U-he ACE!

[PaulSC]

I think that the number of cables needed to wire up a patch as simple as the default patch would be rather confusing.

Agree. Replacing labels is the way to go IMO.

+1

Yes, this is consistent with what I was proposing several pages earlier (just "graying out" the default labels when a different connection is made -- but changing the labels seems even better)

[OHESSIX]

Really great Plugin !!!!

But: Why not midicontrol for ADSR 1&2?

[ThomasHelzle]

I personally still don't see the problems with a button to disable internal pre-wiring. Why is it either or?

Cheers,

Thomas Helzle

[Breeze]

I personally would love to have a button on top of the UI to disable ALL internal connections between modules and explore the possibilities from a really neutral point. If the knob-names would change to something neutral at the same time, it would be perfect.

There were many things that I was initially bothered with: lack of clarity, the inability to turn off stages, the default routing, only 2 Multiples, the limitations of simple ADSR envelopes, etc... and almost every time I wanted to post an observation (I did once and it was for an undocumented but implemented feature... this is still a prerelease!) it occurred to me that the possibilities of what was already there were astronomical and that the fundamental nature of any modular synth makes it virtually impossible to forecast everything.

That's the magic of it. With modular synths, the principle is that you can create these complex beasts where the routing becomes so complex you can't tell what's what anymore. In that way it's similar to programming where only the very rarest geniuses can visualize thousands of lines of code in their minds and can pinpoint what is doing what at any given moment. Ace is quite simple in that context, and yet it's still complex enough for most of us to lose track of what's going on!

When posting comments about a synth, I waver between two perspectives:
1.The synth is what it is, and I work within the bounds defined by the author's concepts.
2. I can throw all kinds of ideas at the author for adapting the synth to what I'd like to see it do.

After using Ace for a week and experiencing how much can already be done with what's there, I have a tendency to adopt the former, and let Urs worry about getting it all to work properly.

However, since I'm here, my one request would be to have two distinct volumes in the Mix section for Osc 1 & 2, as opposed to the balance knob as currently implemented.

[ThomasHelzle]

Breeze: So my problem is, that I AM a programmer?
Cool

Cheers,

Thomas Helzle

[pdxindy]

Hmmm, I don't see it that way.

I see all the people who fire up ACE, press a key and then... nothing.

I would estimate that about 2 thirds of now happy ACE users wouldn't even have given it a spin unless there was any internal connection set up. Another good bunch, maybe a fifth would have sent an email with a bug report ("doesn't make sound"). I'm even pretty sure that these are conservative estimates. That said, I'm very sure that a non-wired version of ACE wouldn't sell more than 50 copies

I am however working on a concept to display different labels when a cable is plugged in, maybe for an update early next year

Cheers,

Urs

Perhaps there could be an option to display the cables for the default wiring?

[Breeze]

Breeze: So my problem is, that I AM a programmer?
Cool

Cheers,

Thomas Helzle

I guess my problem is that I'm mostly NOT!

I like the idea of wiring up something monstrous and have the whole be much greater than the sum of its parts, with unexpected behaviors, both good and bad... a kind of semi-organic machine that responds to my pokes and prods in both expected and unexpected ways.

Some would call it a Frankenstein complex.

Beyond the typical classical melodic/harmonic pop use of modulars, there is a whole class of textural composers who used them for purely textural exploration, where every button and knob was an opportunity to discover something new and unexpected. I think it was Laurie Spiegel who expressed how the old modulars were really unstable and unpredictable beasts and would sometimes create something so unique that unless it was recorded, it could never be duplicated. Something in me likes the idea of an endless unpredictable flow of novelty.

I'm way off topic... sorry!

[Echoes in the Attic]

I'm definitely glad it's hard-wired to start. Like the 2600 or MS-20. But I do agree that's strange to see labels that no longer apply once an alternate modulator has been connected. Cool that that's being thought about.

[Breeze]

Thomas, I think my comments went beyond the context. Sorry. Maybe I just needed to see myself talk...

Since only one source can tie to a destination, it makes perfect sense for the destination label to reflect the actual source; the way it is now is misleading.

+1

[ThomasHelzle]

Breeze, no worries, I liked your comments
I am all for heavy tweaking and all things you said, but still I think being ABLE to disable all the internal connections with a button wouldn't work against that in any way.

But I'm not arguing, I just wanted to give my first impressions and was interested in the reason why ACE is as it is, since I found it counterintuitive.

Cheers,

Thomas Helzle

[Urs]

But I do agree that's strange to see labels that no longer apply once an alternate modulator has been connected.

The labels (or icons...) don't change on an ARP 2600 hardware, so I found it rather disturbing to even think of changing labels

[xh3rv]

I do agree that the default routing and wasn't _immediately_ obvious, but I don't feel like it took much time to get familiar with it. I got to a point of thinking in terms of deviations from the default wiring, which feels really fast. ACE is much faster than Bazillle, and the default wiring is well thought-out. I'm assuming that the full Berlin Modular package will have a range of interfaces from very quick to very complex, and that ACE is the fast one /shrug.

[Breeze]

But I do agree that's strange to see labels that no longer apply once an alternate modulator has been connected.

The labels (or icons...) don't change on an ARP 2600 hardware, so I found it rather disturbing to even think of changing labels

I would think that making a hardware modular change it's labels to reflect its connection source is several orders of complexity greater than in a virtual synth where only one source can be connected to an input. But what do I know...



Honestly it's not that important to me, since you can just follow the wire and Ace isn't that complex. One simple solution would be to black-out or grey-out the label once something else connects to that input. That would make it clear something else is driving it.

[Echoes in the Attic]

But I do agree that's strange to see labels that no longer apply once an alternate modulator has been connected.

The labels (or icons...) don't change on an ARP 2600 hardware, so I found it rather disturbing to even think of changing labels

lol. good point.

I guess I should say it's strange to see a label that no longer applies, on a [software synthesizer which isn't emulating a specific hardware synth]. Only because the labels on ACE are nice and clear and stand out much better than the labels on an ARP2600, especially an emulation of one.

[rob_lee]

looking forward to the official release doing final audio demo today

cheers

rob