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Scotty wrote: Sat Jan 16, 2021 5:17 pm Vojtech I am wondering if you have done any performance efficiency tests with the m1 processor as it pertains to the recent update? Specifically are you finding that the M1 processor is surprising in any way in terms of what your end users might expect when running your plugins (good, bad or somewhere in-between) . Poorly worded but I think you get the gist.
I'm afraid not really. I only have the development thingy here, which is essentially the CPU from newest iPad afaik, and it's very slow, like at least 50% slower (single core) than the i7 MBPro 2018 I have here. I also checked some actual reviews online, where a bit unbiased people responded what was pretty clear - it's all a propaganda as usual and that part that MB M1 is faster than 90% PCs (or was it 99?) is especially outrageous and classic Apple nonsense (in this case it is technically a lie, but I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings here :D ).
On the other hand, I think it is a start. Perhaps some propaganda was needed for the world to start "doing something", who knows. Right now, it is clear that M1 isn't anything special, but future versions have a potential to be, since x86 is kinda stuck in increasing number of cores and not much else is happening. My guess is that it will take a few years for Apple to match the performance and perhaps then things are going to shift away from x86. From what I heard the power consumption is great though and it is really silent. Though my Asus Zenbook Pro Duo is like superfast and somehow it is silent too, though it has like 4x lower battery power :D. In a way I hope world would switch towards a more "power friendly" platform.
Vojtech
MeldaProduction MSoundFactory MDrummer MCompleteBundle The best plugins in the world :D

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How reliable is benchmark?
I’m getting half as bad numbers native with m1 compated to intel i7 mini, but real world performance on everything else just doesnt coincide with that. I.e with most plugins, i get better numbers on m1 with rosetta than on my i7 mini natively.
Unfortunately my mini is now wiped and will be with new owner in an hour :(
But melda benchmark numbers simply dont correspond with real life. Real life is actually more close to propaganda lol.

I have noticed that some plugins native performance is WORSE compared to rosetta (spire) while some are obviously better (fabfilter).
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MeldaProduction wrote: Sat Jan 16, 2021 5:32 pm
I'm afraid not really. I only have the development thingy here, which is essentially the CPU from newest iPad afaik, and it's very slow, like at least 50% slower (single core) than the i7 MBPro 2018 I have here. I also checked some actual reviews online, where a bit unbiased people responded what was pretty clear - it's all a propaganda as usual and that part that MB M1 is faster than 90% PCs (or was it 99?) is especially outrageous and classic Apple nonsense (in this case it is technically a lie, but I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings here :D ).
On the other hand, I think it is a start. Perhaps some propaganda was needed for the world to start "doing something", who knows. Right now, it is clear that M1 isn't anything special, but future versions have a potential to be, since x86 is kinda stuck in increasing number of cores and not much else is happening. My guess is that it will take a few years for Apple to match the performance and perhaps then things are going to shift away from x86. From what I heard the power consumption is great though and it is really silent. Though my Asus Zenbook Pro Duo is like superfast and somehow it is silent too, though it has like 4x lower battery power :D. In a way I hope world would switch towards a more "power friendly" platform.

Thanks for that observations! I got a Macbook Air M1 because of this hype and I don't regret it, just because of the great battery performance. In terms auf Audio power I think it really is hype. I made some tests against my I5 Macbook 2019 and first I had a third plus of headroom, just comparing the same buffersettings...
When I looked at the milliseconds delay shown in reaper I saw, that the M1 had a bit more latency, so I set the buffers to match the latency in milliseconds, not the samples in buffer.
... and guess what: Performance became nearly IDENTICAL. Even my old I7 Lenovo 530T was able to do the same tracks calculated with the same latency. It may be a bit slower, but we're talking about 10-15 percent maybe.
I think these are great values for the 1000€ m1 laptop, but not gamechanging (for battery performance it IS gamechanging)... and I did some videorendering too and I think it was very very very fast with that. I did no direct comparison, so I'm not sure if I missed something, but I bet it is much faster with video rendering.

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Well in logic my experience is different, and latency is tiny bit lower on m1 via UFX+.
I stress tested spire recently and got 40% more track count on native.
Via rosetta, i7 6-core mini and M1 macbook were identical, but mini was running 100 degrees and 5000rpm, m1 was running 1500rpm.

And even urs wrote that the numbers are impressive.

Air isn’t cooled, fan does come on in the mbp when doing audio.

I dont know if logic is simply better optimized but the hype proved to be real here.

The i5 13” quad i had doesnt even come close.

Results were even more staggering and smaller buffers
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Would be interesting, if you download M1 optimized reaper testversion (its sooo tiny as download and install).
I just put random MSoundfactory instruments in and tried to get near 100% CPU or without dropouts.
I was using a babyface pro, but that shouldn't matter.
I'd like to share my testfile and we could compare it directly. Would be soooo interesting.
The fanless Air shouldn't be the problem, because all tests say, that fans come in after 10 minutes high processing...
Could you send me your testfile? (I have logic) We could just use Melda plugins & effects!

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Do you allready run optimized (beta?) Uhe plugins? I read that too and after that I did my tests...

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No :(
Supposedly soon starting with Hive. Right now FabFilter, Melda, RevealSound and Fuse Audio Labs are the only i have native.

I'll get reaper and try a few things, i'll also try Melda. I only have FX (12 of them)
I'm sorry i didn't try running some Melda test runs on my Intel i7 before i sold it, because the built-in benchmarks show worse performance via both native and rosetta, pretty much all other plugins were running better on M1 even via rosetta
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Ah, ok, so I did the wrong tests :-).

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hm, i don't get any more tracks with Native builds vs Rosetta with Melda, in fact, some built in benchmarks show better results for Rosetta than native builds (?!). (See screenshot, MTransformer).
Real world results coincide.

The first Spire build on ARM was broken. When i did the first test for spire at 512 in logic, i got these results:
6-core i7 Mini: 28 tracks (100 degress, 4500RPM)
M1 Rosetta: 28 tracks (75 degrees, 0rpm)
M1 Native: 20 tracks (80 degrees, 1200rpm)

When I wrote to Reveal Sound that this doesn't look right they sent me another version, which allowed me to get 42 tracks in the same project with the Native build, without fans spinning up!! That's 40% performance increase.

I just don't see how rosetta could possible offer better performance than a native build, there's simply no logic to that. It should at least be better for the lack of Rosetta overhead.
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Hard to say really. On x86 platform there are hell of a lot of optimizations, which however cannot be translated to arm, but that wouldn't explain it. Maybe the compiler doesn't produce the optimal code, maybe the cacheline size, it's anyone's guess really. I think it will take many months perhaps years before things will become "stable".
Vojtech
MeldaProduction MSoundFactory MDrummer MCompleteBundle The best plugins in the world :D

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MeldaProduction wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 5:26 pm On x86 platform there are hell of a lot of optimizations, which however cannot be translated to arm,
So that was my latest thought yesterday: I bet Meldas Plugins are so highly optimized on x86 that there is nothing left to squeeze out? I remember there once were different versions of reaper online made with different compilers and they had different performance results...
I still did't test uhe etc. Yes, this is all so new to us, lets take the time it needs.

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