Is there any synth that can do roland's Saw PWM?
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- KVRian
- 1461 posts since 26 Jun, 2002 from London, UK
Is this close enough?:
Top is DUNE3, middle is Redominator, bottom is an overlay of the two (DUNE3 in cyan, Redominator in magenta).
Top is DUNE3, middle is Redominator, bottom is an overlay of the two (DUNE3 in cyan, Redominator in magenta).
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Wavetables for DUNE2/3, Blofeld, IL Harmor, Hive and Serum etc: http://charlesdickens.neocities.org/
£10 for lifetime updates including wavetable editor for Windows.
Music: https://soundcloud.com/markholt
£10 for lifetime updates including wavetable editor for Windows.
Music: https://soundcloud.com/markholt
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gentleclockdivider gentleclockdivider https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=203660
- KVRAF
- 6114 posts since 22 Mar, 2009 from gent
lol , that's the other alpha juno waveform which doesn't do pulse width
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Soul calibrating ..frequencies
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- KVRian
- 1461 posts since 26 Jun, 2002 from London, UK
Which one are we talking about?gentleclockdivider wrote: ↑Thu Jan 07, 2021 9:16 pm lol , that's the other alpha juno waveform ( sort of )
Wavetables for DUNE2/3, Blofeld, IL Harmor, Hive and Serum etc: http://charlesdickens.neocities.org/
£10 for lifetime updates including wavetable editor for Windows.
Music: https://soundcloud.com/markholt
£10 for lifetime updates including wavetable editor for Windows.
Music: https://soundcloud.com/markholt
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gentleclockdivider gentleclockdivider https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=203660
- KVRAF
- 6114 posts since 22 Mar, 2009 from gent
- Banned
- 3564 posts since 22 Aug, 2019
Instincts trained by real pulse signals
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- KVRian
- 1461 posts since 26 Jun, 2002 from London, UK
This?
Subtle differences are due to filter settings I think.
Subtle differences are due to filter settings I think.
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Wavetables for DUNE2/3, Blofeld, IL Harmor, Hive and Serum etc: http://charlesdickens.neocities.org/
£10 for lifetime updates including wavetable editor for Windows.
Music: https://soundcloud.com/markholt
£10 for lifetime updates including wavetable editor for Windows.
Music: https://soundcloud.com/markholt
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gentleclockdivider gentleclockdivider https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=203660
- KVRAF
- 6114 posts since 22 Mar, 2009 from gent
You can’t really do the juno formant osc in dune 3 because the unipolar saw has to be the sync master .
It also amplitude modulates the square waveform , iow the saw is not audible it does a windowing function on the square .
Or you could use a clipper to get rid of the negative portion of the saw .
Will try tomorow and build it in reaktor .
It also amplitude modulates the square waveform , iow the saw is not audible it does a windowing function on the square .
Or you could use a clipper to get rid of the negative portion of the saw .
Will try tomorow and build it in reaktor .
Eyeball exchanging
Soul calibrating ..frequencies
Soul calibrating ..frequencies
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- KVRian
- 1461 posts since 26 Jun, 2002 from London, UK
That's exactly what I've done in DUNE3. I've used a unipolar saw, which is curved upwards (using the wavetable equation editor), to amplitude modulate the square waveform. It also has the unipolar saw added to the amplitude modulated square.gentleclockdivider wrote: ↑Thu Jan 07, 2021 9:47 pm You can’t really do the juno formant osc in dune 3 because the unipolar saw has to be the sync master .
It also amplitude modulates the square waveform , iow the saw is not audible it does a windowing function on the square .
Or you could use a clipper to get rid of the negative portion of the saw .
Will try tomorow and build it in reaktor .
This was the formula that I used for the unipolar saw: (0.5*x+0.5)^0.75 (for x from -1 to +1).
Wavetables for DUNE2/3, Blofeld, IL Harmor, Hive and Serum etc: http://charlesdickens.neocities.org/
£10 for lifetime updates including wavetable editor for Windows.
Music: https://soundcloud.com/markholt
£10 for lifetime updates including wavetable editor for Windows.
Music: https://soundcloud.com/markholt
- KVRAF
- 12555 posts since 7 Dec, 2004
You won't be able to produce the same outputs because amplitude modulation will create aliases. This would require a similar ultra-high sampling rate as the juno synthesizers use (~1.536 MHz). As a point of reference, this would be 48k * 32x oversampled.
Note that the juno synthesizers produce an entirely digital pulse wave which is the frequency source for the oscillator waveforms. There are no "alias" harmonics because the harmonics of a pulse waveform are perfect. So long as the "clock" frequency (whatever MHz) is divided by whole integers (2, 3, 4, ...) and high enough frequency to start with, this provides reasonable frequency precision without aliased harmonics despite being fully digital/discrete.
Note that the juno synthesizers produce an entirely digital pulse wave which is the frequency source for the oscillator waveforms. There are no "alias" harmonics because the harmonics of a pulse waveform are perfect. So long as the "clock" frequency (whatever MHz) is divided by whole integers (2, 3, 4, ...) and high enough frequency to start with, this provides reasonable frequency precision without aliased harmonics despite being fully digital/discrete.
Free plug-ins for Windows, MacOS and Linux. Xhip Synthesizer v8.0 and Xhip Effects Bundle v6.7.
The coder's credo: We believe our work is neither clever nor difficult; it is done because we thought it would be easy.
Work less; get more done.
The coder's credo: We believe our work is neither clever nor difficult; it is done because we thought it would be easy.
Work less; get more done.
- KVRAF
- 12555 posts since 7 Dec, 2004
Please see here: viewtopic.php?p=5875016#p5875016
The easiest way to synthesize these waveforms in software is almost definitely the "windowed-sinc impulse convolution"/"minBLEP" technique or a related technique.
In these we take primitive shapes (edge = zero order, line = 1st order, parabolic curve = 2nd order, ...) and "draw" the segments directly. On each "point" between segments we insert FIR filter kernels/impulses and negate the naive step to anti-alias the result. This produces close to ideal output, although it is moderately complex to implement.
The easiest way to synthesize these waveforms in software is almost definitely the "windowed-sinc impulse convolution"/"minBLEP" technique or a related technique.
In these we take primitive shapes (edge = zero order, line = 1st order, parabolic curve = 2nd order, ...) and "draw" the segments directly. On each "point" between segments we insert FIR filter kernels/impulses and negate the naive step to anti-alias the result. This produces close to ideal output, although it is moderately complex to implement.
Free plug-ins for Windows, MacOS and Linux. Xhip Synthesizer v8.0 and Xhip Effects Bundle v6.7.
The coder's credo: We believe our work is neither clever nor difficult; it is done because we thought it would be easy.
Work less; get more done.
The coder's credo: We believe our work is neither clever nor difficult; it is done because we thought it would be easy.
Work less; get more done.
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- KVRAF
- 3089 posts since 4 May, 2012
So not like this:
Which is what I would think of for PWM of a sawtooth - and also how PWM could be applied to any waveform when reading from a wavetable.
But more like this:
(central line is zero)
Which is this:
When the square wave is running at a multiple of the sawtooth.
I'm presuming that the output saw is bipolar. And I missed out the square sub but can see how that would work to further change the tone and output shape. Are independent controls given for the sub PWM or is that synced to the same PWM parameter?
As you can see, these will happily alias as the square was created from a simple logic test and neither waveforms are filtered - so the vertical edge is hard (and invisible) - effectively, the value jumps from one value to the next with no interpolation.
For pure visual entertainment - and because it might help some to understand how bipolar waveforms can invert a portion of an enveloped waveform if they are not scaled and shifted into a unipolar form...
Here is a unipolar saw enveloping a bipolar square:
And a bipolar saw enveloping a bipolar square:
Which is what I would think of for PWM of a sawtooth - and also how PWM could be applied to any waveform when reading from a wavetable.
But more like this:
(central line is zero)
Which is this:
When the square wave is running at a multiple of the sawtooth.
I'm presuming that the output saw is bipolar. And I missed out the square sub but can see how that would work to further change the tone and output shape. Are independent controls given for the sub PWM or is that synced to the same PWM parameter?
As you can see, these will happily alias as the square was created from a simple logic test and neither waveforms are filtered - so the vertical edge is hard (and invisible) - effectively, the value jumps from one value to the next with no interpolation.
For pure visual entertainment - and because it might help some to understand how bipolar waveforms can invert a portion of an enveloped waveform if they are not scaled and shifted into a unipolar form...
Here is a unipolar saw enveloping a bipolar square:
And a bipolar saw enveloping a bipolar square:
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gentleclockdivider gentleclockdivider https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=203660
- KVRAF
- 6114 posts since 22 Mar, 2009 from gent
First animation is used in phase distortion , distorting ramp- phasor reading cosine from look up.
Eyeball exchanging
Soul calibrating ..frequencies
Soul calibrating ..frequencies