenoid
KVRist
100 posts since 3 Jan, 2019

Re: Vendor license policy collection

Post Wed Mar 27, 2019 6:25 am

Does anyone know what the license transfer policy is for Antares ? Thinking of selling my Avox 4 bundle but can't find any info at their website, altho i saw some people selling Antares plug-ins...

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hhuang9611
KVRian
560 posts since 1 Mar, 2018 from USA

Re: Vendor license policy collection

Post Tue Apr 02, 2019 9:58 pm

Just find out my lexicon PCM total Bundle is NFR. But I don't see anything prohibits transfer on their website...
Trance, Trance Is Life

zooterman
KVRist
108 posts since 13 Jul, 2018

Re: Vendor license policy collection

Post Tue Apr 23, 2019 12:07 am

Does HOFA allow license transfers to other users?

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